Putting the Blame Where it Doesn’t Belong

Brent, first off, I didn’t do anything deliberately- but since I am unwilling to search for the post (Not the one you quoted), fine- I will give you that.

Sorry. Let it henceforth be known: “vibrations would continue longer”, not “indefinitely” or “forever”.

This still has absolutely no bearing on your position. It odes not address why the flag is billowing (not “vibrating”).

You’re just knit-picking, as if that will provide sufficient subterfuge to sidetrack the real issues.

It doesn’t.

Hi Eric, the thing that I find so alarming is that way too many people will look at you with that blank stare not because they’ve never heard about bldg. 7, but because they just can’t believe the ramifications of what this all means. There was a time when I could look at the atrocities of Nazi Germany, or Stalin with indignation, but when our own government is pulling this kind of stuff, how are we any different than anyone else who lives under evil tyrannies? When we look at people who left or escaped those situations we admire them, but we now know only too well why everyone else didn’t leave. They just couldn’t accept reality. Too many people have their identities wrapped up in their patriotism. What I see is not just a blank stare, but bewildering fear.

WTC 7 is a huge weak spot. Also not covered is the damage to WTC 3,4,5,and 6. What makes the government story of 7 most absurd is the condition of 3-6 at the end of the day. These buildings took far more damage, suffered larger fires and were still largely standing. They looked like one would expect. This contrast stands above and beyond ‘free-fall speed’ and the WTC7’s unique cantilevered and modifiable structure not acting the way it should have.

People’s scope of concentration is very well managed by hiding these buildings from their awareness.

Good point, Brent!

Even I have no knowledge of any of the details relating to buildings 3-6. -And I’m the guy who was expecting a watershed manufactured crisis right around the turn of the century, and knew from the moment it happened that 911 was it.

eric, some people are so enamored by government they can believe the unbelievable, like my cousin who designed planes. Hired by LM right out of college and worked there till he retired.

Girders from the twin towers knocked off the side of WTC7 and since it was unstable it was a danger to workers so they…..you know “they”….doncha? They pulled it over.

Damn! “they” are miracle workers. If the building had to be taken down hundreds of workers would have worked for months cutting girders and wiring a huge amounthet of explosives to drop it. The whole point of using explosive demolition was because buildings had become so difficult to demolish any other way. I recall watching a fairly small multi story building being demolished for about a year. Dangerous and extremely expensive it was the last building I saw knocked down with cranes and demolition balls.

That damage of nearly the entire side of 7 wasn’t done by flying girders. We only got to see the side post damage. No videos were shown of it taking those hits. That’s because they’d already tried to drop it and something went wrong. Maybe it was damage from girders that caused the explosive demolition to fail. No doubt workers were busting butt to get the whole building to go down. When they thought it was ready then the order was given and it went as it should have in the beginning.

No building such as that has ever fallen and there is no way to pull over a building. Amazing too how “pulling it over ” resulted in its falling into its footprint, just like a well planned explosive demolition would have done.

Let’s just forget air samplers over a huge area had a newly developed explosive showing up. What a bunch of horseshit.

No doubt it’s completely asinine, Ed. I couldn’t agree more. I was presenting their motivation, or “logic”

The quality definitely is far superior today, Teo, but since hoaxes are reliant upon people, there is always the possibility of human error- and if anything, people today are less inteligent and more careless, so screw-ups still abound.

For instance, concerning the “Interantional Space Station”- there have been many screw-ups.
*A background disappears, revealing that it is not a real background, but rather green-screen.

*An object magically appears out of thin air (like in a Bugs Bunny cartoon) when needed by the astro-nut on camera for illustrative purposes.

*Bubbles are seen in the “air” as the astroNOTs are floating around the whatever-they-call-it to illustrate “zero gravity”.

*Images of the earth show cloud formations remaining motionless for 24 hours!

Etc.

Hollywood can do a better job because everyone is working toward achieving a known whole. When it comes to hoaxes, due to the limited number of people involved in the fakery, in order not to spill the beans, if something escapes the attention of one or two people, it gets through.

And it doesn’t even seem to matter, because even when blatant errors are pointed out, the majority of the public will just make excuses/defend them.

We’re dealing with a religion here. The god is the state. Like in the Wizzard Of Oz, no one wants to see the little man behind the curtain; no one wants to admit the priest likes little boys.

I’ve seen the ISS footage so I know what you’re talking about, but I don’t think it’s a matter of a limited number of people They could pay off the whole country to keep a secret quiet; in some respects that’s effectively what they’re doing anyways. People are going to make mistakes, but I think it was something like over 130k people were in on the atom bomb project, yet Japan wasn’t expecting it. When someone starts to get wise, all it takes is a little persuasion; “plata o plomo”? as they say…

8, government propaganda??? I don’t know anything about government LSD other than that they were dosing people with something. I don’t even know what I was dosed with, but I know it was the best stuff I’ve probably ever done. There’s no way it was acid. My best guess is that it was some excellent LSD 25 or maybe some mescaline. I don’t remember getting sick, but then I don’t remember a lot of the trip, just the insane hallucinations that seemed perfectly benign, and my parents wondering what’s going on with junior. Nobody told me it was government LSD. The people with the sugar cubes weren’t even acting like they wanted me to take it. Nobody tried to sell me on the quality of the stuff. I only understood how good it was after I’d dropped a few sheets a dozen years later. All Acid is basically junk. This stuff wasn’t cut with anything. I slept like a baby that night.

Teo, when I say acid I’m speaking of lysergic acid, LSD. I won’t argue the government made it for some years but it wasn’t some secret thing that everybody else didn’t produce. I worked in a lab and considered making it myself but the effort and procurement of certain chemicals plus the fact I’d have had to make it on the sly and I’d have needed to sell it to pay for it kept me from doing it. People able to afford the lab and willing to sell it had been around for awhile.

This group worked in remote SW US and had the ability to make it in amounts that made it profitable to sell via a good tight knit group of distributors.

The main problem was ROI and since it was it was a niche market it was cheap.
There were people who could make it in such quantity they would make large batches for those who wanted to retail it in specific ways but a good lab and competent people could make other things in mass quantities that made a great deal more profit….

8Man and Teo, You two druggies remind me of this old comedy skit:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3j8SJS3nBg

What’s all this about? What’d I miss?

I do my best singing drunk. I gotta have bourbon to hit certain notes and WT makes it fine.

I always got it when Willy said I gotta get drunk and I sure do dread it cause I know just what I’m gonna do.

Thanks Brent, I couldn’t remember what the reasons were for their failure. However, what you point out also spotlights another problem with their meme. Where are all the new regulations that will prevent this from happening in the future? As much as the govment enjoys implementing more regulations, someone really dropped the ball on this one. Is the new Trade Center built to the new and improved government standards? I’ve heard nothing about any new government regulations or standards. If it could happen once..er, three times, should we really take a chance on fires bringing down anymore skyscrapers?

Heh, Teo- probably like the old WTC, which wasn’t even subject to the stringent NYC building codes of the time, because it was constructed by the NY Port Authority. Codes which even the lowliest homeowner would crucified for not following if he neglected even the most petty one.

As usual, “they” are not subject to their own laws- only we are.

Nunzio, it just seems like this glaring glitch in the matrix, or we’ve stepped into some parallel reality where fires bring down skyscrapers and government busy bodies forget how to come up with regulations to deal with it.

You know, Teo, I don’t watch any of the crap that Hollywood puts out- movies, TV, etc. for the last several decades- but from just the occasional glimpses I get of such, I can’t help but to think that that is EXACTLY what people are being programmed to believe- i.e. fires cause explosions, which instantly cause total destruction.

I mean, every time I pass some tele-screen, that seems to be what they are showing- whether it is a car crashing and instantly bursting into flames and exploding (virtually never happens in real life), or a house burning and then suddenly exploding…or a skyscraper….etc. There are constant explosions, and everything collapses, and, voila! Instant destruction!

This is not the way things work in real life….but to those who consume the Hollywood propaganda, this is seen over and over again, and thus becomes the expected outcome.

Just like when they show someone getting shot and falling down from the force of the bullet- LOL.

I used to ask “Why?”- Why the constant theme of explosions and destruction, and the disobeying of the laws ofp hysics. Now I know why: So such will look normal when these things are rigged to occur- because in the majority of cases, that is the only time such scenarios will occur- like with WTC.

The people accept it, because they’ve seen it portrayed over and over again on TV, and they think it’s reality, so they don’t even question it.

“Looks kosher to me! I seen it a million times in the movies, and that’s just the way it happened!”

And if anyone had any doubts as to who the media is working for, or what they are working to accomplish, those doubts should be gone now, since the media’s overt conduct since the last election.

Nunzio, re: grind it up and sell it as Tang? LOL!!! Do they even still sell that stuff anymore? Wasn’t there some other stuff, those tubular chocolate or maybe peanut butter flavored things? I can’t remember what they were called, but I seem to remember that they were supposedly stuff the astronauts ate while they were in space. My favorite all time remark was from The Other Guys when Will Ferrill says he thought he was eating astronaut food, and when he came to his toothpaste tube was empty.

> “Wasn’t there some other stuff, those tubular chocolate or maybe peanut butter flavored things? I can’t remember what they were called, but I seem to remember that they were supposedly stuff the astronauts ate while they were in space. ” <

[In Arnold Horshak voice]Oooo! Oooo! I know what you're talking about! I hadn't thought about those (nor seen them) since I was a kid! I just have a vague memory of them. Now this is going to drive me nuts!!! 🙂 (If Tang and that stuff is what they eat in space….diabetes must be very common there! No! Wait… "no gravity"- so the glucose molecules act differently….except when they don't; like how the believers use Newton's 1st law of physics to explain the "never ending movement of the Earth and heavenly bodies", but then have to deny that law to explain orbits…..

Teo,

“Space Food Sticks”- (I looked it up)

I actually used to like them! (“Folly is bound up in the heart of a child” -Proverbs 22:14)

Nunzio, maybe that’s what NASA called them, but some company began to market something similar. The tag line was something like, “Just like what the astronauts ate in space”. They were like long brown or black crayon sized snacks. They might have been individually wrapped. Not as chewy as a tootsie roll, but not as soft as peanut butter; kinda dry, but pretty good. I liked them.

Teo, That’s what they were called- Pillsbury made ’em. They tasted like what a vegan Slim-Jim might taste like 😉 They were gooood! Google it…that’s exactly what we’re talking about.

Cheer up, 8. Your posts here will live forever in the NSA’s data collection, even if they can’t be found by the Wayback Machine. ;-).

No, they were records of an engineering project and they weren’t thrown away because some engineer (most likely) kept them. Hid them away where the ‘time to clean of the lab/office’ people couldn’t find them.

