When America Went Crazy

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America lost its mind 146 years ago and hasn’t been the same since. Or rather, it’s been a different country ever since.

A psychotic, self-referential, duplicitous country – largely ignorant of its own history and convinced of its messianic role in world affairs. A country not merely content to live – and let live. But one determined to to force others – everyone – to live its way.

At bayonet point, if need be,

It all goes back to the events of 1861-1865. The struggle for Southern independence, which the modern histories dishonestly – not merely mistakenly – call the “Civil War.”

Which it was not.

The Southern states had no desire to dominate the Northern states, nor to control the government of the North. (Which is what the “federal” government had become by 1861, as the Northern states and Northern corporatist cartels controlled it; Lincoln was the front man for these corporatist interests – a shyster lawyer and born grifter who would do anything – to anyone – in the service of his paymasters.)

No, the Southern states simply wished to exercise that right which the American colonists themselves had exercised in 1776 (and which some Northern states had themselves threatened to exercise on prior occasions, for similar reasons). The right to withdraw from the voluntary union entered into by each sovereign state at the time of the ratification of the federal Constitution. The motives were no different – and no less honorable or legitimate: The Southern states, like the American colonies, had come to regard the central authority as distant, unrepresentative and increasingly tyrannical. It no longer served their interests. It no longer represented them. And to paraphrase the author of the original Declaration of Independence, when a government no longer operates in the best interests of the people as they see those interests; when it no longer represents them; and when its actions evince a systematic effort to subjugate them, when other remedies have not proved fruitful, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish the government – and start over.

This is what we celebrate on July 4th but what we also (in typically demented/ignorant/hypocritical American fashion) excoriate the Southern states for having done.

This was the Southern conception of “consent of the governed” – the same one held by the American revolutionaries – and the same one eradicated by the victory of the North over the South.

Since that unlucky event, there has been no recourse, no escape from Washington’s self-proclaimed, self-defined, self-interpreted and increasingly unlimited authority. We the People are not governed by consent but by force. This fact is too obvious to require extensive elaboration, yet many continue to believe we are “free” because we have “democracy” – that is, we may vote. But we do not have a choice. There is no freedom option. Just Government X (Republican) or Government Y (Democrat). This duopoly is far more subtle – and thus, far more effective – than the obvious single-party tyrannies of the past. But in fact we do have a single ruling elite – and so, no real choice – if your choice is liberty.

Lincoln – the ur American tyrant who set the stage for the blood-soaked Deciders to come – was the first to twist plain English and the meaning of the American Revolution into their dark matter opposites.

“Consent of the governed” became somehow a consolidated federal leviathan from which there is no appeal or escape. The consent of the Southern people (and thus, all Americans) trampled underfoot, to be kept forevermore in a forced union, like a bad marriage – at bayonet point.

“Republican” government – that is, delineated (and thus, inherently limited) powers became “democracy” – open-ended, unlimited mob rule, via the vote – administered by millions of petty tyrants from the DMV to the TSA to EPA to the IRS.

From this sprang the ends-justify-the-means (any means) rationales that have been used to abrogate every single formerly sacred right that the Bill of Rights was written explicitly to declare and protect.

And it was Lincoln and his crew – including war criminals such as Sheridan and Sherman (who would have made fine corps commanders in Hitler’s Waffen SS or Stalin’s Red Army) that gave life to the American Mission, the subjugation of the world itself.

Not merely consolidation and uniformity. A conviction that there is only one morally right way to live – the Yankee (corporatist/empire) way – and it must be brought to every corner of the Earth, by any means necessary.

There is a meaningful line in the Clint Eastwood movie, The Outlaw Josey Wales. A union officer is confronted by a tired scout who admonishes him that the war is over; that it is time to stop the carnage. To let people be. The officer replies, “There ain’t no end to doin’ right.” In this you can hear the future echos of George W. Bush – or Barack Obama. From Iraq to Libya to main street, USA – there ain’t no end to doin’ right.

The orthodox histories pass over all this, touting instead the morally righteous crusade of the North to free the slaves and help the Black Man. Except of course the North did no such thing. Not only was slavery protected in the North and Northern-held territories until after the war was over (in other words, for nearly two years after the so-called Emancipation Proclamation of 1863) but the Northern populace would have revolted if Lincoln had touted his determination to subjugate the South – to “save the union” – as a crusade to free the black man. Not only was Lincoln himself a virulent racist (and a founding member of the Illinois “back to Africa” movement) but so was the North, which saw free blacks as threat to free white labor and which had “black codes” every bit – and often more – brutal than the black codes students are endlessly lectured about as being a Southern exclusive.

