It’s become one of those self-evident truths Massa Tom once wrote about to state that government has become overtly punitive – as opposed to keeping the peace, its sole legitimate function.
There are many examples. Here is the latest.
Virginia’s Roanoke County has hurled a fatwa (news story here) making it a crime to sleep in your own car – even if that car is parked on your own property.
Which nicely delineates the true ownership of “your” property.
“Violators” are subject to arrest – and a $250 fine. Also a possible Hut! Hut! Hutting! – since the fatwa endows armed government workers with the legal power to come onto private property, rap their knuckles or flashlights on private property (the vehicle, its windows) and demand ID and so on from someone not harming anyone.
If the person questions, is the least bit recalcitrant . . . Hut! Hut! Hut! Bash the window in and drag the victim out.
Keep in mind: The law not only permit but specifically empowers the AGWs to perform these operations . . . even on private property.
I am test driving the 2020 Mercedes GLE450 this week (review will be posted soon). It comes with massaging seats, which I happen to not have inside my house. And so I have been spending time in the Benz – which is parked on my driveway. The one I am forced to pay taxes on, for the privilege of being allowed to use – and the fiction that I own.
Doubled-down on by this fatwa.
Armed government thugs – what else are they? – who notice me snoozing in the Benz, parked on my driveway, in front of my garage – now have the power to trespass onto my property (I did not invite them, do not want them) and physically accost me.
If I “resist” – i.e., tell them to fuck off and get off my property – it’s time for the Hut! Hut! Hut! routine.
It is obscene.
Even more obscene, the bullies responsible for this outrage have been trying to gaslight their victims. When a local news affiliate questioned the Board of Supervisors, it received the following:
“The purpose of the ordinance is to enable our staff to intervene in serious cases where people are using their automobiles for an extended period of time as sleeping quarters, in place of a residence, hotel or other accommodations. Most importantly, our concern is for the health and safety of the person living in this type of situation, particularly during the cold winter months. Enforcement of the ordinance will be complaint-driven, and individuals in need will be provided with information regarding resources to aid them in their situation. The ordinance does not prohibit short-term napping in vehicles.”
Italics added.
The “health and safety” of the person… who is now to be Hut! Hut! Hutted!
And they will be subject to the Hut! Hut! Hutting! because . . . it is “healthier” and “safer” to sleep exposed to the cold and rain and whatever else is outside than to shelter inside a warm car.
And the caveat about the ordinance not “…prohibit(ing) short-term napping in vehicles”?
Who will decide what constitutes “short term” and “nap”? Why, the armed government worker on scene; it will be at his discretion.
What was it The Church Lady used t say? Isn’t that special!
Even assuming an AGW who isn’t looking for a reason to hassle someone, the plain fact is the law empowers him to hassle anyone he likes.
The person napping – or sleeping – can no longer tell the AGW to go away. Well, no longer has any legal power to demand the AGW go away.
In his own car – even if parked on his property. Or – and this is just as important – property owned by someone else, who is not complaining about it.
This ugly business is, however, to be expected – and expanded. In many states, it has been illegal for years to sleep it off in your car. The once-upon-a-time responsible thing to do after having one too many has become the legal equivalent of the irresponsible thing; the “violator” may be charged with drunk driving . . . even though no driving has taken place.
Thus encouraging drunks to drive.
Why not, after all? At least you’ll be a moving target – and you’ll probably make it home without killing anyone (as opposed to certainly not killing anyone if you were left in peace to sleep it off).
Both sleeping it off – and just sleeping (or even just napping) have in common the thing which used to be relevant insofar as the law was concerned but no longer is:
No harm done.
Because the law now concerns itself with being the cause of harm. It began a long time ago, with little things – seatbelt laws, for instance – that set the precedent for more (and bigger) things.
I’ve tried, for many years, to get across the point that precedent become practice. That if X is permitted, Y will follow – if the two are based on the same general principle. Get yourself something really nice from the latest sale here.
