Well, how ’bout it?
If you’ve been anywhere near a TeeVee or radio lately, you’re probably aware that the explosive devices government forces every car company to build into its cars sometimes… explode defectively. These “safety” devices send shrapnel – literally, metal shards; just like a grenade or mine – toward people’s faces at high velocity, shredding flesh and causing severe (and often, permanent) injuries.
People have had their eyes gouged out; others have merely been disfigured for life.
So far, it’s “only” a handful of people. (Isn’t it interesting the way government minimizes the mayhem it causes?) But it could be millions. Actually is millions. Because millions of cars (and trucks) built from circa the early 2000s through at least 2008 are equipped with these government mandated defective explosive devices.
But even when they’re not defective – i.e., do not spew metal fragments at high velocity toward people’s faces – air bags are still explosive devices. “Air bag” is another euphemism – typical of things government-mandated. Like IRS “customers,” for instance.
Or Social Security “contributions.”
The “air bag” (bags, actually) in your vehicle inflate explosively, via oxidation – chemical burning – which produces hot gas almost instantly. The reaction is not gentle. The unbuckled are particularly vulnerable to being mauled by not defective air bags. Part of the reason for mandatory “buckle up” laws is to limit the potential damage caused by inflating air bags – which ostensibly are there for “safety.”
Isn’t that special?
And, typical?
Government creates a danger (air bags) and then Band-Aids the danger rather than removing the danger. Or at least, leaving it up to individual people to weigh the danger for themselves. And elect to assume – or not assume the risks, according to their own best judgment.
This cuts to the bone of the issue.
While the MSM will continue to croak uproariously about the nefarious Takata Company – supplier of the defective air bags – I have yet to hear even a single croak about the government bayonets (figurative, but also quite literal; just try and say “no thanks” to anything government mandates) that forced car companies to install the damned things and so, forced people to buy the damned things.
And thereby, imposed risk on people. Threatened their safety. 
Consider: You are recovering in the hospital after having had your left eye gouged out and your face permanently ruined by a defective air bag. Would you be more or less upset had you been able to choose to buy – or not buy – the air bag when you bought your vehicle?
If you’d had the choice?
I’d be less mad, had the choice been mine. Especially since I’d have chosen not to have the air bag in my car – and thus, would still have my eye and my face would be no more disfigured than nature provided.
This applies just as squarely to not-defective air bags. People have been killed – and seriously injured – by them, too. And more and more likely will be, as they and their associated components age and degrade and begin to develop faults. Air bags have been in mass production since the ’90s, which means there are hundreds of thousands, probably millions of getting-elderly air-bag-equipped cars out there. Corroded (and loose) connections; buggy sensors. Whoops! The thing goes off for no reason at all while someone’s just driving down the road. Or does not go off at all when it should – as when the car strikes a tree at 35 MPH. 
Both have happened already. And will almost certainly happen again. Old cars don’t break down. Various parts of them do. This includes the SRS (fancy name for the air bags and relates components) system.
Such inconvenient truths are not much bandied about when air bags are discussed. We’re told endlessly of the benefits; never the risks. Or rather, we’re told we’ll accept the claimed benefits – and that our concerns about the risks (and costs) are immaterial.
Hey, it’s only our lives (and money) being played with…
Maybe it’s only a “few” such. But by what right do some people endow themselves with the authority – enforceable at gunpoint – to play Russian Roulette with other people’s lives?
Note, also, that while people injured by the defective air bags will – rightly – sue Takata (and probably also the automakers involved) no one will – or can – sue the government. Not for foisting the defective air bags on people -nor the not-defective air bags. Government decided the risks posed by air bags that work as designed are “acceptable.”
Or rather, that we accept the risks.
If you want to make an omelette…
Like the proverbial idiot child given a machine gun by negligent parents, government can endanger people with impunity. Without the specific individuals behind the various actions of the government (such as the “safety” mandates that force-feed air bags and seat belts on people, despite both presenting real-world risks as well as benefits) ever having to worry about being held accountable for the negative consequences, unintentional or otherwise, of the ukases they foist onto others.
The mindless unfeeling arrogance is astonishing. The way these apparatchiks glibly, indifferently, toy with other people’s lives, like chess men on a board. Which they’re enabled to do because there are no repercussions for so doing. It is, indeed, their royal prerogative. In the “first night” sense.
They may use us as they please.
This is the essential attribute of the monarchical worldview. That there are multiple “kings” is of no real relevance. We are ruled by thousands – even millions – of “little kings,” each of them as haughty and entitled as an ermine-draped Napoleon.
And we must submit.
Does it make you angry?
It ought to.
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Very late reply but: since you mentioned suing the government over defective airbags, that in and of itself was a slippery slope. It might reduce the quantity of “clover” mandates forced on us, but it would leave the door open for “clovers” in other ways. How would you like it if every road (that hadn’t already had this done) was rebuilt into a boring straight flat line because someone ran out of talent midcorner, went into a tree or over a cliff, and then hired and ambulance-chasing shyster to help him get out of paying for the consequences?
I looked underneath the passenger seat of a vehicle which had air bags. Wow, there’s A Lot of wires running to and fro. I didn’t expect that. I thought there’d be just One simple wire. Damn bureaucrats, and their multiplicity.
I noticed that one wire ran up from the floor board and met a connector to the many other wires and connectors.
Supposing that If a a person disconnected that wire, then the, “Air Bag Is Off” light – lites up – to the right of the stereo.
I wonder, which wire on the connector would a person connect a resistor to in order to get the, “Air bag is OFF” light, to disappear?
And, is that truly disarming the ticking time bomb? Or, does one need to go further and disassemble the entire dash and console in order to get an arm up to get to the wires which lead to the ticking time bomb?
In the background, I wonder: Air Supply, Journey, and Deep Purple would have “No Chance” if they came about today.
There’s a Big Time lack of Love. …Even among, The little People.
Can’t you see it too?
Everybody’s become, “Cut-throat” thees days.
“Me” “Me”” Me-First”. … They’re fooking bonkers, And, they don’t even know it, or care.
I know I’m way late for this discussion, but I thought I’d toss in a couple additional points that I didn’t see touched on. First is that a lot of these safety regulations are not just purely due to government do-gooders. Much of it is the result of collusion between device manufacturers, insurance companies, and the government. I remember some years back when Steven Levitt challenged the child-seat safety laws based on some interesting data showing that car seats were no more safe than seat belts. To prove the theory, he tried to find a testing facility that would simply test the two side-by-side. Most of the facilities wouldn’t even run the test, and the one that did only did it after agreeing to complete anonimity so that they didn’t upset their main source of income from car seat manufacturers. Here’s a link to the talk he did about it:
http://www.ted.com/talks/steven_levitt_on_child_carseats?language=en
Also you can at least partially blame the more recent phenomena of infant deaths due to heat stroke from being left in cars. This is due to the fact that parents are required to keep infants in the back seat so that they aren’t endangered by the front passenger air bags.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/magazine/fatal-distraction-forgetting-a-child-in-thebackseat-of-a-car-is-a-horrifying-mistake-is-it-a-crime/2014/06/16/8ae0fe3a-f580-11e3-a3a5-42be35962a52_story.html
“way late” doesn’t happen on this blog, McSack.
Also, even if it did, better late, than never. Imho.
RE: “infant deaths” … in the background, the clovers of the world are yelling out in unison: “If it, Just saves One life, it’s worth it!”
They are such sick monsters.
Sacrificing babies, and everyone else who is killed by their demands, to make themselves feel smug. Gag me.
One more thing, “collusion between device manufacturers, insurance companies, and the government” … that’s called Fascism. …Some people like to call it corporatism, or maybe it all happens under an oligarchy?
To the man on the street, it’s just a military boot.