That’s why they still exist today.

Most valuable pieces of programs like this are only saved because some packrat hid them away somewhere.

That’s how most valuable things in this world made it through ‘the old worthless junk phase’.

How many valuable cars still exist because of car hoarders? Not even collectors, just hoarders?

Someone hid them away from the clunker laws, the beautification programs, and everything else throwitouters do in this society to destroy the past.

What are you babbling about? Government courts ruled decades ago Social Security is a welfare program and FICA a tax.

You do know that there are shredding services right? They take paper away by the truckload. Then there are paper recycling companies. same deal. Same for plastics, metals, electronics, etc.

You act as if you never worked anywhere. But then again when you have to make a conspiracy out the simplistic I assume the daily doings at any decently sized company have to be made into some incredibly impossible thing.

The grocery store I worked at in HS could fill a semi with used cardboard (compressed in compactor) every few weeks.

I am well aware that SS is a welfare program. But yet Uncle maintains everything from it’s initial legislation, to it’s court decisions, to individual records.

In gov’r, people come and go- but the only thing that keeps gov’t “alive” is it’s records of past events.

No, I never have worked for a large corp or gov’t. Never would.

But I can tell you, when my mother who was born in 1925 needed a copy of her birth certificate, she went down to Center St. in NYC. (in the ’90’s) and got it!

Gov’t essentially takes the position that if no record exists of something, then it didn’t happen.

Pay their tax and the IRS can’t find the record of it and you don’t have the receipt? It never happened; you’ll pay it again!

CIA dealing drugs? Find the paperwork proving it, or it never happened!

You are the one who is trying to prove something for which virtually no evidence exists, other than TV shows and hearsay.

Most of the eyewitnesses are now dead, and when they were alive, were mum about it (Funny, you’d think they would have had diarrhea of the mouth!); the supposed physical records/evidence is thrown away….so all you are left with is official gov’t claims and the notions in the minds of people who believe those claims; the same people who believed that Saddam had WMDs, and that the WTC was brought down by a plane crashing into it; and that Syria “gassed children”. Talk about clovers! It’s all a part of the popular mythology created to keep the majority happily laboring for and loving Big Brother. And the engineers who worked for NASA were duped just as badly as everyone else- only, they seemed not to have minded working for imported Nazis….

Why do you assume I think the government put men on the moon? I think a bunch of hardworking engineers put men on the moon in spite of the government. They got the money to do so because of the cold war and because LBJ had JFK’s head blown apart and now needed to honor his vision so people wouldn’t look too hard at him.

I know where the term conspiracy theory came from and I use it many forms, and here it fits. I don’t believe everything people tell me just because it’s anti-government.

I wouldn’t even believe Tony Heller until I repeated some of what he had done for myself. Now I tell everyone who will listen about how the temperature record is being modified. But before I did that it had to pass my own tests. Your moon hoax doesn’t pass because everything that is claimed to be evidence of the hoax fits in with what I know would be for being on the moon.

All you have to do is provide convincing evidence of a hoax that actually fits with what I know about the physical universe. Yet, that doesn’t happen.

“Hey Vern! What’s these boxes that say “Apollo” on them?”

“A-Pollo…hmmm… Ah, must belong to that Greek guy who used to work in maintenance. Might as well throw ’em out.”

Whatever, Brent. I fail to give a shit what you believe. You’ve gone completely insane with this shit at this point.

You and you guvengineerluv are more than I can bear.

Once again Nunzio, if you have to resort to behaving like Clover, you’ve lost the debate.

You’re behaving like Clover. It’s even more despicable coming from you, because you know better.

Errrr, Brent? I’m not the one trying to support a claim made by Big Brother, for which virtually all of the supporting evidence is MIA and then saying “You prove we didn’t do it!…..

That’s like a pig demanding to see your ID so he can prove that there are no active warrants for you…..

Nunzio, Brent is calling us a couple of “clovers” now and claiming that there was some debate going on that he won by default for some reason.

The guy has lost his marbles, apparently. I always knew he was a dogmatic know it all who is over-impressed with his own credentials, but I never expected him to melt down this way defending some government fraud.

Ed,

Brent is showing the classic signs of someone who is in denial.

The excuses he is making in order to justify something which he obviously cherishes and which illusion he can not bear to give up.

It is sad to see an otherwise intelligent man acting this way. I wish that it weren’t so.

I think ultimately though, he will come around, because he HAS to realize just how far he has gone in trying to make excuses for and justifying something which, if real, should not need such excuses/justification.

Sadly, I think Brent’s words here have done more to expose the fraud of NASA than anything we could say.

It’s like a parent saying of their child” “Well your kid’s face shouldn’t have been in the way of my kid’s fist!”.

The side with the most excuses and absurd claims and no proof to support their beliefs, ends up being seen by all as the one trying to sustain the unsustainable.

Nunzio, re: science propaganda. You’ve probably already read it, but just in case you haven’t.

http://www.vedicilluminations.com/downloads/Intelligent-Design/the-devils-delusion-atheism-and-its-scientific-pretensions-david-berlinski.pdf

This guy is spot on target with his assessment imo.

There’s also a great debate on youtube where an evolutionist is asked by the moderator to explain her position to Mr. Berlinski. She declines because no one is going to understand what she’s talking about.

Thanks, Teo!

Never even heard of that….but I’m bookmarking it, to read when I have a chance.

HAhahaha, yeah…the old “I’m not going to explain it because you won’t understand it” routine!

It’s funny though- in some ways, it reminds me of years ago, when I used to debate evolutionists and atheists online.

I got to the point where I’d only want to debate with people from academia or “science” who actually at least had a clue as to what the theory they were defending actually postulated….as opposed to most ordinary people, whom I’d first have to educate as to what their own theory said.

And the sad thing is, it’s not their fault that they don’t know (the common people, anyway)- as they are just given a very partial and selective “education” in the matter, and never get to hear the opposition, nor even what the current postulates believe- instead, only what the teachers/professors repeat from recycled out-dated material which is purposely set forth even still in the latest textbooks.

Nunzio, It’s a short read; wont’ take more than a few hours. It’s a great page turner. Berlinski is an atheist with degrees in Mathematics, Philosophy and a few other things so he’s a pretty sharp guy. I also spent a fair amount of time debating atheists and evolutionists, but even those who seemed to understand what they were talking about tended to reply with endless walls of text that could easily be distilled down to simple answers like: “variation varies”. Of course that doesn’t look like it has very much explanatory power so they copy and paste some voluminous wall of text as if that makes it more acceptable.

For a taste of Berlinski’s style check this out: Skip to 8:20 where he gives his opening speech; it’s an accurate assessment, and priceless in his presentation. It concludes in the next video 2/8.

The whole debate is well worth watching.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7gZhksK9Sw

re: Gravity. When people trot out gravity they automatically throw themselves into the ignorant crowd as well. The Kavendish experiement is ludicrous on its face, and there are probably no more than a dozen people on the planet at one time who can begin to comprehend the walls of equations that necessarily accompany the theory. Even Kavendish took his observations through a telescope just so as not to alter them with his own weight acting on the gravitational pull from the suspended balls. I don’t think anyone has ever even bothered to reproduce his experiments; there are just too many variables that could skew the results. This doesn’t make me a “flat earther”. I’m just honest enough to admit I can’t begin to understand trig, or even a few pages of equations that set the stage for the theory’s premise. Watching Tyson drop a mic isn’t much of a proof either.

Teo said “The Kavendish experiement is ludicrous on its face, and there are probably no more than a dozen people on the planet at one time who can begin to comprehend the walls of equations that necessarily accompany the theory”

Ah, yes. The “I can’t comprehend it, therefore it is wrong” argument.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_the_stone

anymouse, re: argument from ignorance. It’s not an argument from ignorance. It’s posers who think they understand it when anyone who is able to grasp even the most rudimentary aspects of it knows you’re delving into Rain Man territory. Go ahead smart guy explain and enlighten us all on the walls of equations that even most physicists will admit makes little sense to them. It’s not an argument from ignorance, it’s an argument that points out you’re full of shit if you think anyone here is going to believe you have a clue how to begin to explain it.

LOL.

You cant even get the name of the logical fallacy correct. It was not ‘argument from ignorance’. I even supplied a link.

Ignorance of ones ignorance, you has it.

BTW, I made no claim to understand, I merely pointed out that your dismissive “Kavendish experiement is ludicrous” was idiotic.

You are claiming understanding (or else how could you claim it is ludicrous) of what you claimed was beyond your own understanding.

Master level arrogance and sanctimony there. Coupled with an obvious comprehension problem.

I supplied evidence, e.g. too many variables. Kavendish admitted that even his own weight could affect his observations. Scientists know that gravity isn’t equal in all places so even the location can twist the results along with trees, rocks, the building the experiment was conducted, etc. Then there’s the apparatus itself as well as the elasticity of what is holding the spheres. The list goes on for days, but of course you’ve already admitted you don’t know what you’re talking about. So you’re just projecting your own ignorance onto others. When those who have studied this admit that it makes no sense, some of us can appreciate that level of honesty. Your transparent attempts at trolling prove only that you’re a wanna-be troll. Well, at least you have a goal. Good luck with that, I’m sure you’ll go far with that on your resume of talents.

Teo said “I supplied evidence, e.g. too many variables. ”

Right. OK, too many.

Why? How does your assertion that there are ‘too many’ discredit it? Specifically.

What knowledge is it that you posses that would even make your claim rational?

Basically, you are appealing to your own opinion, backed by nothing more than your opinion and sanctimonious arrogance..

Teo said “When those who have studied this admit that it makes no sense, some of us can appreciate that level of honesty. ”

Like I said;
The “I can’t comprehend it, therefore it is wrong” argument.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_the_stone

Maybe read the link this time.

OH, and calling someone a troll is usually a sure sign of desperation when one senses they are losing the argument.

Teo,

Re: Gravity.

Buddy, the math doesn’t even matter. In order for math to PROVE anything, certain physical facts must be known and quantified, first.

No such facts exist with any of this BS. It’s all just theory, and all the math does is allow the possibility that their theories could work IF their assumptions/speculations were true.

Math can only express relationships or transliterate variables; it can not prove the reality of theories- only rather that the those theories would maintain integrity IF the the conditions which they describe were in operation.

“Wall of equations”

Teo, it’s ridiculous, anyway. The equations just prove that it *could* work, ASSUMING everything were like they say it is; not that it is reality.

Just like “global warming’- the math works- but the data, suppositions and premises used as input is faulty.