But pay no mind to that man behind the curtain. The war was about saving democracy and the consent of the governed. America is righteous. Let freedom ring.

Even though – as singer Merle Haggard put it – the average American has less real freedom today than he had as a parolee back in 1969.

Until the American people recover their senses the American consolidated Empire will only grow more oppressive, more and more openly brutal.

A people incapable of leaving their neighbors alone cannot be expected to leave the world alone.

Cloverism was born at Appomatox.

It is up to us to see it strangled.

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56 COMMENTS

  1. I agree with your article. Just one small nit to pick. I believe that your quote from the Josey Wales movie is “Doin’ right aint got no end.” This is said by the same character who, when crossing the river under fire said, (while standing at the back of the ferry) “He can’t get us all, the most he can do is get one or two up front.” Needless to say, this chicken hawk statement did not endear him the the soldiers standing “up front”.

  2. Eric,
    After having doubts about Lincoln surface in my mind 5 years ago, I read “The Real Lincoln” by Thomas DiLorenzo and had my eyes wide opened. I am embarrassed by what the country has become. Being in my upper fifties, I do not know if I will see the turn around and if I knew then what I know now I would not bring children into this hell on earth.

    • Hi Drsteve,

      Welcome!

      I had a similar experience. Most Americans’ view of the war (and of Lincoln) is colored by the “victor’s history” they are fed from grade school through college and beyond. Getting at the truth requires a deliberate non-conformist suspicion of whatever fables the government feeds us, or some lucky stumbling into it.

      Either way, more and more Americans are awakening. I hope there is still time to turn things around.

  3. Great job Eric. I have enjoyed your excellent and accurate stuff on cars and this venture into the true history of this nation is icing on the cake.

    True Cloverites probably can’t be reached but for honest men and women who are willing to research these things themselves here are some excellent histories; the first four are by “Copperheads” the last one by Southerners:

    WHEN IN THE COURSE OF HUMAN EVENTS – Charles Adams
    EMANCIPATING SLAVES; ENSLAVING FREE MEN – Jeffrey Rogers Hummel
    THE REAL LINCOLN – Tom DiLorenzo
    AMERICA’S CAESAR – Greg Loren Durand

    THE SOUTH WAS RIGHT – The Kennedy Brothers

    “The fact is that the average man’s love of liberty is nine-tenths imaginary, exactly like his love of sense, justice and truth. He is not actually happy when free; he is uncomfortable, a bit alarmed, and intolerably lonely. Liberty is not a thing for the great masses of men. It is the exclusive possession of a small and disreputable minority, like knowledge, courage and honor. It takes a special sort of man to understand and enjoy liberty–and he is usually an outlaw in democratic societies.” — H.L. Mencken, Baltimore Evening Sun, Feb. 12, 1923

    • Hi Wes,

      Thanks!

      DiLorenzo’s books are excellent. Great reads and meticulously backed up by facts that show what the War was fundamentally about. If Americans could somehow relearn their history – and learn the truth about the War – it would be a major reawakening. And a big step toward recovering our liberties.

      Incidentally: Did you know that Hitler was an admirer of Lincoln? He write approvingly of the consolidated super-state that was Lincoln’s main goal.

  4. ….umm,…Clover….there are some facts on the table,…sorry if I’m a litle slow, but I’m brain-damaged and only 1/4 of my brain functions properly,…so if my facts are not pertinent,
    …I’d love to know why…? It’s so hard to know when your brain malfunctions,….you know, discerning reality? Perhaps I am misinformed about all those activites regarding our federal government,..but I was sure they had put smallpox in native americans blankets and killed millions of the folks who occupied the land before the white folk, ..but mabe I’m confused?

    It is probably the same issue, you know my memory and all, but didn’t our government kill millions at Hiroshima & Nagasaki when historic documents show that Japan was trying to surrender for a year prior to the atomic blasts?,……again, maybe I’m just confused about the definition of “brutality”.