Words have meaning.
…It’s too bad that most of the rest of the world doesn’t give a fuck about all that.
“Let the poison, that lurks in the mud, rise up.”
“collusion between device manufacturers, insurance companies, and the government” – that may be, but w/o the FORCE of gunvermin, the other 2 could not make it happen.
@Phillip the Bruce,
So true.
In spite of that, The Yoke is heavy, for so many.
“Let the poison, that lurks in the mud, rise up.”
Mikey from Kansas (he’s in askimet detention right now) says cars are made by corporations that are creations of the state.
So these humans at the Kokomo Casting plant re ghosts or something.
Do tell us more Mikey
http://drivinggrowth.org/more-gears-more-jobs-chryslers-9-speed-transmission-jeep-adds-employment-in-ohio-indiana-and-michigan/
Sorry Tor – Mikey did not say the cars were creations of the state. He said the corporations were creations of the state, and in that he is correct.
The state holds guns to makers of autos heads and demands obedience.
State aggression is never excused
corporations are just people assembled for an economic purpose
First they come for corps then partnerships then finally me
MFW has never once been correct
Of course, Tor. I only meant that technically that one small aspect of his post was correct.
A corporation is not JUST people assembled for an economic purpose. It is a legal entity, created and defined by the gunvermin. If/when we do away with such gunvermin, we can change the definition to one more suitable. Until then we need to find another word to use for such groups.
Corporations are a tough subject to chew on and digest. Gunvermins have infested them in many ways. Maybe just manufacturer is a better word.
What I would still say to MFW is it is disingenuous to say gunvermin only effects the manufacturing entity. Every manufacturer is comprised of many individuals, and every law passed would have incalculable effects on these individuals.
The purpose of these laws is to transfer the benefits and power of manufacturing goods to gunvermin at the expense of the manufacturer. Usually this transfer comes at the expense of the littlest guys involved in manufacturing.
Here’s Murray Rothbard on the subject:
“It should be clear that corporations are not at all monopolistic privileges; they are free associations of individuals pooling their capital. On the purely free market, such men would simply announce to their creditors that their liability is limited to the capital specifically invested in the corporation, and that beyond this their personal funds are not liable for debts, as they would be under a partnership arrangement.
It then rests with the sellers and lenders to this corporation to decide whether or not they will transact business with it. If they do, then they proceed at their own risk. Thus, the government does not grant corporations a privilege of limited liability; anything announced and freely contracted for in advance is a right of a free individual, not a special privilege. It is not necessary that governments grant charters to corporations.” Murray Rothbard, in Man, Economy & State http://mises.org/rothbard/mes/chap15d.asp
Corporations would exist with or without government charter. Government only gets in the way of forming corporations by requiring them to obtain permission from government. In true free market capitalism, there would be more corporations and government wouldn’t regulate them at all.
Limited liability would exist for all products because there would be writing on all products noting that if you are not allowed to use the product unless you agree to the stipulations. You can only stop the existence of corporations and limited liability via governmental control, interference with contract, and reduction of freedom.
Tor – Murray, as usual, is spot on. We don’t NEED gunvermin to create corporations. But, as in so many cases, they have claimed that prerogative, and as a monopoly to boot.
EPA and ‘safety’ regulations of automobiles are clear and unnecessary infringements into what used to be a somewhat free market.
“Every manufacturer is comprised of many individuals, and every law passed would have incalculable effects on these individuals.”
True, but even more so the even more numerous individuals that are the potential customers of the manufacturer. Since the gunvermin know that the customers have limited choices, only because of their interference in the market, it is they, not the individuals making up the manufacturer, that I believe are the PRIMARY targets of such interference.
Given that airbag deployment saves far more lives than the rare mis-deployment takes, its hard to argue that they are not a net benefit to the public. STILLL……..Eric feels that bags subtract from his ‘freedom’. Can’t quite see why- as Eric as an individual is perfectly Free to build his own bagless vehicle and drive it all over his own Property. Even the levy on auto corporations to build and sell only bagged cars is perfectly legit and no infringement on personal Freedom. The corporations are afterall purely creations of the State- NOT real people. Eric is even Free to quietly disconnect the bag in his vehicle assuning its new enough to have one. No one will ever check.
Mike,
You completely miss the point. Which is: It’s no (legitimate) business of this thing called government to dictate personal choices, whether to car companies or car buyers. Whether air bags “save lives” is irrelevant.
Maybe you think it’s proper for adults to be treated as children by supposed “know betters.” I do not think it is proper.
I think the only time one adult has any right to deploy violence (or its threat) is in self-defense.
My driving a car without air bags does not harm you. It may entail a slight (and purely theoretical) increased risk of harm to me. But that’s my business, no one else’s.
He also completely misses the point by citing “rare misdeployments” as the problem.
The current airbag debacle has to do with normal airbag deployment in which metal shrapnel is ejected in a manner similar to anti-personnel weaponry, injuring or killing the occupants. Some “safety” enhancement.
It was federal government thugs who mandated that cars be equipped with explosives, and they are the ones that should be held responsible. These airbags are such valuable “safety” enhancements that now people in millions of affected vehicles are being told to keep passengers out of the front seat!!
I have seen no evidence that an airbag offers significant additional protection to those who are belted in. They were in fact forced on us in a misguided attempt to force “protection” on people who do not wear seat belts. They are most emphatically NOT a “net benefit to the public,” not that this even matters. (Who are these thugs to determine “net benefit” at the point of a gun? Ah, the old battle cry of the tyrant, they are always doing it for the “greater good,” aren’t they?)
My own cars are old enough not to have the damned things. If I ever had to buy a car that was equipped with these dangerous explosive devices, disconnecting them would be job #1, regardless of what the scumbags’ “laws” had to say about it.
Amen, Jason!
Moreover, the most effective “safety” feature is… to not wreck in the first place. I’ve managed to avoid doing that for going on 30 years. Air bags – and seat belts – have been of zero benefit to me. But Clovers postulate they might be.
Therefore, I must buy them.
Of course, they don’t see (or won’t acknowledge) the absurdity of their position. Clover might have a heart attack. Therefore, Clover should be forced to eat a diet of broccoli and oatmeal. Clover might get an STD. Or hurt his pecker while pounding it in front of the keyboard. Therefore, every sexual interaction Clover has must be done according to certain rules (enforceable at gunpoint)… for “safety.”
Etc.
The State dictation to its creation- a corporation is in fact perfectly legit. Don’t wanna be dictated to? DON’T FORM A CORPORATION! You as an individual are not being ‘dictated to’ because the corp is obeying its creator and not selling you an airbagless car to your spec. You are perfectly free to build and drive such a vehicle on your Property. No Right of yours has been touched in this regard.
You might be a bit more consistent where you simply to oppose state created corporate persons, period.
I never disputed the legality – did I?
But I did dispute the morality.
Your statement, “You are perfectly free to build and drive such a vehicle on your Property. No Right of yours has been touched in this regard” is 150 proof Cloverific.
That is to say, you believe “society” and “government” have rights that supersede those of individuals. Consider the logical (and practical) absurdity of your position.
“Society” has no existence as other than a kind of conceptual shorthand for “everyone within a given area.” But everyone within a given area means multiple individuals, each of whom will have their own preferences and values. What gives any individual the right to impose by violence his preferences and values on others? And – to be clear – I am not talking about preferences and values (i.e., actions) and so on that cause harm to others. That is another thing. I am talking about things like vehicle design. You have every right to buy whatever sort of car (however equipped) meets your criteria. But you do not have the right to force-feed your criteria to others.
If I opened a little shop, no corporate entity, I would still have to comply with all the regulations GM and the others do. Of course production limits would probably excuse a lot of them, but if I opened a factory and got up to that point, still not a corporation, the regulations would still apply.