Eric, re: marital assumptions. I was fortunate in never falling in love. I stepped in it a few times, but that was the extent of my misfortunes. It’s sad because one can see how women didn’t have any options other than to stay in a miserable marriage. With their liberation, it’s just assumed they’re going to move on as soon as they brake a nail, or they realize that you will never be able to make them happy. I think others have made this point as well, but even when they talk the talk, most of them are just running a scam, but there’s a very old saying that points out that you can’t cheat an honest man. Nobody is that honest so we have this MGTOW thing going on because the world really is that screwed up.

I see it differently. Not that what you say isn’t true, but there’s something much more sinister lurking that really makes me sick. The gays simply want to be validated by the State just like the idiotic heterosexuals are. How pathetic can it get? I feel like a star bellied Sneech, and one of these days we’re all going to be just like they were after all their money was suckered out of their pockets. But yeah, the lawyers are always going to win when it comes to this nonsense. I predict that within the next ten years people will be marrying their dogs and the dogs will be getting the outlandish divorce settlements. There are going to be all these low life perverts living in their condos because the dog got the mansion, along with a lifetime supply of kibble. The lawyers got the summer house and the place in the Bahamas.

Wow.
And you have the nerve to call me troll…

Don’t flatter yourself. You’ve got a long way to go before you’re anything more than a wanna-be troll. It takes one to know one, but you’re still at that stage where you think talking smack is enough to warrant the title; it isn’t. No, the fact is that you’re hooked, you’ve been trolled and that’s why you keep responding with this nonsense.
———-
Guess…

Yeah, you’re doing a lot of that.
———— admitting that gravity was an appropriate response…

It may even be a correct one, but the point which is obviously lost to you is that it doesn’t answer Nunzio’s question in the slightest. This isn’t the first grade dude. We’re not looking for the correct answer. We’re looking for an explanation to support the correct answer. Were looking for a sufficient answer to Nunzio’s question. Sadly, yours was insufficient.
————- …to Nunzio is just too much for your clearly over-inflated ego to cope with.

My ego can cope just fine, but thanks for noticing that speck in my eye, the 2 c 4 in your own is still not coming up with any explanations for Nunzio’s question.
————
GFY.

Good one. Did you think of that on your own, or did you require help from someone taking the more advanced introduction to wanna-be trolls? Oh, and thanks for letting us all know that you’re frustration has reached the level where all you can do is admit you’ve been hooked by a troll. What you fail to comprehend is that you’re no closer to becoming an actual troll than the child who is suckered into pulling uncle Buck’s finger. You’re still the sucker and yes, it really is your fault.

Hey Nunzio,

Who wouldn’t love the Dead Kennedy’s?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1Ad3oABt-c

Jeremy

Hi Jeremy!

Hey, they’re a lot easier to love than live Kennedys!

(Had to click on your link- this is the first time I’ve ever heard one of their songs- though I’ve been familiar with the name for ages…)

Yeah, us Dagos make good spaghetti and bicycles, but we can’t make guns or cars to save our lives!

Not true, Nunzio. The Carcano is an aberration, while Beretta is the norm. Pininfarina designs are true works of art, as well.

Meh….Penisfarina; Bugatti; Ferrari….they might look good, and perform good (when they actually do run), but seriously, they’re unreliable junk. Just think: FIAT (Which is an acronym for Fix It Again Tony 🙂 ). Heck, when it comes to cars, we may as well be Limeys! (Except us Dagaos can drive ’em!)

Good Morning eric. As a 14year old, already an accomplished reloaded and shootist I smelled the lie right off.

It’s strange I was the only one in the household who knew it was a lie.

Few adults called bs on it through sheer ignorance

So much of what was reported made no sense and it wasn’t like people wanted to hear the rantings of a child. Now hunters sat around and mumbled but since he was prez and popular everyone stayed fairly mum….as they were supposed to.

So many things that were obviously lies were thrown in, the most obvious a bullet just taken out of the Sierra box and dropped on the stretcher, magic bullet as it were.

Then there was John Connolly who survived but became psychologically mute.

Two days later a guy is allowed through a mob of cops and gives the suspect a point blank shot to the gut that most likely wouldn’t have been fatal but the probably took him on a tour of the city in the ambulance ride.

It was too much bs and I think a lot of the public didn’t buy it but like anything else the press was intimidated and in several cases decades later we’d find out, some of them threatened one on one by G(sic)men.

Since that point in my life guvco has been nothing more or less than the enemy.

And I have personally experienced their wrath up close with whispered threats in my ear.

In a private conversation I was told to tell the head honcho what he wanted to hear. I asked why I’d do that. He said the jury of which I knew would never exist, would go easier on me. I laughed with sarcasm and told him to go fuck himself. The next minute didn’t look good for my survival. If only I’d been cuffed in front.

Nope, I won’t be the guy to quote law or anything resembling such. As I said to my neighbor who shot CJ, I have a gun too and it’ll reach out and pick you up and knock you down just like one like it did at Adobe Walls. He didn’t renew his lease, a good thing for both of us.

It sucks that the state would kill anybody, and (as usual) cover it up; and even botch the cover-up, as is their normal modus operandi, being the incompetent fools they are, who rely more on brute force and the willingness of the public to acceopt them as legit….

But the funny thing is: Why everyone holds dead Kennedys in such high esteem; when all we have seen from the surviving Kennedys is radical liberalism, corruption, and debauchery?

Everyone acts like JFK was some kind of saint. He was a Kennedy, no different than any other member of that crime family. His own scandals during his short life proved the real nature of his character; and his own words proved his dedication to statism- “Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country” = serve the state and sacrifice yourself for it!

Ich bein ein putz!

This guy presents some interesting ideas on the JFK assassination:

http://www.veteransnewsnow.com/2013/11/17/230147who-killed-kennedy-cia-lbj-or-the-truly-unspeakable/

Hey eric, When I was in my late teens and early twenties, I spent a lot of time humping furniture for moving and storage companies. One in particular had a government contract with the local air force base, and a LOT of these guys who were coming back from some time in Japan, Vietnam, S. Korea had Japanese, Vietnamese, or Korean wives. This is what a typical move looked like: We’d pull up with a truckload of their stuff in our truck, hand the inventories to the guy, and before we could even get into the load ourselves his wife was up there pulling stuff off the truck and running it into the house. On her way out she was handing him an opened beer, and taking the empty just as he downed the last sip, only to appear with a freshly opened and chilled one a few seconds later. I know two people who have Filipino wives from filipinocupid.com They’re blissfully happy. I thought is was kinda weird at first they’re both in their early to late fifties while their wives are in their mid twenties, but these women are both well trained nurses and were able to get a job almost immediately in hospitals, making really good money. The only thing they want in return is children. With the kind of money they make, it’s a no-brainer if you can handle being married to a woman who makes way more money than you do. I’m not struggling to make ends meet, and not all that desperate to find a wife, but having someone who can keep the house clean, have and take care of children and hold down a job that brings in a second income does look attractive. They’re all Catholic so they’re well educated, and divorce isn’t really part of their vocabulary. I’m not Catholic, but I can overlook that. I might have to check this out myself one of these days…

Children? CATHOLICS?! My Gawd! Do the horrors ever end?!

Thank goodness I love solitude!

(Teo, those moving days must’ve been a long time ago….most of them Asian chicks ain’t like that no more)

Hey Nunzio, Those moving days were almost 40 years ago so things probably have changed since then. For a while I thought I might fit in with the MGTWO crowd, but I’ve never been conned by women. I’ve never lost anything, or had them screw me out of half my net worth. There needs to be a group for men who aren’t so resentful at women who are able to screw them over. A group for men who know how to stand up for themselves without having to worry about whether she runs off with someone else or decides to rake you over the coals for a while. Some of these MGTOW guys are seriously ticked off at women. I guess I don’t blame them, but I also see that you can’t cheat an honest man either. Some people need to get more honest; I know I do, just not enough to keep women from screwing me over. I crossed that bridge a long time ago. I think you’re right though. If you’re going to take a bride from south east Asia, it’s better to find one in some out of the way place that never heard of the US, and probably better to just stay there.

“Hey eric, When I was in my late teens and early twenties, I spent a lot of time humping furniture for moving and storage companies.”

Damn, Teo. I doubt old eric is that hard up. Jeezly crow, are you suggesting he try to hump his recliner over there? Man. I know you’re trying to help but….damn.

Yes Teo, there should be something for the never stupid enough to get taken and not interested in being a PUA group.

MGTOW groups are too dominated by the victim class rather than the men who saw the problems and steered clear of them.

PUA’s are still in the world of ‘man up’ and do whatever it takes. Pay any price. Learn ‘game’, look better, etc etc.

There’s not much for the guys who walked away from a deal that cost too much and delivered too little.

Same here, Teo.

Never been taken by a woman, ’cause I was always seeking one who subscribed to a higher morality, and who held the same Christian and Anarchistic principles as I (Even before I knew the technical name for the latter)- and I never did find such an one.

Got tired of looking, and I figured “Why bother, since I’m very happy being alone?”.

It was more recently that I realized that it wasn’t a matter of finding the “right one”, ’cause the “right one” doesn’t exist.

It’s more a matter of finding one who suits you, AND who knows her place/role. And those don’t exist anymore.

Some give the illusion that they do, but they’ll change when it suits them, because they can, thanks to Uncle and modern Western culture. Even the damn Moozlim women are getting uppity these days.

Now I consider myself VERY fortunate to have never to met what I might have thought was the right one.

And besides, I’d want one who would perpetually stay 18 (or at least her body). They all go to Hell after 35. What the heck do you do with them for the remaining 45 years? I’m not the type to cringe and bear it….and I don’t believe in divorce…or murder 😀

Brent, I think MGTOW is a great idea if these guys can learn to handle women appropriately. If guy can learn how to spot the losers, the takers, the scams, etc. I think a lot of women would straighten up; a win/win for everyone. For the most part it’s just losers hooking up with losers, and then feeling lame because they got screwed over. Having a bitchfest for the rest of one’s life doesn’t seem like the solution I’d go for, but then I can’t really relate to what they’re going through. I’ve had a few women who weren’t interested in treating me with respect, but I didn’t have much of anything invested either. When I was young, I made some mistakes and let a few keepers get away from me; live and learn.

I hope the humped furniture was at least a Queen Anne and not a Lazy Boy!

PUAs shouldn’t be allowed in the MGTOW club. They’re part of the problem. And if they need what women have, then they truly can’t be going their own way.

Brent, I think the problem is, that too many guys in the world never put any thought into it when they were younger.

They just went with the flow; started boming girls; and then just did what the popular songs; other people; etc. told them one does/is expected of them.

It probably wasn’t until they e3nded up cheated on or divorced or, etc. (probably even several times) that they started to realize the true nature of the problem, and that it wasn’t just confined to a few “bad women” whom they had met.