    Regards,

    RJ O’Guillory

  5. You traitors are full of bullshit. There was only ONE state right the southern traitors were interested in. That was the right to own another person. When you own another person, when you take away their liberty, you give away your own as well. That, pure and simple, was what that war was about. All the other overly prideful, arrogant southern nonsense is a smokescreen for that one fact. It speaks volumes about the mentality of the south, that every southern state is held afloat by federal money; military bases, Nasa, military contractors, outright welfare. The south has never been willing to stand on its own feet. When it has tried it has failed. Descendants of spoiled English aristocrats started and lead the south. The rest of us pay a price to this day. And if course, there are still those who see no wrong in slavery because they believe black people are not human. Those people will reap a whirlwind. It is too damn bad the rest of us have to be caught in it. As a wise man once said “You lost, get over it”

    • Really?

      If so then why did Lincoln promise to amend the Constitution to preserve slavery forever – provided the South accepted the northern tariffs and remained in the union?

      If so, why did Lincoln not free the slaves in the North? (The Emancipation Proclamation was directed at the seceded Southern states only.)

      If so, why did Northern public opinion massively oppose fighting the war to “free the slaves” (but supported “saving the union”)?

      If so, why did most Northern states have extremely harsh “black codes”? Etc. Etc.

      The slavery issue is a bogey.

      As Tom DiLorenzo and others have pointed out, the fact is that slavery was peacefully retired in Britain and everywhere else. The war was not about slavery; it was about federal supremacy.

      Lincoln himself said so. Ever read his letter to Horace Greeley?

      “My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause”

      The only way for you to get around the above is to ignore it.

      PS: The fact that you describe those who criticize the leviathan in Washington as “traitors” speaks volumes.

      Keep on licking the hand that feeds you….

    • Can you name one other slave owning country that ended slavery through civil war?

      And Haiti doesn’t count. There, the slaves took matters into their own hands and rebelled against their masters.

      • Yes.

        And, key point: The propaganda picture is that the South was uniquely cruel to blacks while the North was an oasis of enlightenment and humanity. In fact, the North was a brutal place for blacks. Though not legally chattel, they were nonetheless routinely – legally – treated as worthless subhumans. Their legal rights were a laughingstock – and for years (decades) after the War.

        This truth undermines the Northern fairy tale that the war was about slavery – about doing right by blacks.

  6. H.L. Mencken –

    The Gettysburg speech was at once the shortest and the most famous oration in American
    history… the highest emotion reduced to a few poetical phrases. Lincoln himself never even
    remotely approached it. It is genuinely stupendous. But let us not forget that it is poetry,
    not logic; beauty, not sense. Think of the argument in it. Put it into the cold words of
    everyday. The doctrine is simply this: that the Union soldiers who died at Gettysburg
    sacrificed their lives to the cause of self-determination – that government of the people, by
    the people, for the people, should not perish from the earth. It is difficult to imagine
    anything more untrue. The Union soldiers in the battle actually fought against
    self-determination; it was the Confederates who fought for the right of their people to
    govern themselves.

    • Exactly.

      And therein lies the evil genius of Lincoln. He was a gifted liar and obfuscator who would brazenly do the opposite of what his words plainly stated.

      “Save the union” – by destroying the essential thing that made it what is was: a freely entered-into compact based on the notion of consent of the governed.

  7. When America Went Crazy is well written, cogent and appreciated.

    Thank you for the simple clarity of it.

    That said, every time I see an article supporting the South’s decision to act against Northern aggression, I ask the author to consider another angle to the unseen, unreported forces that helped birth this disaster.

    Opium.

    The great sailing fleet families of the North, whose fortunes were and are every bit as leviathan as Bill Gates’, were up to their necks in the China Trade – that well worn euphemism for dealing in opium. These families today, having married, inter-married and inter inter married continue as modern America’s unseen movers and shakers behind the scenes of culture-shifts, policies, money and politics. And they remain up to their chins in the world’s most profitable business …. opium. (besides being diversified into legitimate enterprises as any good mafia would do)

    I’m not a researcher or an author. I don’t have the skills to winnow out the truth. But I keep picking at this after I came across correspondence in an unrelated text that referenced how the great cotton shipping fleets of the South were making a move to get into the opium business in Asia cir. 1830s. Just a few short years ahead of the war of Yankee aggression.

    That war of corporatist Yankee aggression begins in Washington DC, seat of war by other means …..

    … we know, historically, Legislation is used as a substitute for war.We know historically how history itself is paid for by the winners and losers cannot be heard. What forces were in play to cause the North to bend Congress to their will in punishing the South with increasingly intolerable Legislation and bureaucratic regulation?