As to your ‘make it yourself’ argument, sure we could all do that with so many things. It breaks the division of labor. It makes life very difficult, making everything one’s self. Then again that’s the point. But even then government doesn’t leave people alone. The government goes after people who group together to raise/grow their own food even. Nobody is really left in peace. One guy in Illinois was making his own biodiesel and the state government sent out two agents to harass him for not having the proper licenses and paying taxes on it and so on. tens of thousands of dollars in licensing fees to become a proper manufacturer of bio diesel, but he was just making it for his own use.
Furthermore there are prohibitions placed on what one can do in a residential area, that means getting a commercial building which then… well it’s the endless loop of bounds so that someone like you can say ‘but you can make it yourself’ when really that is quite illegal.
PS: I do not “feel” that the air bag mandate “subtracts from my freedom.” It does. Inarguable. I (and others) are forced to buy them. Forced to maintain/repair them. Forced to bear the costs – and risks – of their presence.
Notice the common thread, Mike?
Force.
Why can’t you and other Clovers do what you like/buy what you want – and leave the rest of us free to do likewise?
MfW -As is par for the course among clovers, you completely missed Eric’s point that it is NONE of the gunvermin’s business whether I have airbags, buckle my seat belt, or even have a seat belt.
But in addition to that, you have no proof that airbags save more than they cost. You have only the word of the gunvermin, that has PROVEN not to have our best interests at heart, only what they CLAIM are our best interests.
It’s like I wrote to ‘my’ Congresscritter – You claim to represent me, but you live 2 counties away, in an area where I cannot afford to live, and would not if I could afford it. You CANNOT represent me, because you don’t even know me, let alone agree with me.
And don’t give me any democracy crap. Democracy is nothing more than tyranny of the majority, something the founding fathers hated and feared.
I think Mike should be forced to drive a Lexus. After all, they perform best in crash tests. We should all be forced to drive them. Think of the lives we’d save.
Yes, it would be expensive for all of us, but that’s a small price to pay. If you don’t like it, you can always buy a kei truck and drive it on your own property. Forget that you were forced to pay for the roads and can’t drive on them. All you would have to do is buy a Lexus–that isn’t built by people—to be completely free to do so. It’s the price we would pay for freedom. If you can’t afford freedom, then walk.
Take that you wascally wibertarian, non-aggressionist morons.
That’s a great way of looking at it Mike, if we are livestock rather than individuals.
If are fungible human resources then yes, it matters that airbags ‘save’ more people than they kill. Although I wouldn’t be surprised if airbag ‘saves’ weren’t that unlike bicycle helmet saves. Any time they go off it is thought the person was ‘saved’ somehow. But I digress. If we are just resources of this great big farm then it doesn’t matter that some individuals died at the hands of a mandated safety device so long as more are saved by it.
Maybe even in some religious idea of humanity having some sort of whole or having some future to protect or for the children your concept might have a chance. But the state doesn’t recognize religion and neither do its intellectuals, according to the state once we die, we’re dead and that’s that and not everyone has children. So how is this mandate a good thing for those who die from it?
Only government can bring about a safety mandate that actually kills people and stick with it. Thing is, airbags can work much safer if they are powered down. They just won’t be because government doesn’t work like that. The pride of bureaucrats is at stake. The only downside is that the airbags won’t do as well for bigger (average male and larger) people who don’t wear a seat belt.
Doesn’t seem like a horrible trade off to better keep these things from killing people.
“All your evidence is anecdotal therefore you are wrong. Let me prove it by telling you stories from my own life.” Love it.
Escalation from airbags to general tyranny: Nicely done, Eric.
Nature Boy. Nat King Cole. Eden Ahbez. There was a boy. A very strange enchanted boy. They say he wandered very far. Very far, over land and sea. A little shy and sad of eye. But very wise was he. And then one day, a magic day. He passed my way, and while we spoke. Of many things, fools and kings. This he said to me: ‘The greatest thing you’ll ever learn. Is just to love and be loved in return’
Private, market-based engineering = Barbarella Ship
Public, mandatory-type engineering = Borg Ship
Showing my age but, in 1973 Autoweek had an article on airbags. It was a report on tests done in Sweden using infant pigs to simulate humans(yes, they used live animals). In 24 instances where the bags were deployed near the piglets, as though they were in the front seat, 8 piglets died from the concussion of the explosion needed to deploy the bag in the milliseconds required. They did not crash the vehicles, they merely deployed the bags.
Social dogooders are impervious to facts. Their religious devotion to “their cause” makes snake-handling Christians look like hedonists.
Hi Mark,
Yes, but it’s worse than that. They don’t care about facts, certainly. But they also don’t care about our right to be left alone. To make our own decisions. To buy what we want. And so on.
They must be called on that – and fought on that basis.
Otherwise, you’re stuck arguing over utilitarian incidentals. And they’ll win.
Agreed. The core offense of The State is the idea that those that at the controls of The State have a “Right” to tell others how to live…for their own good. And do so at gunpoint if necessary. The idea of leaving people alone so long as they engage in peaceful voluntary actions is totally alien to the Totalitarian Mind.
It seeps into every crevice of life. People who depress me the most are the anti-Obamacare conservatives. They bemoan the current healthcare situation and at the same time support the War on (some) Drugs. Their limited thinking is incapable of connecting the intellectual dots that the Drug War started with controlling opiates via prescription. That is the Rubicon that said it’s OK for GovCo to control heathcare. Steny Hoyer, on the passage of the Affordable Care Act, laid it out perfectly when he stated to the media that it was a culmination of over 100 years of effort by both Republicans(Teddy Roosevelt among them) and Democrats.
We didn’t get to the current tyrannical state overnight, it will take years to change the minds of conservatives and liberals to get them to see The State is their enemy, not a tool to achieve that which can only be achieved by force.
I know no one inside the Belchway cares about the Declaration of Independence, but it, based on the Magna Carta and English Common Law, is the founding document of US Government, NOT the Constitution. TJ said that governments were formed to preserve our rights, and derived their just powers from the consent of the governed. Not a majority of the governed, the governed. No government can have ANY powers that have not been delegated to them by ‘the governed.’ And said ‘governed’ cannot delegate powers that they do not themselves have.
I know some here don’t care for Gary North, but I have long been a fan of this quotation, “The 10 Commandments do not say, ‘Thou shalt not steal EXCEPT BY MAJORITY VOTE.'”
And the same thing goes for killing, perjury, etc.
We now know that things did not turn out the way the Continental Congress hoped, but the intentions were good.
I may be getting old and my neural pathways aren’t what they used to be, but….
My recollection about why airbags were required in the first place was because many drivers at the time were in the habit of not using seat belts. Airbags were a government required technology solution to save people from themselves. Front airbags added nothing in the way of added protection of a properly strapped in driver/passenger. (I remember footage of volunteers participating in full frontal vehicle collisions to verify adequacy of driver restraints). At least that was how the idea was sold. I remember this because in the nineties I worked for a supplier of the Big Three. The big deal at that time was decapitation of midgets and small children seated too close to overly energetically deploying airbags. Which lead to the installation of passenger airbag deactivation switches. I remember punditry at the time saying that airbags only work properly when passengers are properly strapped in. (!!!) I remember thinking “then why do you need the airbag?”.(On the other hand think of the increase to GDP and decrease of CPI via hedonic adjustments all in the pursuit of passenger safety). A great example of how a government mandate becomes an end in itself for those making a living pursuing that mandate. whatever the ultimate cost/benefit to the population at large. Much like health care and the war on drugs. Perhaps someone will take the time to research it further.