That’s the best thing about MGTOW: It’s causing people to think about these things beforehand and to anticipate and prevent the problems. It’s just that a lot of guys didn’t have that advantage previously, since the advent of the Sexual Revolution and decline of traditional morality.

I think the MGTOW content producers who associate with PUAs are follish. Such ruin the movement. Kinda like Libertarian Party members associating with us. -Different animals.

Nunzio, I have to disagree. PUA’s should be allowed into MGTOW because their only fault is in believing that they’re PUA’s in the first place. I figured this out relatively early. I thought I was all that, a real ladies man until I suddenly realized that she knew I was going to get laid long before I ever had a clue. After a short while, I realized that most women are only interested in me because of my proximity to them. They’re just interested in whoever happens to be around. I’m also not so smart that I couldn’t have gotten snagged by some scam. I just lucked out by not having the best and brightest work me over. The women who tried to scam me weren’t patient enough to get a ring on their finger before running their scams. My saving grace was just dumb luck really.

The best illustration of what’s wrong, and why one can not find an appropriate female:

There are no female “regulars” on this site.

I’ve never been to a socialist forum, but I would bet money that every one of them are dominated by women.

Women, when left to their own devices, always make bad choices.

Morning, Nunzio!

Tell me about it… I tried one of those online dating sites and described myself as a Libertarian, with a quick synopsis of the NAP. You can imagine how many responses I got. Women do appear to love them some socialism, especially the good-looking ones.

Then there are the fat ones, who love to eat.

I see PUAs and MGTOW as two different clubs. The PUAs still have that ‘man up’ programming and have decided to deal with the situation by manipulating the factors they have some control of.

They largely see MGTOW as ‘losers’ who don’t better themselves. Some can tell the difference between the ‘victim’ MGTOW and the men who just walked away only to find there was a name for it.

Of course the PUA’s market analogy can be used back at them as saying that a lot of men have simply left the market because the prices and risks are too high for what is offered.

So it’s more like three separate clubs. Just one doesn’t have a name of its own.

There are no female regulars here because this site has double and triple sorting in a 90/10 ratios or more.

First we have libertarianism, that will remove 90% of women. Then we have automobiles and motorcycles, take off 90% of what remains. Then we often have technical discussion of said machines, take another 90% off what remains at minimum.

So not many are going to pass through all three of those filters by their own voluntary choices.

It’s really scary, Eric.

I mean, it’s bad enough what this country has become under a kind of “soft” collectivism for many years- but now what we are seeing is the newer generations embracing unabashed communism/socialism- which is exactly what one would expect from a matriarchal society, which is what such things as giving women the *right* to vote, and the Sexual Revolution have fostered.

The people of this country (not just the women) are becoming unrecognizable.

We’d better make plans, because we know where this is heading- as if it’s not bad enough already.

Trying to out and find someone new among the current dud crop, just illustrates how truly bad it’s become, and how truly deplorable the character of so many is today.

The women you are encountering are a perfect illustration: They’re like a disposable plastic spork taking the place of what used to be fine silverware.

Very well-said re: MGTOW, Brent.

About lack of females on this site: Meh….even if one goes to a purely political Libertarian forum, they’re still not exactly brimming with goils….much less teens and 20’s girls- while I guarantee you the socialist forums are.

Hey Nunzio, there are a LOT of silly women in this world. The women in the US just don’t seem to be satisfied with whatever they get. I see guys bending over backwards to please their girlfriends, wives, mistresses, and they get nothing for it. Women don’t know it, but they need to be able to look up to a man. They need to respect a man, just like a dog needs to know who’s the dog and who’s the master. Give women the roost and they’ll soon become despondent and so miserable nothing short of taking half your net worth will suffice, and even then they’ll never be happy. A buddy of mine told me about some group he’s really into called “men going there own way” (MGTOW) and according to some of these guys, it all started going down hill when the temperance movement got going. There were all these ugly women who were destined to be spinsters for the rest of their miserable lives so they figured if they could outlaw drinking and prostitution, then some of these women could be married off, but they didn’t want to stop there. Soon they could see that this was a great way to acquire wealth, and today women have caught on to the system and simply marry the alpha male with the money bags and take half his net worth as soon as possible. Beta males get the leftovers and while they may not have deep pockets, the ugly one’s are still getting a pretty good deal. At first glance I thought this was kind of silly, but after a while it kind of makes sense. There are a lot of desperate women out there, and if guys could learn to keep it in their pants, things would improve quite rapidly in our favor.

Here again, a trip to south or central America is an eye opener. The women down there don’t have the same mentality as women in the US. They expect to get the snot beaten out of them if they pop off or get out of line. Up here you just naturally expect their snide remarks as part of the deal.

I’ve been engaged three times, and in the first two cases, neither one was really interested in marrying me. They just wanted to get married and take my stuff. I suggested we attend a marriage encounter. The first one went to one meeting and quit. The second one flat our refused. The third one said she was willing to go, but never found the time.

Any guy that puts up with this nonsense deserves whatever he gets.

[Short reply for now… On way out]

Teo …err….”Annonymous”…

That’s true about women from other places…somewhat.

I know someone here who met a girl in Ecuador, and married her and imported her here. It’s sad though how fast she is Americanizing. (His mistake was bringing her here!). I don’t see the future looking too good for him. I think he’s having regrets already.

Even the Asians… It used to be, you get an Asian wife, you had it made…’specially if you moved to Asia- but even they have seriously Westernized. Ones that come here want EVERYTHING that money can buy. There are even videos on Youtube telling them what they have to do to satisfy the legal requirements to be eligible for alimony and stuff, and how to snag and then divorce the best prospects. Even in Asia- there’s a famous Youtube vlogger who moved to Taiwan and married a local girl and had a kid with her. What a total BITCH she turned out to be.

Yeah…MGTOW- that’s me! I’ve been a MGTOWer for half of my life….just never knew until recently that there was a movement and that it had a name! (I’m always way ahead of my time).

Opposites attract they say.

Some times you need a good love song.

Long Song
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSw2MfEGK7I

I think the BEST thing about MGTOW is that it is warning warning the young’uns about the nature of today’s women, and what the risks are if they decide to get one.

I mean, back when I was still looking, I thought if I just found the right one, it’d be great. (Luckily, I’m VERY fussy when it comes to women- both as far as looks and worldview- so my chances were pretty much nil anyway)- but I didn’t know the dangers- especially the legal dangers. I didn’t know that even if she’d cheat and or leave me for no good reason, she’d still get my stuff, etc. I didn’t know that if they so much as CLAIM “domestic abuse”, some goes to jail…someone gets out of the house, etc. (I did know that I’d go to jail for life after I’d kill her for calling the cops on me…).

Thanks to MGTOW, the young guys now have a clue as to what to expect, and many are seeing that it’s a bum deal, and in no way worth it.

Nunzio said “The very idea of space even being a vacuum is contrary to the laws of physics. If it were a vacuum, our atmosphere would be sucked off….of the earth. You can’t have a vacuum without anything in which to contain it”

Not even worth trying to argue with that level of arrogant ignorance.

GRAVITY.

Amazing that those who know the least assume they are the most informed.

Dunning and Kruger wrote about you.

“Perpetual motion” Where is your proof that the flag is still shaking?

Hi Nuzio
You’re correct in stating that space can not be a vacuum, and it’s not. On earth we have atmospheric pressure and it’s measured in various ways. A one square inch column of air from the top of the atmosphere to the ground at sea level has a force of 14.7 psi, 101.325 kPa, 1013.25 mb, etc. With that in mind, whatever instrument you use here on earth to read atmospheric pressure will read “zero” in space. Space has neither pressure or vacuum, except maybe a black hole, that might be a vacuum?

Anymouse,

Gravity. Another pile of BS. A theory invented to explain another presupposition. Nilola Tesla knew it was BS, and so do I (Must be something about us Eye-talians).

Gravity- supposedly moves the oceans…but can’t move a lake or a little pond. Gravity- which keeps the water in the oceans to the tune of thousands of pounds per square inch in the deepest recesses of the sea, and yet allows the delicate helium balloon to float gracefully off into the sky, somehow immune to the forces of “gravity”.

Buoyancy and density is much simpler and makes much more sense.

I’m really amazed that on a site which is Libertarian/anarchistic, so many buy into and even defend the government BS with which we’ve been indoctrinated.

Are you guys new or something? What’s next? Defending “Global Warming”
? Why not…it’s based on the same “science” and the evidence all comes from the same place; -o why not quote that BS as fact and say “disprove it” to the naysayers?

JohnnyDOH,

Not sure who you’re replying to- but re: “Perpetual motion”.

It was Brent’s assertion that the flag in the Moon landing pic is billowing because because of amplified vibrations caused by pounding the pole into the ground.

He maintains that not only could such billowing be caused by such vibrations, but that they would perpetuate themselves long enough for the dude in the Halloween costume to walk a few feet away and have his pic taken.

He asserts that because “space” any movement in the flag would continue for who-knows-how-long, or maybe forever. -Thus, he thinks the conditions in space can facilitate perpetual motion.

I maintain that the pic was taken on earth, and the wind was blowing.

Just to clarify.

“amplified vibrations”

Seriously, if you have to distort everything I write to the point where it is the opposite of what I wrote, then you have no argument.

I wrote that the vibration was excited and then dampened through the material itself and did so roughly a half dozen times. How does that get changed to “amplified” except through deliberate dishonesty?

“who-knows-how-long, or maybe forever.”

Again, more deliberate dishonesty. Do you know what dampened means? Of course you do. So how does that become forever?

I haven’t seen posting like this here since before Clover left.

Materials do not vibrate forever. The energy is dampened by the material itself. I supposed typing it eight times won’t register any better than six when its being deliberately ignored.

‘Zactly, 8.

I’ll defend my property; my loved ones (including the animals); and my neighbors; and count those who have no regard for the lives or property of others as my enemies…..but I’m not doing those things as a mercenary for hire.

Do it ’cause it’s right; ’cause your conscience would convict you if you didn’t, but not because your loyalty is bought with a check.

I don’t care so much about the life of someone who has no respect for the property of others, because ultimately, they have no respect for the lives of others, since we can not exist without property- so iffin’ I catch someone coming through my window one night…he’s going horizontal and ending up in the sink hole….no questions asked- no waiting to see if he possesses lethal force- he should have thought of such risks before he took action.

But I ain’t risking my life (and would be very reluctant to take someone else’s) for the price of a few Big Macs.

I should rephrase that, a hollow rigid bar. I am too used to referring to the alternatives to cables as solid.

Pole, wire, it doesn’t matter! Twisting the pole doesn’t make the flag billow- wind does. Twisting of the pole would affect the flag even LESS when the top of the flag is stiffened.