    Follow the money.

    I’m finding more and more (albeit hard to come by) evidence that the South making tentative moves on the North’s stranglehold on the opium trade has more to do with the North’s mercantile families rising up against their counterparts in the South than possibly any thing else. We already know it wasn’t a moral crusade to free the black man. We already know how to shed light on the multitude of untruths that surround the issue of the “civil war”. Including that title, itself.

    There’s always a hidden hand lurking behind the scene – monied and powerful men protecting interests, titles and lands at risk, rice bowls someone will protect at any cost.

    In this, I’m becoming convinced that a regional power such as the “North” which would independently go to war against a nation such as China to force them to accept Yankee drug dealing to Chinese subjects would have absolutely no problem going to war against their Southern counterparts – under false pretenses – to keep their hegemony of the trade intact. The ensuing years of Legislation out of Washington that forced the South to act as it did was the designed outcome.

    Or, has the truth of Afghanistan eluded most folks?

    • …you are correct. However, it started much earlier than 10 years ago. The problem is “dual citizenship”. Approximately 40 or so congresscritters, along with many “policy wonks” in our government hold “dual citizenship” with Israel. This can only be a disaster, as one cannot be sure where their loyalties lie.
      If I had my way, dual citizenship would be strictly prohibited. Those holding such status would be required to renounce their foreign citizenship or face mandatory deportation.
      As to Israel being our “friend”, nothing could be further from the TRUTH. Please look up the “Lavon Affair”, in which an Israeli false flag operation “blew up in their faces”…Israel’s intelligence agency attempted to bomb a U S interests section and blame it on Egypt–only one of the bombs exploded prematurely, exposing the operation.
      The”biggie” is the deliberate attack on the USS Liberty (GTR-5) in June 1967. Despite being properly identified, this ship was attacked by Israel, with full knowledge of “higher-ups” in the U S government, all the way up to Lyndon Johnson. It was expected that “all hands” would perish, giving the US and Israel an “excuse” to blame it on Egypt. When the total destruction was thwarted by the crew’s bravery, the “excuse” was that it was an “accident” and “misidentification”. It is interesting to note that help for the stricken ship was initially denied by “those at the top” in the U S government, John McCain’s “daddy” Admiral. Even the “board of inquiry” was a sham, absolving Israel of all blame…the ship was attacked in order to hide the fact that Israel’s “Six-day-war” was a preemptive attack by Israel–NOT a response to being attacked, as well as to cover up evidence of a total massacre by Israeli troops upon an Egyptian city (Deir Yassin)…
      Israel has a right to look out for itself…however, “wagging the dog” (USA) with Israel controlling U S “foreign policy” in the middle east and elsewhere, has done much harm U S interests. The US should stop being Israel’s b!tch…

      • But Israel could have never committed a genocide of the indigenous people in the area of what is now Israel without the US. It was straight up US weapons, of the best sort that allowed it to happen with full consent of obviously, too many in high places.

        When Israeli(US supplied)war planes showed up to check out the Liberty, they were waving and wagging their wings as well as the ship’s crew waving at them. When they returned with all ID gone and bombed hell out of them the crew was rightly caught off-guard. The cover-up was one of the most disgraceful things the US govt. ever did. Bureaucrats have no consciences nor morals……a requirement to rise to the top of the slop bucket.

        So….who you gonna vote for prez next time, Israel’s tweedle dee or tweedle dum? This country is nothing but rats……rats everywhere…..so says Jack Nicholson’s character in The Departed.

  8. Great piece Erio,
    once again you are spot-on with a subject that people are only now awakening to. The fact that our grade-school textbooks only gave us a small part of the story regarding the US civil war. Slavery was a part of the equation for why the war was started by Lincoln, but the biggest factor that precipitated the Norths invasion of the south was state sovereignty. The South (Southern States) DID have the right to secede from the Republic as outlined in Article 4, section 4 of the Constitution, and Lincoln had no legitimate recourse to invade the South with a military force. The reason this is so important today, is that the Federal tyrant has grown even stronger today than it was in Lincoln’s day, and the citizenry needs to be constantly reminded of the need to keep this monster under control. The way to do this is to make US citizens aware that we are a Republic, and the states retain their sovereign rights, and these rights need to be guarded from this Federal Tyranny. This is the spirit that drove brave Confederate soldiers to lay down their lives fighting the invasion from the North, not some racist defense of slavery that we have been taught to believe in our youth.