And here’s the shits of it all. Right now a family man, a guy intent on hurting no one, is serving LIFE in prison for failing to turn off the air bag in his pickup that caused the death of his young son after a driver ran a red and they t-boned him. So, Life IN prison if you don’t buckle in, Life if you do buckle in and forget about the passenger side switch for SOME vehicles. I was picking up receipts, deposits and cash in BOA, Midland, Tx, main bank when the OJ verdict came in. I was in the “back” of the bank, almost exclusively the domain of women, and there was this tremendous cheer that arose. Seemingly smart enough people cheering for what? I’m not big on convicting people of anything, esp of murder but that was such an open and shut case it took some really exceptional incompetence to lose. Jaysus, something stinks real bad.
A fellow came to work one day with his arm in a cast and both eyes blackened. I asked him if he got into a fight or something. He replied that on the weekend a car slid through the intersection in front of his van. He was pushing on the horn when the air bag fired off, driving his wrist into his face, breaking his wrist and and his nose.
There was very little damage to his van and his son drove him to the clinic with it and he drove it to work. After seeing that I pulled the fuse for the airbags in my wifes car and mine.
On the other hand, I have been ‘lucky.’ I have been involved in 3 accidents where I was driving cars w/airbags, and NEVER had a bag go off.
1st in a 2000 Prizm, it was a glancing blow as I was trying to pass another car and didn’t clear it because it came to a stop.
2nd was in the 09 Sportwagen, managed to come to a stop just before hitting the back end of a Honda that had panic stopped on I-270 for NO reason, only to have a loaded Ford E-350 rear end me hard enough to drive me into it. But he must have let off the brakes by then, maybe even started moving, because there was no visible damage to his car, or to the front of mine.
3rd, again in the Sportwagen, but circumstances similar to the 1st, glancing blow, so no sudden deceleration.
In the 1st case, I’m sure the Prizm would have been totalled if the bags had blown.
2nd, the VW was only a year old, so besides my deductible and a month in a (paid for) rental car, my biggest loss was the bumper sticker shaped like a school bus that said “School’s open. Hide all the kids.”
We had someone at work just a couple weeks ago who was pulling into a parking lot when the air bag on their ford focus just went off. All on it’s own. She, and the witnesses in the parking lot, thought at first that the car was on fire due to the smoke/powder from the deployment and so she bailed out of the vehicle. It gently rolled across the parking lot before stopping against a pillar at the strip mall. Multiple witnesses testified that the vehicle hit nothing. The cop didn’t believe any of them and said the air bag went off when she hit the building (even though she bailed out of the car and it went 30 yards or so on it’s own). Cop said air bags don’t just go off on their own. Ford told them to pound sand and not a single lawyer would touch it.
Lucky for her she was idling across a parking lot when it happened. Had that it happened on the highway, she probably would’ve crashed and been seriously injured or worse. And the assumption would’ve been that the bags deployed in the accident and not before, thus creating the accident.
Makes you wonder how many accidents have been caused by random air bag deployment?
Coincidentally, I just got a safety recall notice from Honda for my 2002 Civic for the passenger airbag inflator. Here’s what it says in part:
“If an affected airbag deploys, the increased internal pressure may cause the inflator to rupture. Metal fragments From a ruptured inflator could pass through the airbag material, which could cause serious potentially fatal injury to vehicle occupants. To reduce the risk of injury to this issue, no vehicle occupant should use the front passenger seat until your vehicle is repaired.”
Real nice!
Honda and some other manufacturers have been experimenting with airbag systems on motorcycles! http://world.honda.com/motorcycle-picturebook/Airbag/
And here is one company’s promotional description of their airbag jacket for bikers:
“In this video, you an clearly see the Neck DPS going off and wrapping around the rider’s neck and clavicle area and working along the helmet for a never seen before level of safety.”
Are these people nuts?
Hi Steve,
Not nuts. Greedy.
Honda (and Kaw and the rest of them) knows they’ll will make more money if the government can force everyone who buys a bike to buy an air bag.
It will happen, if bikers give an inch. If they don’t – overwhelmingly – make it crystal clear to the bike industry that most of them will never buy a new bike again, if an air bag mandate is passed.
I wonder how many engineers at Honda and the others actually believe ait bags on bikes is a good idea?
“…going off and wrapping around the rider’s neck and clavicle area..” yeah right! Just what I need happening if I hit a pot hole or make an emergency stop.
I wonder how many engineers at Honda and the others actually believe air bags on bikes are a good idea?
“…going off and wrapping around the rider’s neck and clavicle area..” yeah right! Just what I need happening if I hit a pot hole or make an emergency stop.
How long until they are required for;
1. Bicycles
2. Skiers
3. Skateboarders
4. Subway riders
5. Bus riders
6. Joggers
???
I mean, you can never be too safe. Right?
Get me off this galactic insane asylum.
Expect many activities to be banned as the government’s hold on us increases.
Transit riders will not have airbags (too costly for government), but bicycling will be banned for injury risk under government medical care. It will be to cut costs. That’s what they’ll tell us. The reality is that bicycling is too free and once private passenger car ownership is impossible for the middle and lower classes the move against bicycling will blossom. Bicycling is simply being used as a political weapon in the war against personal mobility.
Sporting activities like skiing will require permission. Remember what we are to this system, at worst pests, at best children, mostly the middle ground of livestock.
So I’m riding through the pasture when my horse steps in a hole and stumbles. Thank god for that saddle horn air bag. Sure, it broke my neck and nose and blacked my eyes…and the horse freaked so bad he broke a leg but we’re ok now for the main part….well, at least me…….
For sale, one saddle…..for parts, air bag non-functional, one horse, non-functional, hurry, first offer gets it all to haul it off.
Trust us comrade. This bag fills with nitrogen from a chemical reaction involving sodium that might penetrate and land on a human body composed of 78% water for infants, and 60% water for adult men. No worries, we’re monitoring ourselves carefully.
Actually, the original bags used the decomposition of sodium azide (a chemical relative of lead azide, used in detonators). That and its successors don’t use oxidation at all, as it isn’t fast enough. (Some high explosives do use it, but not as part of their fast explosion, as something to add further energy – and there’s no point doing that for air bags, as the base speed is all that matters.)
Evidence based research is good. This article contains none. All the information contained in this article is purely anecdotal, and you have taken an issue of safety, backed by hard research and statistics, and eroded it into an “us vs Them” argument as if human beings vying for greater public safety are using innovation as a means of further enslaving people.
I have worked as a Paramedic for a long time, and have seen innumerable wrecks of all shapes and sizes, both with and without airbags, where the airbags deployed and didn’t deploy, and where seat belts were and were not worn. I have never under any circumstances encountered a patient being injured from “airbag shrapnel”, however I have seen a LOT of serious thoracic trauma from deceleration injures whereby the person hits the steering wheel (I have never seen deceleration related trauma via the airbag), or vehicular ejections resulting in all major forms of multi trauma.
Long story short, you have no fucking clue what you’re talking about.
Thanks
It’s not “anecdotal,” dlo. It’s a fact that people have been mauled by these air bags – defective and otherwise. Injured – and killed. Not even the manufacturer of the air bags in question denies it. Christ!
I suppose this woman’s case, for example, is “anecdotal”?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xP8frZ4NyU
And who are you – or anyone else – to dictate to others what features (“safety” or otherwise) they must have in their vehicles? Do you believe you have parental or ownership rights over other people? Maybe your personal recreations, diet and so on ought to be carefully monitored and controlled, too. You know – to reduce “risk” – and “for safety.” Maybe you need mandatory anger management… or a low-fat diet? What’s your BMI? Do your sexual practices involve “risk”? Why, there ought to be a law!
Sarcasm off, but (hopefully) point made.
Yes, it’s true that air bags can save lives. They have also taken them.