And any little ripples which may have been caused by twisting/pounding/nuking the pole, would have subsided faster than a boner after looking at a picture of Ruth Buzzi -almost instantaneously.

Nunzio, the way the flag looked with the stretcher at the top to hold it out looked fake anyway. I wondered why you even mentioned it, but now I see.

It’s a very subtle way of leading a believer into further contortions. Trolling believers is one of my favorite pastimes. It doesn’t work well on a discussion setup like this one though.

I quickly tire of having to scroll up to look for a reply icon, especially since that annoying fucking donate bar at the top expands so that I have to scroll half again as far.

This siteware is the biggest discussion killer since Disqus. I can only participate here for a few days before the siteware drives me away.

In a vacuum the movement does not stop instantly or even quickly. All that is there to dampen the movement is the material itself. No air resistance. The movement I see is consistent with that.

So proving hoax means finding the 1960s vacuum chamber big enough to film this in.

Ed, actually I wasn’t the one who first brought up the flag stiffener. Thsi discussion is the first I’ve heard of it (I’m really not into this stuff)- I think Teo had first mentioned it, and then Brent ran with it, seemingly to distract from the fact that that flag is blowing in the wind!

Funny thing is: I had initially thought that that photo was a spoof. It looks so phony- I was goingv to post it to see if Brent would fall for it…but a little clicking, and I find out that it’s an official image!!! 😮

Notice for example how the light is coming from the left, as can be seen by the shadow cast by the erector set (landing module) and the astro-nut…..but yet, the flagpole casts no shadow, and the flag is PERFECTLY illuminated with what can only be fill lighting (I’ve been into photography since I was a kid…).

Yeah….scrolling to find the reply button! I guess this site really isn’t meant to be a forum- just a place to comment on Eric’s articles. We’re kinda using it for something for which it was not intended. A small price to pay though, considering the quality of the clientèle! 🙂

You don’t like Disqus though? Heck, I wish this were Disqus instead of Turdpress!

We know exactly what a flag looks like on the moon. They made a video of the flag they put up on the moon.

Re: flag waving on the moon. I haven’t looked at this footage in years. I think the last time I looked at it was when MTV came on cable television. Even though it looks kind of silly, it looks real to me. I don’t see how they could get that flag to wave up or curve and just kind of hang there like that. If they were shooting it from earth I think there would have been some sort of bend in the pole planted in the ground. The ripples that seem frozen at times don’t look like what you would see on earth either. I don’t see how they could know what it would look like or how it would react in that environment. I suppose they could just make it look foreign or weird and that would be enough. The flag doesn’t seem to be waving except when someone has a hand on the flag pole, or shortly after they’ve taken their hands off it. I looked at a few videos. I think they did a pretty good job of faking it if it is a fake. At first I though the idea of building a big vacuum chamber seemed a bit far fetched, but I think they would have had to do that to pull this off. I just don’t see them building such a thing.

I didn’t ‘run with it’ The support rod is a known fact and always was. It’s obvious. I could see the support rod was there when I first saw the films of it as a child.

There’s no wind either. It’s the flag slowly coming to a stop after someone acted on it. There’s video of a controlled experiment in this regard on you tube if you want to see. Done in a vacuum chamber.

And again Sun, earth reflecting sun light, albedo of the moon’s surface.

And space isn’t an absolutely perfect vacuum but for an engineering approximation it is.

Brent,

You are overlooking the obvious:

a0There would be (on the Moon) nothing to make that flag billow like that. Vibrations from pounding in the pole would not magically be amplified into billows. Even if they went on forever, they would not become greater than what they started out as- But there is no evidence that even little ripples would go on extra long or forever, because other physical phenomena that we saw “on the Moon”- such as hitting the golf ball, behaved in a manned that obeyed the normal laws of physics just like in reality…I mean on earth.

b)There need not be a vacuum chamber to effect a hoax. The very evidence for a hoax, is that conditions in the photos and videos appear to be exactly the same as they indeed are on earth…because they were on earth.

In the case of the flag….the wind was just blowing!

In fact the only thing I remember about the Moon escapades that appeared different than normal earth physics, was when the man in the halloween costume ran and jumped- which, if you watch a slow motion video of someone running and jumping, looks identical, because that’s all it was.

I must have typed out a half a dozen times already that the material itself provides dampening. You ignore all that then bring in the claim it would go forever when I simply stated it would go on for longer without air vs. with.

No it’s not as it would be on earth. But since all experiments and evidence that it is not like it would be on earth would be labeled as part of the conspiracy and I’m brainwashed and dumb then what’s the point of continuing?

The flag did no amplify in any film I’ve ever seen and behaved as it should mechanically without air. There is nothing I’ve learned in mechanical and aerospace engineering that makes the movement appear to be on the earth’s surface and in air.

If they were making a fake they would have used two support rods and avoided any issue. But if they were going to the moon then deleting one makes sense.

Nunzio, my patience is getting thin. I try to be nice here even when people use ridicule instead of argument. But you’re pushing the limits.

The challenge still stands, show me something convincing, something I haven’t seen before.

Brent, I don’t mean to ridicule YOU. If any ridicule comes through, it is aimed at the establishment which has perpetrated and promotes the hoax, and their so-called evidence or lack thereof.

My issue is not with you. You seem like a nice enough guy.

I can’t give you any more info than what you’ve probably already seen if you’ve looked into the matter. If you think you can reconcile the contradictions between the evidence and what “they” tell us, than I don’t think that anything I can say will change that.

But just look at that flag blowing in the WIND in that photo! Not even just a breeze; that sucker is BLOWING! Look at that soft glossy black moon dust (your belief, not mine…not ridiculing- just parroting) around the landing module….it is untouched….. but the assho-nut who weighs what, 60 lbs. on the Moon?- makes deep footprints by just taking big boucy steps…..

The flag? That’s your best shot? It’s showing the expected vibration of its structure from the action the astronaut on it. This is what I see when I look at that film.

Mechanical vibration is usually junior or senior level mechanical engineering coursework.

And before you go there air resistance is not required for a vibration to slow down and stop. In fact in a vacuum it keeps going longer once the force input is removed. To stop it is simply the dampening properties of the material itself.

Brent, I think we’re talking about different pictures. I meant this ‘un:

https://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/styles/story_large/public/thumbnails/image/2013/04/03/12/Moon-landing-2.jpg

What am I supposed to be seeing here other than the movement of flag between the time forces stopped being imparted on it until it came to a stop?

Without air resistance the flag will continue to move for a longer period of time than in air because the only thing to dampen it is the material itself.

Set up a Gadsden or Jolly Roger or Confederate flag on a windless day, and see if it EVER looks like that. It just goes limp; immediately. It doesn’t billow. It would go limp before you could walk away from it- you would not have time to get several feet away and have someone snap a pic. At no point would it be…..erect(Is that the correct term? ;o)

Nunzio, I’m not much into these conspiracy theories, but that doesn’t mean we didn’t have the means to fake quite a lot of the moon landing. sewing a metal rod into the top of the flag wouldn’t take much imagination. Is there any footage of the flag buckling laterally? I don’t recall seeing anything of that nature. It really looks like someone just stuck a wire straightened wire hanger along the top seam. Pretty simple way to fake it. The hammer, feather scene also seems a bit far fetched as well. How hard would it be to stick a weight on the end of that feather? People are crazy so I can see why they would bring all this crap with them, then again it also seems like the kind of stuff people would think of as they’re working a scam too.

Teo, it does look like there is some kind of wire or support running horizontally across the top of the flag- but that makes Brent’s argument even more unsustainable.

See the way that flag is billowing? Tain’t supposed to be doing that. If we believe their BS science, there is no atmosphere on the Moon, and thus no wind.

As someone who has spent a good deal of my life doing things that are sensitive to the wind (Not to mention breaking a lot of wind :o) I’d say that that stiffened flag is being pummeled by a good 20MPH wind.

Those billows weren’t caused by “vibrations” as Brent is trying to claim. That’s grasping at straws.

I’m no expert on this stuff myself. Most of ny knowledge on it comes through self inspection and some stuff I learned back in the 90’s.

There are a lot of videos on Youtube these days- one almost three hours long. I may have to find some of the better ones and watch, for a refresher/update.

Back when I was first getting into this, it was rare to find anyone else who was on the same page. Today, they say 10% of Americans don’t believe we went to the Moon; and a much higher percentage of the people are at least skeptical, if not out-right convinced that it was a hoax.

Given the nature of government and the media, and all the other BS they’ve pulled over the years- from false flags (down to this day) to junk science like “Global Warming” and 40 years of ass-backwards dietary “science”, would it be at all surprising?

I mean heck, AFTER the supposed Moon landing, in the 1970’s, they were actually pushing the practice that you should open your house’s windows during a tornado because it would equalize the pressure inside and reduce damage!!! (That was official NOAA preparedness protocol!)- Of course, now the idea is ridiculed, just like transfats… I mean, I realized even as a child then, that if a tornado gets anywhere near your house, your windows are going away ANYWAY! -But that’s just the sort of simple thing that only a bureaucracy can get wrong, despite “research” and “science”….but just 5 years prior to that brilliant idea, they figured out how to go to the Moon…and no one died…. LOL!

No wonder brent feels ridiculed- it’s RIDICULOUS!

The moon flags all have a horizontal support bar at the top. It’s not a secret. They were designed that way intentionally for the moon’s environment without air.

Nunzio, re: flag on the moon. I always thought that straight horizontal flag looked strange, but I can also see how they might think of this before they left, and decide to just reinforce it to keep it upright because of the gravity on the moon would pull it down. The wind argument is a good one, but I’m really not convinced one way or the other. If they can get unmanned capsules to the moon, they can probably get manned ones there as well. The thing that causes me the most doubt is just the sheer idiocy of some of the things they’ve done. From parking their cars beneath the launch vehicle to being unable to launch spy satellites downrange to an atoll, much less even low earth orbit YEARS after supposedly going to the moon. Truth is stranger than fiction though so who knows?

Teo,

The problem is: It’s all built upon suppositions, and believing what “they” say.

Who said we got unmanned capsules to the Moon? “They” did. (The same ones who have taken many BILLIONS of dollars of our wealth, and spread it around to their cronies like horse manure, while at the same time capturing the hearts of 99% of Americans because “We can accomplish this great feat”).

The flag blowing in the wind is just one little thing. There are literally hundreds of other inconsistencies if one really looks into this matter- which ultimately is why they conveniently “lost” all of the original footage/recordings/data/ etc. ….because….back in ’69 there was no internet; no home computers; etc. so NASA was kind of sloppy. Put it on TV, people would “see it with their own eyes and believe it”, and few would notice any details out of place; and the few who might, basically had no voice, other than their network of friends of relatives, who would think they were crazy for doubting the government & the TV.