    • Sorry, but you’re wrong. Slavery may have played a small part in the southern States decision to secede, but it played no part in Lincoln’s decision to invade.

  9. Great article, during my late teenage years and into my early 20’s my brother and our buddies would watch Outlaw Josey Wales at least a couple of times a week (this was the height of the VCR age, and we had pirated a copy), we constantly exchanged quotes to each other’s amusement complete with tobacco spitting.

    The quote of Captain “Red legs” you site, is one I later realized sums up the mindset of the Yankee class (and the government in Washington) both during the war and after the war.

    But, I believe the quote is, “doing right ain’t got no end”. Growing up in a throw away section of Jefferson County, Kentucky it was easy for us dumbed down public schooled kids to quote “ain’t” and use it with a double negative to boot, it was part of our daily grammar.

  10. Dear Sir:

    Thank you very much for your article, “When America Went Crazy,” as printed in Lew Rockwell’s column. You did a fine job of succinctly expressing so many truths that the winners of this particular “war” obfuscated (and continue to do so) for posterity to worship. You rightly point out (as has Walter Williams) that the war was anything but a “civil war,” and you rightly characterize Sheridan and Sherman as the war criminals that they were in conducting armed aggression against helpless civilians.

    May I suggest one additional point? After Lincoln’s “Emancipation Proclamation” there were, in fact, desertions from the Union army because those soldiers had joined to “preserve” the Union (which did not exist as such), and NOT to fight to free slaves. Your article hinted that this might have occurred if Lincoln had announced his intention to free the black man, but this is, in fact, exactly what did happen (albeit not en masse) to the Union army.

    It is a most interesting albeit inconvenient fact that the misnamed “Emancipation Proclamation” freed not one single slave, since it held in subjugation all existing slaves in both the northern states as well as in those portions of the South already under Federal control. Europe laughed at his announcement which freed slaves over which he had no control while leaving enslaved those that he might have been able to free (technically, he would have needed legislative support, but this never served as an impediment to Emperor Lincoln.)

    Thank you again for speaking the truth so eloquently.

    George
    */:-{)=

    • Thanks, George!

      I see the first step toward recovering the sanity of this country as recovering its awareness of what happened – and why – during the War.

      You may be familiar with the works of Tom DiLorenzo (“The Real Lincoln”). If not, I recommend him. His scholarship on the subject is outstanding. If I had the means, I’d put a copy of that book into the hands of every high school student in America.

      That would be a start….

      • Yes sir, I have spoken with Tom on several occasions when we have attended events either celebrating Southern/American causes or protesting offenses by those who have no respect for truth and honesty but cherish power over others. I am a big fan of Tom DiLorenzo. If you speak to him, he will remember me as the bagpiper from NY.

      • The establishment are doing all they can to discredit him. Fortunately, for people who deal in reality, their lies are unraveling for everyone to see.

  11. Allow me to call something to your attention that very few people are aware of. As explained in the pamphlet referenced below, this also relates to why we are currently subjects of the federal government and the political duopoly.

    As you know, the Bill of Rights document is displayed in the Rotunda of the National Archives. A zoomable version of that document is provided here:
    http://www.thirty-thousand.org/pages/BoR_image_repro.htm
    Use the pull-down menu to the right of the image to zoom to each of the twelve amendments proposed therein; its text will also appear below the image.

    The very first amendment inscribed in the Bill of Rights document, “Article the first”, has never been ratified. The intended purpose of that amendment was to establish the maximum population size of congressional districts at 50,000. However, Article the first was never ratified due to an inexplicable defect in its wording that rendered it meaningless. That defect was inserted during the waning hours of the first Congress and was not in the earlier version that was passed by the House!

    If you would like to learn more about the fascinating story of Article the first, please read section 3 of “Taking Back Our Republic”. That section explains the defect in the proposed amendment and provides citations to more detailed sources of information. You can download that pamphlet from:
    http://www.thirty-thousand.org/pages/TBOR.htm.

    • I’m more and more coming around to the view that the Constitution itself is the problem – in that it set the trap via such vague and open to “interpretation” phrases as the “general welfare” and because it erected the superstructure of the centralized, leviathan state we now suffer under. That was, of course, the object of the Federalists who pushed for the adoption of the Constitution. The only reason we (well, our ancestors) briefly enjoyed the liberty promised by the Declaration and by the Revolution itself was because of Jefferson and the insistence that a Bill of Rights be included. This acted as a check for about 75 years. But then came the first Deecider (Lincoln) and the rest is, unfortunately, history.