Regardless, it’s not your right to make the calculation for anyone except yourself.
Indeed, even if air bags were absolutely without negative aspects – never hurt anyone – it would still be none of your business or anyone else’s to impose them on other people.
Get it?
Hey Eric! “it would still be none of your business or anyone else’s to impose them on other people. Get it?”
I cannot claim to speak for Dlo, but I suspect that no, he does not get it.
My own brother is a clover (there, I have confessed!) and in many ways a very bright guy. Still, whenever I point out that his entire life view is based on the principle of “do-what-we-say-is-best-for-you-or-we-will-kill-you” he truly seems to not understand what I am talking about. He will respond with some variation of “But this law has already saved three lives!” When it comes to the ideas of self determination, of proper authority, of liberty, it is like he has an intellectual (and I would add ethical) blind spot. He is like a child who sees a cookie and cannot think of anything but what he desires. “Oooooh! Cookie!” He never sees the costs, especially the costs in human freedom, but only sees the points that he thinks are benefits.
I still love my brother… but I hope we never end up in a life boat together.
Ditto, Jason.
My entire family is like your brother. Most people are like this… unfortunately.
It is astonishing – and depressing. Testimony to the effectiveness of conditioning. People who are not dumb in terms of IQ or specialized knowledge nonetheless seem unable to think conceptually. They deal with each thing “situationally,” without reference to broader principles. Utilitarianism – which to me is a form of nihilism – is the ethical soup in which most Americans swim. It never occurs to most of them to even question their premises, especially the aggressive violence behind almost everything they advocate.
Our resident Clover, for instance. You and I and others find it baffling that he refuses to acknowledge, for instance, that the random stops/checkpoints he supports entail threatening people with violent repercussions in order to compel their submission. I’ve tried (lord, how I have tried!) to get him to at least admit that. But he will not. He adamantly insists that “no violence is involved” and – wait for it! – that those of us who object are the violent ones!
It’s a species of insanity.
Eric most people I know either don’t care or are Clovers. But now Clover himself/herself(still haven’t figured out which) is another class.
Love the bee analogy Tor. BTW welcome dlo.
Eric – technically dlo (dumb lights out?) is correct that your evidence is anecdotal. But so what? There have been sufficient instances that inferences may be drawn, and even the manufacturer (as you point out) has admitted that there is a problem. Conclusion? Air bags MAY be dangerous to your health. But since it is the gunvermin that mandated them, you have no option. TS Charley.
Phillip,
I agree. But dlo castigated Eric for anecdotal evidence, then says:
“I have worked as a Paramedic for a long time, and have seen innumerable wrecks of all shapes and sizes, both with and without airbags, where the airbags deployed and didn’t deploy, and where seat belts were and were not worn. I have never under any circumstances encountered a patient being injured from “airbag shrapnel”, however I have seen a LOT of serious thoracic trauma from deceleration injures whereby the person hits the steering wheel (I have never seen deceleration related trauma via the airbag), or vehicular ejections resulting in all major forms of multi trauma.”
He counters anecdotal, with anecdotal. Dlo seems to believe, since he hasn’t seen any airbag shrapnel, it doesn’t exist. He hasn’t seen anyone injured by an airbag, so it doesn’t happen.
I’ve worked in the excavation industry for 20 years–since I was 14–and I’ve never seen a serious injury or death. Should I deduce that those things don’t happen in my industry? I haven’t ever seen it.
Welcome dlo.
Stick around, buckle up if thats your thing, let eric & friends tell you the inside baseball facts of life. Let em tell ya bout the birds, bees, flowers, and trees. Or just fly on by and off to the next flower for another one night spam.
One thing I’ve learned here. Is that in the case of bees. You’ve got your Hives and your Hive Nots.
Not everyone here wants to collect honey, salute the queen, live their entire life in a cell in a comb. Just because you heard a bee in your bonnet tell you to join the official swarm, doesn’t mean it’ll fly here. You’re free to say what you like, we’re free to tell you to buzz off about all that full black and yellow jacket hive jive.
dlo – “Evidence based research is good. This article contains none. All the information contained in this article is purely anecdotal”
Followed by nothing more than anecdotal and self referential “evidence.”
Clover’s ever-so-slightly brighter cousin?
Me2,
I just jumped his case above for this same thing. I guess I should have read down lower, then I’d have known others already called his bullshit.
Sorry.
No worries. I have been granted no monopoly on pointing out hypocrisy and arrogant ignorance in others. 🙂
Besides, it is always nice to hear my thinking echoed by others. It’s rare.
Dlo, as a product development engineer I follow a fair number of product development things. Airbags are quite the interesting case. Engineers at the automakers proved the danger airbags pose in the 1970s. This is why airbags were the last mandate automakers fought hard to stop. They knew what would happen and it did happen. Government could not politically admit their mistake. Do you know why there are such rube goldberg nonsense in the airbag systems of today’s cars and all the crap about putting kids in the back seat? It’s because kids and small adults were killed in minor collisions by airbags in the 1990s. Sure you won’t see much of the problem today because of all these work arounds, but the problems are still there, we just work around them.
There’s now a weight sensors in the seats. If I put my hat, a towel, a magazine, and an Italian beef sammich on the passenger seat of my ’12 this red light comes on to tell me the passenger side airbag has been disabled. This and other workarounds tying the airbags to seatbelt sensors and the like are how the problem with the unbelted average male standard is being dealt with. A standard that was proven deadly for many people.
These workarounds, nonsense, and risk we put up with for a safety device is absurd. If it wasn’t for government it wouldn’t be like this. Designs would develop and improve. We would probably have better airbags or a better unrelated system today absent government intervention.
Imagine a pink bunny slipper stomping on a human face forever…
RE: “Imagine a pink bunny slipper stomping on a human face forever…”
There’s a Lot to read into that. It’s quite PROfound.
…So Very many people would be A-Ok with that.
…As they are.
A very good friend of mine lost his life as a result of an airbag. His Mercedes hit a patch of black ice on a Kansas freeway. This apparently caused his car to slightly bump the car he was passing – immediately the airbag deployed trapping my friend who from that point on was unable to control the car in any fashion, the accelerator was pressed to the floor. The car crossed the median strip headlong into an oncoming tracker trailer – my friend and the other 2 occupants in the car were all killed.
Hi Jacob,
Horrible.
But does the “if it saves even one life” crowd care? Of course not.
“if it saves even one life” – why don’t we start a campaign to turn that around – “if it takes even one life”
Tragic, but question how it was determined the accelerator was pinned down, does Mercedes have black box type recorders? From a human factors standpoint it would not surprise me if it takes on the order of seconds (maybe quite many) to process and realize what’s happened when the bags go off unexpectedly. By the time the driver can do anything the accident will be over. Eric’s articles have always gotten me thinking about the failure modes of air bags, anti-locks, electric steering, computer/driver interventions et.al. which are all going to happen as vehicles age. There doesn’t seem to be any good failure mode for steering.
We have a 2005 Ford expedition in the shop today. The brakes for no discernable reason will lose power and go the floor having to be pumped. Master cylinder has been replaced twice to no effect. My son can’t learn to drive with this failure and we will end up replacing because of the brakes. We also had a no good reason failure where the fast idle failsafe was activated and we were stuck in the road unable to get over the small curb or up the small hill. Hasn’t happened again, never understood why. It’s getting complicated enough you almost have to go to a pilot simulator to figure out what and how to deal with these things. Technology doesn’t always make things easier
I recall Bob Bondurant once saying when he was trying to teach people how to drive and induced a skid, they would inevitably panic and instead of stomping the brake, the only skill they had, they simply stomped…..the thing their foot was on, the fuel feed. He said he spent most of every day prying peoples legs up from the go pedal. I don’t doubt it. I’ve seen it many times in my life.