But NOW….with more knowledge being disseminated; more communication and sharing of information with strangers; graphics software available even for free to the average person which can easily detect and deconstruct manipulated images, etc. – the whoe shooting match starts to look pretty cheesy.

I mean, think about it:

When’s the last time a federal agency did anything that was competent and efficient?

When’s the last time the gov’t told the truth about anything?

When’s the last time those two conditions existed at the same time?

To believe in the Moon landings, one has to believe the government.

If there were no inconsistencies and anomalies, etc. well, it might be more plausible- but when known liars tell you something, and you see evidence that their stories are not straight….

These are the same people who tell us we evolved from rocks.

The same ones who said that eggs and butter and salt were bad.

The same ones who said that the supply of oil in the earth was exhausted in the 1970’s.

The same ones who said that some camel jockeys “hate our freedom” (LOL), and that the black boxes from 911 disintegrated…but the paper passports of all of the “hijackers” survived.

….that a Social Security number would never be used as an identifier…

But the biggest feat they ever purported to accomplish…that was true?

Eduardo!

I hate to say, because I’ve always had a high degree of respect for Brent, but he is acting like someone whose sacred cow is being chased by Ronald McDonald.

He wants me to prove a negative. I posit some facts, like how virtually all the records and data of the Moon mission were “lost”, which of course is an utterly preposterous and absurd thing to have occurred- and Brent takes that personally, as though the ridicule were directed at him. But at least he does “get” how ridiculous the existence of such a fact is.

He wants us to prove that they didn’t go to the Moon…..but yet his evidence for them having gone is all hearsay; because he can’t even appeal to the original source evidence, because it was all “lost”. So he instead appeals to the premise that it may have been possible to go to the Moon- “If what they tell us about space is true, I think it was entirely possible with the technology available at the time that we could have gone- ergo, we went” seems to be what he is saying. But of course, the very organization which supposedly accomplished that feat, admits that it will take them at least another 10 years before they can figure out what they knew in 1969 to be able to do it again….

And then there’s the “They saw something so terrible, they packed up and came home and never went back and don’t want anyone to know” theory….which in itself is an admission that “they” lie- assuming such a scenario were indeed true. So those who appeal to that argument find themselves in the position of defending those whom they admit lie/omit truth/are deceptive- but they want us to believe what the liars say; the liars who lost all record of the single most expensive and ambitious undertaking of human endeavor in the history of the world.

But they see nothing wrong with this, like a Hindu sees nothing wrong with his god sauntering through the streets of New Delhi with flies buzzing around it.

I’ve had about enough of this ridiculous behavior from you two.

You both claim a hoax occurred. Prove a hoax occurred. That’s what I asked you. To prove a positive, that hoax occurred.

Don’t project your behavior on me. You’re running around as if your sacred cow was attacked.

Instead of proving your assertion that a hoax occurred. you do all the usual behaviors of people who’s religion has been questioned. You respond with ridicule and word twisting. Prove a hoax or not. Ball is in your court.

Brent, the only way one proves that something is a hoax, is to discredit the evidence which is used to substantiate the claims that the event really happened. That is exactly what ed and i are doing here.

How else does one prove that something is a hoax or didn’t occur???

Prove hoax happened. Present the people, the boom mic caught in the shot. The sound stage. Some HAM intercepting ground transmission. The filming locations. Something. There’s lots of things done to produce a hoax especially a big one.

Furthermore you haven’t discredited evidence. You’ve relied entirely on ridicule. I present something that explains where the hoaxers went wrong and you ridicule saying I am holding on to statist beliefs and what not.

The best you’ve done is the waving flag which looks exactly the way I would expect it to look given the forces imparted to it by the guy installing it.

Brent, just think: EVERYTHING you are relying on for your belief in the reality of the Moon landing, is based entirely upon “What they say”.

Every iota of so-called “proof” comes from either a government agency, or someone in their employ, or the media.

Thus far, you have dismissed anything which exposes any inconsistencies in the evidence which “they” produce; and your only appeal is (and can only be) to material which the state and it’s privileged few manufacture.

Mentioning the “eclipse” just shows how much you’ve swallowed the hoax, hook, line, and sinker. It is specious nonsense.

Anyone who has taken more than a cursory look at this “eclipse” hoax knows that the moon is only 70 miles wide and is made of green cheese. How can that possibly blot out the sun, which is nearly 200 miles wide? Not to mention all that cheese would melt! It’s obvious to anyone with any kind of sense who actually thinks about it instead of mindlessly swallowing the propaganda.

What is actually happening during these so-called “eclipses” is that a giant mutant space goat is eating the sun. The PTB came up with this crazy story about the “moon” blotting out the “sun” to prevent panic amongst the plebes.

Those in the know bang loud drums and shout invectives to the sky in order to drive the mutant space goat away and save the sun from being devoured.

Remember, don’t let them fool you, it’s turtles all the way down.

Hi Jason,

Hxtlopochtli advises me to cut out the beating heart of a young virgin (such a waste!) to assure the sun reappears!

Eric,

Yes, the tried and true methods are always the best! Don’t let the “eclipse” hoaxsters fool you. We must save the sun from being eaten or it is doom for us all! We are preparing for the Hxtlopochtli ceremony, though in these malevolent times virgins are in short supply.

Some naysayers will tell you, “So what, we still have the sun at the center of the earth.” That is Dero propaganda. The sun at the center of the earth will not support life on the earth’s surface.

Hi Nunzio – and others on the Moon thread:

Had some complaints about too much off-the-beaten path stuff; maybe back to car stuff and related political stuff?

RE: unrelated moon threads. It’s kind of ironic how much it is related to this article. I was just thinking how we think we’re misplacing blame when we tell the automobile manufacturers to pay for this mess, but even though they’re the one’s putting these things into their cars, they’re only doing it at the behest of regulators, clovers etc. However, there is a certain level of competition between auto manufacturers and if they can get some safety device developed and on their cars before the competition AND get it mandated, they can save a bundle while the competition scrambles and wastes lots of money trying to catch up. It’s an old scam.

There was some guy who, long before the big three were struggling for a handout; discovered that these American auto manufacturers were really building junk compared to what the foreign auto manufacturers were building, especially from Japan. He went to all three and held up just the rod assembly that connects to the piston for comparison. The big three rod piston assemblies were bulky and rough while the one’s from Toyota, Nissan etc. were like works of art; polished and quite aesthetically pleasing, not to mention better built and more resilient. They all told this guy to go pound sand. It was just a few years later that they were all flying into Washington in their private jets to beg for money to bail them out.

What about these new regulations they’re trying to get through to outlaw working on your car? They don’t even want you to change your oil anymore. Who benefits? Don’t the automobile dealers get more work if these regulations get through. No one even has to vote on this stuff because they’re just regulations. They just make it the law of the land by divine fiat. They don’t want to allow you to make any changes to your cars exhaust system even if you’re planning on only driving it on a racetrack. How or where do they come up with this nonsense? How do they get away with it? Where will it stop? Maybe it started with, “If they can put a man on the moon…”

There are lots of ways to make that thread relevant, but the hoax stuff does get old after a while. It’s just too depressing to think about sometimes. I just keep thinking about getting rid of my junk so I can take one last trip out of here. Every time I come back I wonder if maybe I should have stayed out this last time. Will I be able to leave this time?

But what about that buggy they drove on the moon, looks like it has the same wheel base of a jeep to me…

Eric, who was complaining; the ones who were losing? 😉

O-K, o-k…just as well. Everyone has their belief, and neither side is going to convince the other, anway.

So… I wonder how many charging stations there were on the Moon for that battery-powered LRV? 😉 [Har-har!]

What Teo says!

I think the Moon hoaz subject is perfectly compatible with both this article, and Libertarianism/anarchy in general, as it really sheds light on who or what one ultimately believes and trusts.

I was genuinely shocked to see that on a site like this, we have so many who believe in something for which the only proof comes from the organization (gov’t) which they believe should not even exist; and where they must accept that organization’s word for virtually all evidence in the matter- which would be bad enough of itself; but is even more egregious considering that we ALL know the fiendish character of that organization; that they lie and perpetrate frauds and hoaxes perpetually.

O-K…that is all on the subject.

Hey eric, Chile is the best place to go for work. You can fly down there and in less than 48 hours you can be working for someone from England, New Zealand, etc. You can open your own business too. They don’t have all the regulations we’re so accustomed to here. The same thing goes for the amount of money you’ll need to live in central or south America. The catch is that your main dwelling needs to be down there while you’re travel trailer is up here. If all your expenses are down there and all your income is made up here, you kinda get the best of both worlds. This is what all these migrant workers from down south are doing. They come up here with nothing, make money and send it down south where it’s still worth something. This is key because when the dollar collapses, the game is over so one the essential idea here is to have something established down south before that happens. I spent years working along side people from Mexico and south America who weren’t making more than $8 to 10. an hour. One guy would fly home each year for about three months. He showed me pictures of his family and home. He was living in a mansion with a million dollar view of the Pacific ocean. He was living in a 20′ travel trailer up here for 8 or 9 months out of the year. Migrant farm workers come up here with nothing and go home with nothing as well, except a wad of cash to buy themselves a house when they get there. They live pretty well for what they’re able to save up in just a season of picking fruit and vegetables. Central and south America are packed with US veterans who can’t afford to live here on what uncle Sam provides them for losing limbs for this thankless country. Health care is a pretty good deal down there so they get the treatment they need and can afford. The same holds true for south east Asia as well. So you can take that $100k you would have spent on health care and use it for something else like renting rooms in your houses or apartments to other expats looking for a nice place to stay, etc.

Hey Nunzio, Yes, most countries require some form of income OR you can buy some property/invest. Most of the people I know just get tourist visas and renew them. Most do the snowbird deal, but those are the one’s who end up staying after a short while.

I wouldn’t think of crossing the Atlantic in my boat, but even crossing over to the Bahamas can be pretty treacherous. My last crossing back to Florida had to be cancelled almost halfway across. I couldn’t find a lanyard, and I’d already had a couple of close calls going overboard. My worst fear is sloshing around in the ocean as I watch my boat sail away without me. I’ve also missed the island by a good 15 miles due to a faulty gps. When the distances become greater the likelihood of missing an island increases as well. They look so close together on the map.

If you felt the need to buy a car with all the smog crap on it, then that might cost a bit more down there, but why do that when there are so many other great cars without all that crap?