      The necessary – essential – right of secession and its equally essential corollary, the recognition of each state’s sovereignty – were givens at the time of the Constitution’s signing. Everyone – even Hamilton – would have acknowledged both. But because these things were not explicitly laid down in the document, subsequent generations could be taught that no such things existed – and to have contempt for them, as Lincoln and his crew did.

      • I believe that problem is NOT with the Constitution, but how we have allowed it to be reinterpreted by the judiciary. This is because the Congress has failed to keep the judiciary in check. That plus our abandonment of the 9th 10th amendments.

        That notwithstanding, the solution is in the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. The loss of “Article the first” and the passage of the 17th Amendment has led to the acquisition of the federal government by powerful Special Interests (both domestic and foreign). The evidence shows that we the people can re-take control of the federal House if we can make the congressional districts small enough (as intended by “Article the first”).

        • I’m changing my position on that… I used to be very much a Constitutionalist. And I still am, if the document were – or could be – obeyed as written. But I submit that it exists now only as a figurehead and that the power of the federal government has been able to grow beyond constitutional limits to a great extent because of two factors. First, the “general welfare” clause, which has been used to justify literally anything and everything, transforming what had been a strictly limited and defined conception of federal power into an all-but-unlimited one. The phrase needs to be stricken. Second, the right of secession should have been clearly articulated. Like the individual right to possess and bear arms, the right of secession was a given at the time of the Constitution’s ratification. Even Hamilton would have conceded the point had he been asked. It was such a given for that generation that it was apparently not considered necessary to further elaborate the point in the Constitution. But it should have been – as the essential counterweight to federal usurpation that it is. If the union cannot maintain itself on the basis of voluntary affection, but only by force, then it is by definition not operating with the consent of the governed and so tyrannical.

        • But the interpretation is the trick. While the phrases meaning was well documented not to be what the courts have ruled they still ruled the way they did. The reason is they rule largely in favor of what is best for government. The founders were not dumb. As much as there is beauty in the system that prevents tyranny (largely dismantled now) there are things those who wanted centralized power put in too. There were two forces and neither was dumb. I fully believe that the modern interpretation was exactly what some people knew would happen over time as the original debates and interpretations fell away into the past.

    • BIG is the problem. Big business, big religion, big government, big medicine, big food, big marketing, big advertising, big education, big …. everything.

      I cannot meet or know my representatives even at the local level. Quidam is correct.

    • eric,

      you are on the right track. Nothing wrong with the Aticles of Confederation which we had 11 Presidents under BEFORE George washington. Not aware of that? Not part of your history books?
      Here is a little help from an old friend of mine, Stephen Kimbol Ames. Google his name AND “the US is still a British Colony” and you will see the side of US History that has been willfully supressed from you by the elite.

      http://www.peoples-rights.com/doc15England.htm

      http://www.truedemocracy.net/td13/contents.html

      Articles by Stephen Kimbol Ames

  12. So one has to have personal experience to believe the “American consolidated Empire will only grow more oppressive, more and more openly brutal”? Perhaps you should put down the Good Housekeeping and pick up a newspaper.

    • Clover cannot be reasoned with because Clover is not capable of using reason. He emotes; he cannot grasp principles (let alone apply them).

      Worse, he just doesn’t care.

      To a Clover, the Most Important Thing is safety. Just say the magic word. He doesn’t care about his own liberty/dignity – and definitely doesn’t care about yours or mine. Just that we’re “safe” – whatever that means.

      His mentality is the New American mentality, unfortunately. People such as Clover would have been loyalists during the American Revolution – and Yankees during the Civil War.

      • Give me some facts Eric. You say that I do not follow what you say. If you gave me facts maybe I could. Explain “American consolidated Empire will only grow more oppressive, more and more openly brutal”. Has anyone here been brutalized by the government? If you say that thousands are being brutalized by the government then give us the facts that make you say so. It is not too difficult backing up your statements with the reason you say them.

        We also do not live in the 1800s or 1900s for that matter. Back in the 1700s when the constitution was written they were far more severe on people that got out of line and broke the law. They were tied down in the town square and people threw things at them and hit the with sticks.

        Clover

          • Might be best to cease trying to reason with such a creature. Where I’m from, this guy would be labeled a “troll,” and ignored. After all, I’m told, that even god only helps those who help themselves.