Taz1999,
The failure modes you mentioned point out the fact that with the overarching use of computers in vehicles, the actual function is only as good as the skill of the programmers of the firmware in the system. One need only cruise the net to discover instances where the failure modes were catastrophic from crappy firmware. Technology can be a double-edged sword. Yes, with proper programming engine performance and energy usage can be optimized, but when I hear Mercedes bragging that they produce a car with 300 network nodes, all I can think of is, with that level of complexity the potential failure modes and proper handling thereof amount to an overwhelming task, even for great programmers. I say this as a former software engineer of 30 years experience. Hey, just imagine how hackable these systems are……and perhaps purposely so, because that would give a great backdoor for the PtB.
WRT airbags…..efficacy is irrelevant. Mandatory things like seatbelts, airbags, security checkpoints etc. are just signs of the noose tightening. That sheeple bleat “It’s for your own good” tells me that the conditioning in public school has been very, very effective. And Eric, it pains me to see how many of my close friends and family are so conditioned.
From the 1927 Grand Council of American Indians
“The white people, who are trying to make us over into their image, they want us to be what they call “assimilated,” bringing the Indians into the mainstream and destroying our own way of life and our own cultural patterns. They believe we should be contented like those whose concept of happiness is materialistic and greedy, which is very different from our way.
We want freedom from the white man rather than to be integrated. We don’t want any part of the establishment, we want to be free to raise our children in our religion, in our ways, to be able to hunt and fish and live in peace. We don’t want power, we don’t want to be congressmen, or bankers….we want to be ourselves. We want to have our heritage, because we are the owners of this land and because we belong here.
The white man says, there is freedom and justice for all. We have had “freedom and justice,” and that is why we have been almost exterminated. We shall not forget this.”
Boy were they mistaken about their ownership. I fear we may be proven wrong as well.
We are “yesterday’s white men.” There is an enormous collection of pressures being applied to make us assimilate. The New World Order architects have decreed we are to become docile hive-minds like the Euro-poors and the UnionJack-offs or else perish.
– Our greatest hope might be the blowback and joining in common cause or Europians and Britainies who’ve not yet truly submitted to their “more perfect unions” in their hearts.
Have you seen the new 3D digitally remastered and edited version of Braveheart yet?
– “They may take our lives, they may take our freedom, they may force us to participate hideous british and european unions. But they’ll never pass laws outlawing our bagpipes, haggis and kilts…. what’s that. There’s a resolution to just that in the House of Commons… oh, never mind.”
“Resistance is futile!”
Just ask those who were displaced (or assimilated?) by the ‘Native Americans.’
I am an extinct version of liberal. The kind from 1600 to 1912 only.
There was a valid strain of manhood established in America that was extirpated by the tall sail boat people. This is only an observation. I don’t think in terms of victims. Or good guys bad guys
If there is a tragedy it is that the scarcity causing assimilation has human origins. It’s not natural I don’t think
PtB, funny you should mention that. I was behind this trailer yesterday that’s used for something or several things probably all having to do with fracing. It has so many tubes and fittings and pumps and unidentifiable stuff all stuffed into basically and 8’X45′ area I’d have to look at one for an hour to even remotely understand it. But it looked like the Borg on wheels.
The guy pulling it had a Big motor cause he was hauling ass into a bad wind with it. He was coming up on this same damned road construction where I got run over and the flagman is out there with a sign stuck up that says Slow on one side and Stop on the other. It was whipping around from one to the other and he was holding his hand out sorta Nazi style.
I’d been through this before and jacked the guy up and all he’d say is No go. I finally said No Va to him, got back into my rig, whipped it around him. He didn’t know what to do since I made quick circle with the trailer just doing a pirouette around him and I took off back the way I’d come, hit a side road and found my way around all this crap. I hadn’t been back through there since but since it was 4:30 I figured they were all in the for day. I was wrong but I decided if they were going to use people who couldn’t speak English I’d use that tack myself. I went by mouthing No habla Espanol and dusted him hard just like the guy in front. We got 5 miles down and found they’d stopped oncoming traffic to wait for us and laughed like a fool as I saw a whole line of 18 wheelers hauling ass right behind me. Evidently, a bunch of people can play that game. Last I saw there was still a stream that reached all the way from where I stopped on the S side of town to a hill over a mile away. Nova my ass!!! Wish I’d blown my doors passing him, maybe give him a little present of one inch rock that might not have fallen out and a double blast of compressed air. I’ve had it with this incompetent crew…..and not only that their brand new highway is literally coming to pieces faster than they can repair it. I’ve heard they did this on another highway and the state hired another firm to do it over. This has got to be one of those really crooked bureaucratic deals.
Grabbermint knows we’ve had the right to use the very roads we paid for through all manner of taxes and fuel excise for generations, but they rightly shy away from any responsibility if we’re in a crash, which is fair enough – BUT:
They mandate seatbelts and airbags as if they’re taking responsibility. It may be our choice to get in a car and know the risks, but forced to be surrounded by mandated safety equipment that often injures us more seriously than the crash itself is culpable interference. Their excuse is that we knew that dangerous shit was pointing at our faces through the steering wheel, so it’s still our choice and therefore our fault.
Most people haven’t seen an airbag launch a fully grown neanderthal into the ceiling as a joke when it’s set off under the couch. Obviously that’s not what they’re designed for, but a good show of their power. Grabbermint has been complicit in hiding many of the injuries from airbags – “properly” installed and used too.
Grabbermint tries to interfere in everything in order to show off its “care” for the “safety” of its subjects. Uh-huh.. There’s always an ulterior motive and a negative flow-on effect. Speed limits that are so low people fall asleep, use their phones, slurp coffee and beer and put on makeup behind the wheel. Just try to achieve any of that on an autobahn.
They claim they’re not responsible for our crash, even if the road they built caused it, but they interfere in every other way. Why?
Because they own you if you have a “driver” licence and “registration”. Congrats – you now work for the Man and are subject to his company policies – statutes, and the policy officers will get ya for breaching anything, sans victim of course.
Most politicians that make interfering “safety” laws don’t even drive themselves to and from parliaments. It’s not them that have an explosive device in their face.
Just wait until the car companies try to save more money by reducing crumple zones because there’s 25 airbags and a seatbelt available already and, will we ever know about it?
Hey! I resemble that remark! 🙂
As an aside, airbags along with other government mandates are actually designed to kill people, in my opinion. You have to put the other diatribes like there are to many people on the face of the earth and they are ruining Gaia along with the airbag crap to connect the dots. Non racing belts are the same, although most restraint systems are also to blame.
Physics is immutable, an object in motion tends to remain in motion. Your physical body , as driver in a box aka automobile (no matter the designation, car, truck, etc.) traveling at 30 mph that has a seat belt or any restraint system on will be arrested. However, your organs are also traveling at 30 mph. So what happens when your suddenly arrested rib cage meets your lungs and heart? I can tell you what happened to one person at 35 mph. Her heart hit her sternum and exploded. This is the reason I do not wear a seat belt. It is another way for the state to murder you through diktat. I’d much rather take the risk that my forward motion and my organs will have an equal chance of survival. One thing to note, isn’t it amazing the human race survived before all the gloverment SAFETY crap?
David Ward
Memphis, Tennessee
Similar to my arguments against bike helmets David. I wear one because I like to keep the bugs out of my face, but I know that depending on the type of prang, such as directly into a pole beyond 30MPH, the helmet’s not much good except to hold your brain box together while the goo inside ricochets around in your skull, allowing you to be a vegetable.
Only the clueless non-vegetables say it’s better than dying and force it upon you at gunpoint.
Same with seatbelts, I wear one because I like the way it holds me tight in my bucket seat while I pull G’s around corners, but I know there are certain prangs where it’ll be of no help.