Boat maintenance doesn’t have to be that expensive. If you feel the need to have a lot of fancy stuff on your boat, then it’s going to be expensive. Mooring lines aren’t much either. The last few places I’ve been to were dirt cheap. The Bahamas let me in for $150.00 which included four fishing permits, two return trips, and the duration was six months, and was renewable. The Virgin Islands charges #100.00 a year to anchor out. Most places don’t charge anything to anchor out. Living on a boat is one of the cheapest ways to live, and it isn’t frowned upon like living in a camper, or travel trailer in a walmart parking lot.

I had a 40′ wood plank fishing boat years ago that would sometimes leak as much as 1,000 gallons an hour. It sank at least half a dozen times while I owned it. Sometimes it only took a few hours to get it sealed up enough to where I could forget about it for a few months at a time without worrying about it sinking. That one was the exception to the rule. I knew what I was getting into so it wasn’t like I was even bothered by it sinking. i didn’t have anything in it of any value anyways. Some people see some water in the bilge and they freak out, but they all have a little water in the bilge from time to time. When you can hear it gushing in is when you need to walk away.

Some people have this motto that if you’re going to do something do it right, but when you pick up some old wreck for nothing, there are a lot of ways to keep it floating without spending much energy, time, or money. Fiberglass boats can blister and seep water for years before they need any real attention. I’ve seen people take foam and stuff it into the bilges of really nice looking boats because the hull is rotted to the core. Repairs just aren’t worth it. I knew one guy who used to just throw sawdust at the seams of his boat. The water rushing in would carry the sawdust into the seems and plug the holes. Shrimpers used to haul their boats out and staple a few layers of chicken wire to the hull (just from the water line down), then slap some cement over it and the hull was good for another 10 to 15 years. That’s 10 to 15 years of working that boat hard; not just cruising around on vacation. Sure cement is heavy and backbreaking work, but down in Guatemala you can pay a few guys a few dollars a day to do the job for you.

Hey Eric, Fortunately, I can’t relate to the divorce issue. I’ve been engaged a few times, but in the end it seems more efficient to just find someone I don’t like and give them half my net worth.

I’ve got dogs I take with me, but cats are another story.

We all have our boiling point so there’s no sense even thinking about it all that much if you’re content with your living situation.

I think I was only about 6 or 7 when I first watched The Sound of Music, but it had a profound effect over me. I couldn’t understand why the Von Trapps didn’t beat a trail out of there after the Nazi’s showed up. As I”ve aged I see how much one’s love for their home can effect one’s thinking, feelings, emotions etc. However, when Jews who escaped the Holocaust start saying that they’re thinking of beating a trail out of the US because they’re getting this sick dejavu feeling all over again, it might be time to rethink things. We’re not there yet, but the writing is on the wall.

Damn, I wanna go to Pitcairn! (I wonder if you can buy more land though? I want more than a “plot”…plots are for the dead! …and NYers as if there’s a difference))

Nunzio, re: “freer and better than here. ”
Nicaragua may still offer the biggest bang for your buck if you’re looking to buy real estate, and a lot of these countries don’t require you to become a citizen to buy property, but a second passport is nice to have.

There are less than 20 countries left in the world today that still don’t have property taxes. My short list (because of climate) is the Cayman Islands, Dominica, Turks and Caicos, Cook Islands, and Fiji. The Cayman Islands have never had property taxes, and probably never will. When you buy a place there, you really own it. Columbia, Costa Rica, Ecuador and Nicaragua have taxes but they’re very low.

Ah! Fiji Islands is a definite place of interest to me. Didn’t know that they didn’t have property taxes! Fiji just moved way up on my list!

Thanks, Teo!

I wonder about places like Nicaragua- Ya really have to experience places to know (And I’m getting too old to spend a lot of time traveling around and exploring…I just want to GO!)- ’cause I’d see immigrants from such places back when I lived in NY- and to see what they were willing to tolerate in NY, made me wonder just how bad they may’ve had it in their former countries! I mean, if they think they’re living the life living in a row-house under the elevated train and working 14 hours a day to afford it, and still having to live with 3 other families, in a place where it’s illegal to put a “for sale” sign in your car window….

There is nothing impossible about the moon landing with 1960s technology and acceptable risk levels.

Today it is impossible because of the safety cult.

Pick up a photography book called “Full Moon”. I have a copy. From here all the moon hoax stuff falls apart.

The Soviet Union had the capability to know the moon landing happened. If it didn’t they would have made it known. If they for some reason did not it would have turned up in the soviet archives by now.

I have a declassified 1960s air force book called the “Space Planners Guide”. It’s a very interesting look at the mentality of the time. (I thought I had something special but then copies started appearing on Ebay)

What I believe brings about all the secrecy is the nature of government and what they found or saw on the moon.

Nunzio, your description of the orbiter trying to hook up with the space craft /reentry /toaster thing made me think of the scene in OBWAT where Everett achieves the dubious task of matching speed and the crucial jump into the boxcar only to be thwarted by a cohorts misstep. Screeeee…waiting for another chance

Just one question, 8: What’s OBWAT? (Sounds like the Swahili word for the part of the white mammy that Obama popped out of!)

Hehe, yeah, it’s absurd though. Could you imagine them even doing something like that today, with planes, in the sky above our head?

And the more you look into this stuff, the more absurd it gets.

Rocket ships, meeting up in space and assembling themselves….iy….

OBWART = Oh Brother Where Art Thou?

Fuck this WP, I have to keep scrolling up to find a reply button /tab/what have you.
Nunzio, O Brother, Where Art Thou? Is a fairly hilarious movie. I highly recommended it for good entertainment. It’s a Coen Bros movie, need I say more?

“There is nothing impossible about the moon landing with 1960s technology and acceptable risk levels. ”

You keep telling yourself that, Brent. A moon mission is still as impossible now as it was in 1969, and the new safety regime has nothing to do with that.

Hmmm, sounds like that movie might be old enough for me to actually watch! (I pretty much don’t watch anything newer than the 50’s…with a few exceptions…)

Hey Brent, do those pics show all the multiple light sources; reflections of things that shouldn’t be there, etc. or were they edited out?What would the safety cult have to do with it? If those astronauts lived normal lives and of normal length (Except for ol’ Gus Grissom who was a doubter, so they killed him)- so what would be the issue, especially NOW that technology has advanced so much since ’69?

The gov’t doesn’t give a damn about safety; it’s just another reason to implement more economic, political, and social control.

I’m surprised at you Brent. You’re obviously very intelligent. You should be able to see right through this BS.

It’s unnerving- on a Libertarian site to see some still clinging to the biggest lie Big Brother has ever perpetrated.

There weren’t multiple light sources. Simply the nature of the environment on the moon. Remember a couple of things moon dust is black in color and reflects light. It’s covered in the discussion of the photography in “Full Moon” as I recall.

Mythbusters did a decent job of it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPj60sy9Cfw

The moon landings happening is not a lie. The lies are elsewhere. What has been found on the moon, in space, and the “black” space program.

If the moon landing can’t be done on 1960s technology then neither could other aerospace accomplishments of the era. But ever notice that the government doesn’t admit to anything beyond that point?

Simply the lies are elsewhere. Trillions and trillions spent on black programs and where did it go? Never mind all the records that that got destroyed at the pentagon and in WTC7. The lies are elsewhere. The government likes to misdirect people into silly areas so they have cover where the serious lies are.

The moon landing hoax theory is one of those diversions. Something to ridicule people with when they see through a meaningful lie.

Nunzio, Brent has always been like that. Don’t let it get to you. When he knows something, it can’t be disproven.

Brent, about that magical black moon dust that reflects light, where is a sample? I know that a few of the “moon rocks” given to other governments for their museums have turned out to be terrestrial, one even being found to be petrified wood.

Would that black moondust cause all the cameras to shoot moonscapes with the sky completely black, also?

That’s one thing the moondoggie waggers can never adequately explain: how a planet with no atmosphere at all could have no stars or other planets visible above its horizon.

Amazing that this hoax that people have been discussing for almost 50 years was just a diversion. I guess that means moondoggie doubters are to blame for all the shit that government has gotten up to since we fell for their bullshit.

The trouble with that idea is that those of us who see the whole space program as a massive, money wasting fake are a tiny minority.

To divert attention from the naked moondoggie emperor by saying that he really did send a few retards to the moon, but he had to invent the “conspiracy theory” that there was no moon landing to cover up for the horrifying truth of what he actually found on the moon is just too much.

I give up.

Brent, aren’tv those Mythbusters guys the same ones who have no problem with the Twin Towers pancaking into their own footprint; and WTC7 doing the same, though it was 200′ feet away and had not been touched?

I may have to look at your link though, to see just how they can debunk multiple light sources when there are shadows coming from radically different directions. Oh, and lets not forget no stars in the sky. You can’t see stars from the Moon apparently….

Hey, we all have our own statist sacred cows that we hold onto for a while, even after we should know better.

Hey, here we are in 2017 and they can’t even get a reliable satelite internet service going here on earth….but they streamed live video from the Moon in ’69…

Oooooo-K….

The Moon hoax was actually the justification for all of their other lies and nonsense, and the spending of many billions of dollars of OUR wealth, because people will buy any of their lies if they buy that they went to the Moon (Even though doing so, had they really done it, accomplished absolutely NOTHING)

Oh, and Moon dust is black? They claim that the Moon is a reflector of the Sun’s light. Since when does black reflect?

The more ya think about this stuff, the more farcical and outlandish the premises (and the excuses used to justify them) become.

….and now Uncle covers-up scary trhings, instead of magnifying them and using them for all they’re worth to get the public to demand that Uncle “save them from it” via some multi-billion dollar war or laser-shield or nuking it, etc. etc.?

My…that doesn’t sound like the modus operandi of the government of the US or any other Western country that I know of!

What they did with other things is irrelevant to the fact they did this one pretty well.

The photos are consistent with the properties of the moon’s surface so not being consistent with the properties of the earth’s surface does not make them fake.

Now you can try to prove the moon has different qualities than shown or some other avenue but its not multiple light sources.

The black color of the moon’s surface ‘soil’ is quite apparent on the space suits.

When does black reflect? Ever learn why black is the most difficult color to paint a car?

Statist sacred cow? Not at all. Like I stated, the lies are far bigger and more important IMO. The chinese will get to the moon next and they’ll cover it up too. Just like they cover up the pyramids in their territory.

The moon landing hoax stuff makes for good cover. Anyone who thinks the government is lying becomes a moon hoax believer and discussion shuts down. Works well.

Ed,
I have yet to see any convincing evidence of a moon hoax.

I’ve sat through a lot of it and it’s just BS. The problem is I know too much about mechanical things and science to be misguided on it. Same reason why I know the government story of the towers failing is BS.

What the moon hoax people put forth aren’t mechanical violations but what NIST put forth are.

If you think black can’t reflect light find a black car and use the reflection to comb your hair.