            • Spooner, it is not too hard to reason with me. All I ask for is some facts or reasons on statements given. Is that too difficult?

              Clover

              • No, not at all! But, it seems to me, from reading these comments, that you have a flair for ignoring and/or dismissing the facts that are presented to you.
                I’ve run into folks like you before (in fact, since you all seem so alike, I’ve wondered whether you’re all not some one-in-the-same, CIA generated ‘personality’. Either way, I have quit ‘taking the bait,’ as it were.
                Tah, tah!

        • Okay,…Clover? Let’s examine your challenge….if you wish to ignore the death and destruction going back to perhaps, the Spanish American War, and dismiss the hundreds of thousands of dead Filipino folk,…we could just jump forward to Waco, Ruby Ridge, the faked Oklahoma City bombing(seismic records document two seperate explosions, one four seconds prior to the main blast),…or maybe we could just examine for a moment the thousands of deadly force, physical force behaviours that are being used in non-lethal situations by the law enforcement cartel that now helps control the american people?

          If that is not enough for you, and you wish to ignore the millions of incarcerated americans who have committed virtually victim-less “crimes”, and are subjected daily to violence and loss of their rights, perhaps we can speak of the “black sites” around the world where we are torturing people to confess to things they have no knowledge of?

          And well, if knowing that your “Supreme Court” has ok’d kidnapping and torture by the government, then I’m sure that this would not serve as a good example for you, or the fact that the president is now ordering executions of americans without due process of the law, or the right to a trial?….no, no they are not “brutalizng us”,..but, if you compare our situation to what it should be,..how the constitution is structured,….and consider the liberty that we should be afforded,….your argument is like a late term abortion,
          …ugly, sad, sadistic and it involves the loss of souls for all involved.

          Regards,

          RJ O’Guillory

          btw….if you are unaware,..they now have seismic proof that there were huge explosions in the sub-basements of the world trade towers,..17-18 seconds before the planes hit the buildings,…no,..there is no brutality there eh? Killing thousands of your own folks so that you could start an illegal war and steal oil…..? No folks, no brutality here, nothing to see, just drive on by….eyes on the corrupt road ahead!

          • Don’t forget the illegal war in Afghanistan to gain control of some of the most productive opium fields in the world.

          • Yes throw out the facts. Only show what you want to even if it is wrong.

            The terrorist bombing of the Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City on April 19, 1995, was also seismically recorded. The first seismic records looked unusual, and prompted some researchers to conclude two separate blasts -­ that is, two separate bombs ­- were involved, Wallace said. But when the Murrah Building later was demolished, the seismic record was identical, leading experts to conclude there had been a single terrorist bomb. “In some sense this is derivative, but it’s really important for providing independent constraints on what happened,” Wallace said.

            Clover

        • Eric, your website and columns rule. The writing is excellent and the logic sound. Good on ya.

          Clover,
          Just because something goes unreported on Fox News AND MSNBC does not mean it doesn’t exist. Here are some facts. The US military has bases in over 100 countries. We give billions in financial aid to dictators whose actions we claim to abhor. In many of these countries, the people would like us to leave. It is the equivalent of the Roman Empire garrisoning their faroff provinces and installing supportive governors.

          You wonder where the brutalization occurs. Being forced at gunpoint to surrender money I have earned to an organization I would not like to support is no different than the schoolyard bully taking one’s lunch money. What really gets me is that over a quarter of every dollar taken goes toward murdering people who have done me no harm. The State is nothing but brute force with the trappings of nobility and sacredness to fool the gullible. Again, no different than the schoolyard bully who can lay on the charm and sweettalk his way out when questioned or in the public gaze.

          It is very true we do not live in the 19th or 20th centuries. But your statement that people then were harsher to criminals than today because they “hit them with sticks.” Today, if you break one of the rules in the 80,000 pages of federal laws, you are locked in a cage for years at a time. While there you run the risk of rape and getting the shit kicked out of you on the reg. Which is more severe? Not to mention that the stocks were only reserved for crimes which harmed someone else. Now, you go to prison for victimless crimes. How civilized! How advanced!

          • Give me the names of people that were brutilized by the government as you say “Being forced at gunpoint to surrender money “. When was the last time someone from the government pointed a gun at you or anyone that you know to take money from you? Thanks for backing up my statements of people making things up to back up their positions. The truth does not count.