Whilst using our private property, no law should intervene on our choices unless someone else is at risk of harm. Wearing a seatbelt or helmet is purely the calculated risk of the wearer alone, since no other party could be proven to be harmed through another’s personal choice.
The reason TPTB have the gall to force you to do as they say is that little contract called a licence. Well, it’s not a legal contract, because such things require full disclosure. I’m sure nobody at the DMV asked you if you were sure you were happy to give up your unalienable right to travel unfettered in a private conveyance of the day, so that you could swap it for a privilege that may be revoked any time they choose?
Of course, they used all our initial ignorance to sell us that privilege, without telling us we always had that right.
Anything that can be licensed is fundamentally lawful anyway.
Ditto with registration. Superior ownership of your car/bike/truck (now commercially called “vehicle”) has been transferred to grabbermint. If you don’t toe their line they’ll have it crushed.
Rev, you sound a bit like me(no offense intended)but I like seatbelts when I want one and only on vehicles I can tolerate them(and that ain’t all of them by far). I only pulled half my run of 540 miles from yesterday for today, mainly because I didn’t feel well and the end result would have probably been negative(not an easily explainable situation). I pull off the highway on to a dirt road and first thing I did, to great physical relief, take that damned seat belt off. Some vehicles it ain’t bad but in Volvo it’s a killer. I had instant relief and continued to do so since I remained on dirt roads the rest of the day. Sure, I was scared to death but it seemed a good trade-off at the time. Later, tentatively making my way home, I pondered if I’d live to make it without that seat belt. Actually, I never thought about it again till just now.
I also wear a helmet, an old NAVA that’s worn out but it was good in the day. I never had any illusions of it saving me on most rides or any ride for that matter but it kept some super big bugs out of my face and at times, sleet, rain and anything else in the air and that cold air itself. I never much cared for “cruising” speed, what the hell ever that is so my main mode is hauling ass. Rain can beat hell out of you as you well know. So can grasshoppers, bees, wasps and those pieces of gravel other vehicles throw up. I see people all the time riding bareheaded and I can live with it. I hope they can since I sometimes see and remove pieces of rock and things from the back of my tractor or trailer. It’s not that uncommon for something, such as a rock or big chunk of mud or nut or bolt or tape measure or hammer or anything, to fall off any vehicle of any size. I just don’t like to eat that stuff.
Exactly right 8..
The reason helmet manufacturers have their face shields tested to certain standards is precisely why we prefer to wear them – hopefully to keep flying debris out of our eyes. I’d rather see where I’m going for the rest of my life.
BTW, since medical certificates can be issued for non-wearing of helmets, I’m sure they can for seatbelts. Maybe it depends on the State but have you looked into that sorta thing considering they give you hell?
How do we resist this nonsense? You can’t buy a car without airbags. You can’t legally disable them, and some states won’t register your car if you have, but you’re still paying for them.
I drive a 12 year old car. It’s new enough that it has a lot of mandated systems, but nothing like today. If I was buying a new car today, it would have more airbags, TPMS, stability control, traction control, throttle-by-wire and most likely brake-by-wire (which is required by the stability systems). Bah! Crazy.
So cars today have TPMS? Is that short for ‘total PMS’? No wonder they have so many problems.
Worst part is, they don’t F*cking WORK worth a damn most of the time.
Traction control almost got me creamed on Route 1 recently… Gravel on the road, the car can’t accelerate, and I CAN’T BURN THROUGH TO THE PAVEMENT….
Can’t throw the shit aside.
Thanks, modern effing cars. Give me stuff that WORKS, and I’ll be fine and happy. F*ck shit up, I’m inclined to do the same to the responsible party.
Side note: No wonder there are always so many chiefs, they can pass the buck infinitely and wear you out. Not just cops, bureaucrats, corporations, etc. Oh, it’s not the CEOs fault, he didn’t even know about it. It went to accounting, and then to appropriations, and then to {insert long string of steps here}, and then the comittee approved it, and it went for sign-off and implementation, but the CEO, COO, CIO, CFO, President, Chairman of the board, et al, didn’t have ANYTHING to do with it.
Like Obama getting his news from the TV. Maybe if he went to the briefings instead of the golf course or bath house…?
I begin to think, as we watch the salaries of these heads of Legion explode all out of proportion to the wages of the average worker…. Maybe we’ve gotten too big for our britches, and need to go back to a natural way? Clans, families, villages, craftsman…. But no “Deciders” to get in our way. We execute them as Homo Erectus – it’s property damage, like shooting a dog. It’s not murder. Besides, they’ve aggressed against us, both actively and passively.
Actively by KNOWINGLY selling/distributing toxins, poisons, etc. at high profit via government subsidies and profitable business “deals” with the government’s interference.
Passively by ignoring whatever’s “intrusive” into their profit-based (psychopathic) world. So, the routine above, where it never gets to HIS desk, it’s just enacted by an underling.
Maybe Mad Max is still saner? Gnoll society? No hiding the ugliness, but it’s ALL in the open, at least… 🙁
Jean, I wouldn’t call executing current bureaucrats en-masse “property damage”, it’s necessary for survival. Let’s call it euthanasia and beneficial for all mankind.
I removed the catalytic converter from my ’87 Nissan a week ago because it had a hole rusted through. I replaced it with a straight through sport muffler (bit bigger than a glasspack) since the cat removes a lot of the noise already it was necessary.
It goes better for sure, but I don’t ever expect to have an exhaust place work on it again without having to replace the cat under mandated legislation. Apparently there’s a $20k fine waiting for them if they don’t replace it.
The kicker is that the EPA doesn’t have any legal power to issue fines – only courts can do that, in which case there needs to be evidence presented as to who did the work etc. If nobody admits it, it’s impossible to trace.
They’re just cowards. Bending to threats from those that have no authority over the living man. Besides, there are millions of engines on bikes, lawnmowers, boats and even older cars that don’t have cats and, if they’re THAT panicky over CO2 destroying the planet, my car no longer emits anywhere near as much as it did with the cat (that’s what cat’s do). TPTB are idiots and have conniption fits and kneejerk reactions every time Greenpiss have a sook.
How do we resist this nonsense? Don’t get it registered. It then no longer belongs to or comes under the purview of the State and they have no power to order anything.
I think the best answer may be this video from Michael Nesmith. Although it does not address airbags, it does give some insight to the automotive company’s thinking:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pEPxc3RW4js
Hi Eric,
“The mindless unfeeling arrogance is astonishing. The way these apparatchiks glibly, indifferently, toy with other people’s lives, like chess men on a board.”
These apparatchiks knew that properly functioning airbags would injure and kill children and small adults. They were afraid that divulging this knowledge would delay or destroy public acceptance of mandated airbags. The solution: conspire to conceal this information from the public until airbags are fully “mainstreamed”. To them, the loss of other peoples children is a lamentable, but necessary, “cost” of imposing their vision of the “greater good” on society.
Those who make such calculations, and those who justify them, are sociopaths. When will we realize that granting a monopoly privilege of legal violence to those who seek power and control, is a really bad idea.
If you haven’t already, please watch this amazing speech by Robert Higgs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RILDjo4EXV8
Kind Regards,
Jeremy
“When will we realize that granting a monopoly privilege of legal violence to those who seek power and control, is a really bad idea.”
Who said WE granted them that monopoly? The Declaration of Independence says “the consent of the governed.” Do you know anyone (other than Clover) who consented to this? (I started to say, ‘this BS’ but BS is at least useful as fertilizer. This type of stuff is worthless at best, and often harmful.)