Brent, it’s time to admit to yourself that you haven’t looked for any evidence of fakery.

If you’d ever seen any photos of the landing module that had a speck of black dust anywhere on it, you’d be mentioning that evidence in favor of the con job, but you haven’t seen any such thing.

That point alone is a case in which absence of evidence is indeed evidence of absence. If the surface was fine black dust that would hold a footprint well enough to be photographed, then that same fine black dust would be all over the landing module, but every photo shows the module pristine, clean as a whistle, without a speck of the black dust you’ve dragged into the discussion.

Take the merest glance at all the evidence that you say proves there was a moon landing and you’ll also see evidence of fakery.

I’m not the one who said that black dust can’t reflect light, but the shiny clearcoat over the black paint on my car does reflect my image when I look at it. Black sand on an island beach doesn’t, though, and neither does soot.

I don’t know where you got this black dust idea from, but it’s making your whole argument look retarded.

The nonsensically perfect photos that are supposed to have been shot by Hasselblad fixed focus cameras attached to the front of a soft rayon “space suit” are all mechanical violations in the falsehood.

The total absence of stars in what is supposed to be space behind the flea-hopping, suit-clad retards is another piece of evidence that the whole thing is a con.

The moon buggy that could never have been stored in the landing module for lack of space is another big piece of evidence that you can’t see, for some reason, but plenty of others have noticed it.

You don’t have to see what some others here see. Believe what you like. Most people I know believe a lot of pure bullshit. I can put up with just about anything from anybody as long as I’m not required to believe along with them.

You can have the last word. This shit of scrolling up to find a reply button is a hassle.

Ed, I have listened to countless moon hoax people on radio shows, on youtube, you name it. Not one is the least bit convincing.

From the book “Full Moon”
Image 104 shows the damaged skin of the lander “orion” after leaving the moon.
Image 103 shows debris flying from Orion on lift off from television camera left on the surface. Images 100 and 101 show the moon dirt inside the lander on the clothing of astronauts. You go through this book and tell me how all these images were faked and I’ll believe it was hoax if you do a good job of it.

Not even today’s special effects would do this good.

“…I have listened to countless moon hoax people on radio shows, on youtube, you name it. Not one is the least bit convincing.”

You’re being taken in by an obvious hoax. As has been pointed out here, the moon is only 70 miles wide. We also know it is made of green cheese. How could anyone possibly land on that? The idea is ridiculous on its face!

Then there’s this nonsense of travelling through space using rockets. There’s no air in space!! There’s nothing for the rocket’s exhaust to push against!! More obvious lies but almost nobody calls them on it.

We’re talking about an amazingly deep con with all this space stuff. They even have people convinced they are listening to radio signals from out space in their cars, transmitted by some kind of sputniks. I can remember a time when anyone who said they were listening to radio from outer space would be put into a rubber room, and for good reason.

It’s all a load of crap. Eveyone knows the earth is a plate sitting on the back of a giant turtle. There’s no way that these so-called “space satellites” could possibly “orbit” around that. It’s obvious.

And don’t listen to any nonsense from establishment shills questioning what the giant turtle is standing on. IT’S TURTLES ALL THE WAY DOWN. OPEN YOUR EYES!

Brent, so the Moon is glossy black?! (And that doesn’t even reflect light- the gloss on a car’s metal surface just reflects light in the sense of producing a mirror image on it’s surface. Try actually bouncing relected light off of it, to direct that light somewhere else. Doesn’t work so good, does it?)

I think even you’d admit that the surface of the Moon is not glossy black- it would be more like a matte powder coat black. Try redirecting a light source off of a matte black powder coated object…. Much less a reflected light that is “90 million miles away” onto something that is “240K miles” from us, and having the resultant light beam create bright light that casts shadows… Maybe if the Moon were made of mylar…

And you keep explaining the anomalies in the pics (shadows from multi-angle light sources, etc.) as being due to qualities of the surface of the moon- but regardless of those qualities, it would not explain why there are multi-angle shadows and reflections in man-made objects which should not be there, considering there is only one light source. This has nothing to do with the qualities of the surface of the Moon.

This is just another example of the apologists creating more problems when they try and explain away the “gotchas”.

Ed, this is the first I’ve heard of the “black dust” argument, too.

Apparently, it is of recent concoction; posited to try and explain the glaring [pun intended!] inconsistencies between the errant shadows and reflections in the staged photos, and reality- which is funny, because not only DOESN’T it achieve that end, but it creates a whole plethora of new problems, which create even more inconsistencies, which need to be explained away….

Ya know, one of my sisters is a pathological liar- and she’s not very bright- so I’ve always been amused at how she’ll say something that any person who possesses even an ounce of logic and or knowledge KNOWS is not true…and then when confronted, she’ll spew even more nonsense to try and legitimize the original lie.

That’s the same M.O. I see at work with all of these various hoaxes/fake science/etc.

Jason, have you ever actually LOOKED at the Moon? Especially in the daytime?

Ever notice how it’s shaded side often has no relation to where the sunlight is coming from?

Ever notice that in the daytime, it’s “shaded side” is just transparent- not dark, as it would be if the Moon were a solid orb with one side shaded?

Ever notice how, in many instances, day or night, you can see clouds, sky and stars THROUGH the Moon- both through the “solid” part and the “shaded side”?

Ever notice [Why am I talking like Andy Rooney?] that the light “reflected by the Moon” is cool? (The opposite of it’s supposed source. Reflected light is never the opposite color temperature of it’s source!)

And please explain how it is that when the Moon(with it’s supposed diameter of over 2000 miles) will be directly in front of the Sun will only be casting a shadow 70 miles wide?

Green cheese even starts to make more sense than the crap that the statists pedal. Either the laws of physics and what we can easily observe with our own eyes are wrong…or what the state-sponsored scientists and theoreticians is wrong.

But why look with your eyes or think with your brain, when you have the state-sponsored cartel to do these things for you?

You don’t know the true nature of the Moon, and neither do i (Nor anyone else)- but when we weigh the observable evidence, which view seems more plausible?

Oh, wait….it’s only the handful of modern-day prophets- the ones who speak for the state- who really know; because it’s only those priveleged handful who have access to the real info….so they are the only credible ones, and we must heed whatever they say, and never doubt them, because they and the god of state whom they represent are the only source of real knowledge, right?

“so the Moon is glossy black?”

Oh for fuck’s sake, this is the way you’re going to behave?

Look, albedo is a simple concept. You refused to accept because you think color has something to do with reflection.

Imagine for a moment an environment with no wind or water to erode, to round off fractured particles of rock. What would these shards of rock do in the light?

http://www.newyorker.com/tech/elements/the-mystery-of-moon-dust

Hey Eric, you mean like junk we left behind? I doubt it. I just read where NASA has lost all of the technology they used to get to the moon so they have to figure out how to do it all over again. That’s the latest spin on the story.

Not just the technology, Teo- but EVERYTHING! All the original film; photos; records; data; EVERYTHING….circa right around the time that everyone started getting home computers with image-manipulation software which can dissect and expose doctored photos.

700 boxes worth of crap!

My, how convenient, eh?

The most expensive and ambitious project ever undertaken in the history of the world….and ooppss! They just “lost” everything.

And now, with all of today’s technology and computers, and them “going to Mars” and all, they say it’ll take at least 10 years before they might have the technology to attempt such a thing “again”. My, my…

Don’t ya HATE it when that happens?!

Eric,

I believe “they” know something or are hiding something about the moon as well. That’s where the moon landing hoax comes into play. I believe it is one big diversion tactic. “Yep, been there, done that. Nothing to see there…no need to waste anymore time and vast resources to go there…move along”. They wanted to say they were the first ones there before someone else actually did go there. I know, all tin foil hat stuff for sure.

There is just way too much doubt in my mind to believe it. 9/11 is very similar in that regard but is even more absurd.

…and the fact that they would never talk about their “journey to the Moon” afterwards. Like they were sworn to secrecy, for fear of the stories contradicting and ruining the whole hoax.

I remember thinking too that they probably really did think that they were actually going to go to the Moon. I mean, if you’re pulling a hoax, but trying to involve the minimum number of people who “know”, you can’t take the chance on them having that info beforehand. They probably didn’t have a clue until they arrived in NV/AZ/wherever….then it was “You can’t let the public down!”, and threats of destroying their reputation/making them look crazy if any of ’em spilled the beans, or even disposing of them…..

No wonder Buzzed Aldrin was a long-time alcoholic. They pick “the cream of the crop” to become astronauts; and they supposedly accomplish the “greatest feat in human history”….but you spend the rest of your life being an alcoholic??

FACT: Not ONE of the so-called “astronauts” who claimed to land on the moon ever talked about their experience afterwards. There were no interviews, no lectures, no television appearances. NOT ONE.

FACT: The moon is only 70 miles wide and is made of green cheese. It would be IMPOSSIBLE to land on it even if you could reach it. Any so-called “space ship” or “lander” would simply sink below the surface due to its weight.

FACT: There is NO AIR in outer space for rocket exhaust to push on. Space travel via rocket propelled vehicles is impossible on its face.

FACT: The earth is a plate on the back of a giant turtle, with the moon affixed to a crystal dome above the earth. It is not possible to reach the moon with any object originating on the earth.

THESE ARE INCONTROVERTIBLE FACTS APPARENT TO ANY THINKING PERSON!! They clearly tell us that these so-called lunar “landings” are nothing more than the most venal lies.

Teo,
That’s what I meant to say. I chose my words poorly. It has the vibe of a funeral. Not the type of mood one would expect from such a great adventure.

Tor-insky,

For us peons….forum view looks ‘zactly the same as what we always see.

Speaking of peons…how about some Peon And The Belmonts music?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJBpAzAcRWY

Tor, that’s what I use to view comments. If only a response to comments was available in the dashboard, the site would be somewhat more usable.

This shit of having the thread dwindle to 10 characters in width, with no reply toggle makes it impossible to keep a discussion going except among a few participants who don’t mind the troublesome scrolling.

You know what I do, Ed, to make the scrolling a little more bearable? I just hold down the up arrow key, and let it scroll quickly until it comes to the first wider black of text- which is where that next reply button is. Makes it much faster and easier.

Tor, of course Eric imparts order- He’s a Kraut, for goodness’ sake!

Yeah….there are a million places to go for car talk- The HAMB, etc. and while it’s great to have a Libertarian spin on things automotive, truly, the reason I think most of us come is more for pure Libertarianism and camaraderie of actually being amongst a few like-minded people who add to our understanding, rather than force us to be in defense mode constantly.

And where the heck is Bevin?!

I get the feeling the guy doesn’t like me, but he’s STILL one of my favorite posters on here!