            Clover

        • Brutalized by the government? I guess you think the only “brutalizing” can be physical, but what about being made a tax slave? I just spoke with a woman in my neighborhood, she has seven kids, her “husband”, the father of those children is in jail for 30 to life – 2nd degree murder.

          The government feeds, clothes, houses, and educates those kids, not to mention her and her various boyfriends that stop by and of course her “hubby” for the rest of his life. They are all on medications rialin, etc. and one has various illnesses that need operations and expensive medical care. All this is paid for by the government/taxpayer/me.

          The government housing she lives in is new, it just got renovated, the previous occupants destroyed the place and made it unliveable so it had to be rebuilt, at taxpayer expense, so that another crew of welfare recipients can be moved in, upon which in a few years it will be destroyed and unliveable once again. When it snows the building crew clears off the walks and driveways, when it sunny, they cut the grass, if anything breaks, a maintenance man is sent out to fix it.

          Now on the other hand I have to pay for everyone of those govt supplied benefits that is FREE to this woman and her children, for my own family. I have to buy all of the food, clothes, and make a huge house payment on a house that govt policy has seen to devalue to the point where I own MORE then the value of the house.

          For medical care, none of it is free to me, I have what is considered a “good” policy with a major provider but economics of the last years have forced my employer to attach such a large yearly deductible ($4000!!) that I am reluctant to use it. Thus every prescription, every doctor visit, every medical procedure, is paid out of pocket unless I run up a huge yearly bill.

          When it snows I have to go out and shovel, when the grass needs to be cut I have to cut it, when something breaks I have to fix it or pay to have it fixed. No free bus passes for me or my family I have to own a car and pay for the gas, insurance, and repairs to keep it going.

          I don’t have SEVEN kids like her, because I have to pay for my family, so instead of having the large family I would like, I have to have a much smaller family that I can afford.

          My neighbor, who is black, gets free lunch for his kids, even though he makes more then me, why? because he is a special minority, his kid gets a scholorship that my kids are not eligible for because they are not black. Thus my government gives special priviledge to one race of people over another.

          I am BRUTALIZEZD by the government, it takes money from me to give to MILLIONS of other people so they can live a similar life style to me—-for FREE!!!! And it gives millions to other governments-China, Isreal, every african country, companies–GM, Chrysler, GE, foreigners–legal and illegal immigrants, and minorities–blacks, gays, etc, all the while insisting, INSISTING!!! that I am not paying my fair share! and that taxes should be raised.

          I am more of a slave then any group of humans that have ever lived. Nearly all my productive labor is taken from me and given to others, the little that is left over I have to use to provide the basics for me and my family.

          This government is the most unjust government in the history of mankind. It commints fraud and theft on a scale that dwarfs any other that ever existed. It enslaves millions of people as worker bees to toil for the benefit of others and while that happens there is not even the hope of breaking those chains because there are so many people out there like you that support the govt and believe the lies and enable the corruption and cruelty. I only hope and prey that there will come a day of reckoning that will enable myself and others to extract the necessary justice from people like you who deserve retribution.

        • Four years ago I was accosted by the Seattle Police Department for the crime of living next door to a man who decided after months of police and judicial ineptitude and failure to properly issue a restraining order, to meet a scary and harassing individual on his own doorstep with a revolver. SPD suddenly sprang into action and came down immediately to confiscate all of this man’s firearms.

          But it didn’t stop there. They camped out across the street for a couple days to keep an eye on the situation. I didn’t think much of this, until walking out of my apartment with my wife to go to dinner two donut-munchers came roaring across the street in their patrol car and jumped out with their hands on their pistols right as I was going into my pockets to take out my keys. AFTER asking me if I was “involved in the situation,” to which I replied “NO,” one of the officers walked over to me and gave me a full pat-down. This was once prevented by the Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution, but apparently is no longer.

          I found later that I wasn’t the only one; the cops stopped every single white male that left the building that week. If anyone on this site follows national news, this is the same Seattle Police Department that shoots woodcarvers walking down the street five times in the back then lies about the folding knife being open. Is this proof enough of brutalization for you, Clover?

        • You need to read a little Will Grigg, brother.

          You’ll get more names and examples than you could read in a week.

          But something tells me it won’t make a difference…..

  13. Thank you. Couldn’t agree more. That was the moment that we transitioned from “these” United States to “the” United States and individual liberty became effectively a government grant rather than a natural right.

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