Hi PTB,
I agree with you that nobody has given meaningful consent to being ruled by government. However, I did not say that “we” have granted a monopoly privilege on force to government (government has granted this privilege to itself). I asked when will “we” realize that such a grant is a bad idea. The accepted definition of government is that entity which exercises a monopoly of legal force in a given geographical area. Unfortunately, most people think that government so conceived is necessary and valid. I do not (nor do you). I was merely lamenting the fact that most people don’t see the absurdity.
Kind Regards,
Jeremy
Point taken Jeremy. Thanks for the clarification.
I was seriously considering the removal of the in-dash explosive devices from my 1997 Miata. Now I’m even more convinced it’s the right thing to do. A nice aftermarket steering wheel would be in order and I’m sure the passenger side cavity would make some nice additional storage space with a custom Walnut lid. It’s either that or maybe I should just wear my Shoei X-12 with the shield down whenever I’m driving. At least the helmet would actually do what it’s intended to when it’s intended to do it and maybe save my eyes and face in an airbag deployment. Personally, I think removing the infernal SRS dashboard bombs is the best route though.
Is the electrical resistance of all airbags the same?
When disconnecting airbags, use a potentiometer in its place in order to determine the resistance value needed.
Adjust the potentiometer until the airbag light goes out. measure the resistance of the potentiometer at that point. Obtain the same value of resistor. There you have it.
P. S.. If the resistance value is not of a standard resistor, a custom resistor value can be obtained by using a carbon film resistor of a lower resistance and using a triangular file (filing into the resistor) to obtain the required value.
Disabling airbags is not a crime…
Can’t the resistance of the airbag be measured first and then a resistor put in its place? That would save going through a number of pots considering they start and end at largely differing values.
NO!!!! ABSOLUTELY NOT. The voltage from the meter will set off the airbag…..NEVER put anything across the terminals of the airbag…….
My voltmeter (9V internal battery) measures:
2000,000 Ohms output at 0.31V
200,000 Ohms output at 0.56V
20,000 Ohms output at 0.61V
2000 Ohms output at 3.07V
200 Ohms output at 3.08V
You sure 3V is enough to set off the voltmeter? How does the car airbag sensing module measure the resistance?
*set off the airbag.. silly me..
YES!!!! 3 volts IS enough to set off the airbag….PLEASE!!!! don’t do it.
As to potentiometers, a 1 MEG potentiometer should be good to measure the resistance however a 100K or 250K pot would work as well…
That’s the info I wanted. A 1Meg pot. But I doubt 0.31V would be enough to set it off so just use the highest scale. The deployment system is set up so that false signals won’t fire the thing. It should require more than 0.31V @ 50ma..
If you choose to disregard my advice, you do so at your own risk. You should NEVER introduce any electrical voltage into an airbag…use the potentiometer method instead.
Regards
Natch. But maybe check across the connection terminals to see what voltage the deployment circuit is putting through it. Then we’ll know for sure.
Best to err on the side of caution. Treat an airbag the same way you would treat a blasting cap or a stick of dynamite. Connect even a low voltage across it? No thanks!
Thank You, anarchyst!
Thank You.
Thank You.
Thank You, Mang.
It seems that you know what I don’t.
Or, failed to learn.
Pan. Pan. Pan.
‘Shot Down in Flames’ AC/DC
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZ2YJm03Oqc&feature=related
I have an ’03 Corolla that’s on the recall list; I was able to find the connector for the driver and passenger airbag (with a little help from the shop manual diagrams) and unplug them both. So far no idiot malfunction light, probably because the connector is under the dash and goes directly to the explosive. It’s only 2 wires and looks like it gets 12 volts from the module to set it off. If it does show up as an error when I have to go for the state inspection scam sticker I can just plug it back in for the test and remove the instant I get back home.
Boothe, recently while “driving” my rig on a job delivering rock to a RR right of way, the incompetent job boss did nothing to ameliorate the roughness of the terrain and everybody and their trucks were getting beat to shit all day. The center of the old Volvo’s steering wheel fell off into my lap a couple weeks later. As I suspected, it was an airbag with horn activation in it(I don’t explain, just relate). Since it was in my lap and I was busy steering I let it lie till I could inspect what the hell was going on. Well, there it was, a plug, unplugged but the horn ring(typical setup)was intact so I just stuck it back on. Now I’m less paranoid knowing the airbag can’t go off……and believe it or not, even nanny the most, Volvo, didn’t have a code show up for disconnection. Wonders never cease.
When airbags were first introduced, there was a film of them inflating at low speed (made with a high-speed camera). This led the customers to believing that if they were in a crash, their heads would be gently cradled in a pillow of air. So soft and comfy!
The reality is that they inflate with the speed and violence of a shotgun going off, because Joan Claybrook insisted that they protect an unbelted adult male. In order to do that, they had to fully inflate in milliseconds, which required what is basically a rocket engine be used to generate enough gas, fast enough.
I’m sure that the engineers warned Joan Claybitch about the laws of physics involved trying to stop a human body from 55mph in 4 feet. But bureaucrats don’t like laws and simply rewrite them. At least technology advanced to the point where we have two-stage airbags, seat position sensors for short people and seat weigh cells for light people.
But no five-point harnesses because saving your own life just takes too long sometimes when your in a hurry to get your Grande-Supreme Latte trice sprinkled with cinnamon and a splash of nutmeg when your late for your Pilates class.
I like to think that this is the gub’ment making sure we live long enough to pay our-fair-share of taxes. After all, dead people don’t pay…they only vote.
“dead people don’t pay…they only vote.”
Sad but true, esp. in Chi-town. Vote early and vote often. It’s worked at the local level for a long time. It’s worked at the national level at least since 1960.
Airbags were something the automakers offered in the early 1970s and then learned some vital lessons about. The bureaucrats who think they know what’s best for us fought to have these installed in cars for almost two decades. It’s really the last thing automakers put up a solid publicly visible fight on. With good reason, airbags kill, especially those made to US government standards. (for the unbelted average male)
The bureaucrats were warned. They decided they knew best. They painted the automakers as wanting to kill their customers. When that Tim the enchanter moment arrived shortly after the mandate the bureaucrats scrambled but never admitted fault. This is the reason for the rube goldberg set up of senors and warning lights we have today. They couldn’t admit fault that the unbelted male standard was wrong as the automakers said it was.
I don’t know of any ‘safety’ device that has been as dangerous as airbags. Do the faults outweigh the merits? Depends on how one views society. If we are all livestock then it’s on the economics of the whole (how government decides mandates btw) it is one way, if it is the individual, another.
John Claybrook …..FMITA….what trash
Maybe this is another way in which people will be forced to scrap old cars, thus ‘stimulating’ the economy.
Read an article about two years ago that I relate to my college class. Scenario: you own a creampuff 2002 Corolla (this was the vehicle mentioned in the article). Perfect condition. Value $5K. Maybe you touch off the airbags by grounding the tow hooks a little too hard in a parking lot-after all, it is the holiday season and those close-in parking stalls are getting harder to find so you fight for yours.
The bags go off and do about $5K worth of internal damage to car, bending the instrument panel support beam and tearing up all the “cheap” plastic inside the car. Insurance company totals car, not a scratch on the outside and gives you the $5k minus deductible and with a handshake, sends you off to find another creampuff. Not likely. You settle on a wreck because $5K (minus ded) just doesn’t go as far as it used to.
Can’t happen? I removed a lot of those hooks from Protege’s when I worked at a Mazda dealer in the early 2000’s. This was a recall-look it up. But at least you survived that terrifying crash at 4mph.
What a tragedy. There’s little respect for property creators rights or purchasers rights anymore. It’s all about the ministers of the automotive industrial complex. There’s been car accidents since 1869, and still people are dying. I wonder how many of them have to do with so many bureaurats making their living by perpetuating the crisis?