Thus:
If a person who has long ago paid the bank in full for his home is forced to continue paying the government what amounts to rent in order to be allowed to live in “his” home, then why not also pass a law making it illegal for him to nap – or sleep – in “his” car, even if it is parked on “his” driveway – and in front of “his” home?
Precisely.
. . .
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this article is completely correct. However… if youre Eddie Johnson the Chicago chief of police its perfectly ok. No charges at all. https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/criminal-justice/ct-chicago-police-superintendent-eddie-johnson-internal-investigation-20191018-nxa2rpcvznblxlmntfmgeldeyq-story.html
My interpretation: Government has become too stupid for its own good (or bad).
It’s ridiculous enough that these AGW’s would prevent you from sleeping off a night of extreme use of driving-impairment substances on the side of the road. But to attack you for doing so in your own driveway? How atrocious!
Further comment has escaped me.
Which school does one attend to learn the busybodying trade?
Hi EWM,
Any government school will do. That is the source of most of our problems. The collectivist mindset is instilled there; as well as rote obedience to Authority and the general gimping of the critical faculty, the capacity to think abstractly and in terms of principles and concepts.
Eric
It has been a crime decades in many cities to sleep, even on private property where the owners have no issues with this practice, in ones own car. I know this because I have been homeless and was often harassed by the standing army in blue.
Thinking that laws should be equally enforced, I urged the thugs in blue to arrest anyone fleeing a hurricane that sleeps in their car.
FWIW this practice almost killed me. I was on a motorcycle trip and tried to sleep in a state rest stop (paid for by me) and was woken up and told to move on by a criminal agent of the state. I was involved in a fairly serious accident because of having the state deny me sleep. Fortunately no one died, but I am sure that this is not always the case.
Welcome to fascist Murica. Get used to it. LOL LOL LOL
Hi Chuck,
The term, fascist is accurate – but I prefer coercive collectivist because it’s more accurate and because it cuts away the false left-right dichotomy. The key elements are coercion and collectivism. Whether it leans left – or right – is meaningless if you oppose coercion and collectivism.
Eric,
I’ve always defined Fascism as the government control of “private” property with the illusion of “ownership.”
Government reaps the benefits, and you are responsible for the maintenance.
That is why you are awarded a citation for not cutting “your” grass or shoveling “your” sidewalks.
I hear that NAPA, Advance, O’Reilly, and Autozone are having a sales boom for light bulbs – especially from dark skinned customers. It seems that there is a nationwide crackdown on headlights, taillights, and especially license plate lights.
Keeping those license plates illuminated sure makes me sleep better.
Hi T,
Yup. Socialism dispenses with the fiction of private ownership. We get the fiction.
Eric,
“fiction”
Every day I wake up and have to ask myself, “Is this really happening?”
Orwell, Bradbury, and Huxley combined couldn’t have penned a dystopia like the one existing today.
Hi T,
Indeed. It is particularly hard on anyone who can remember a different America; one far from perfect – but one in which freedom still existed in ways unimaginable today.
I remember back when the stuff happening today was what (we were told) happened in places like the Soviet Union.
DreadPirate,
“I remember back when the stuff happening today was what (we were told) happened in places like the Soviet Union.”
“Tear down this wall!” is a line from a speech made by U.S. President Ronald Reagan in West Berlin on Friday, June 12, 1987, calling for the General Secretary of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, Mikhail Gorbachev, to open up the barrier which had divided West and East Berlin since 1961. Wikipedia
After expanding government (more than any previous president), Ronnie basically told the world that the USA had become a communist country.
Today, the new wall is being built that will keep us in. And I’m less than two years, A European Travel Information and Authorization System or ETIAS document will be required of U.S. travelers trying to enter Europe.
Sort of a new world order.
Me too, Pirate… me, too.
And it wasn’t all that long ago, either. The ’80s. I remember it.
Well I remember a lot further back than that //wink
Hi T,
“I’ve always defined Fascism as the government control of “private” property with the illusion of “ownership.”
Government reaps the benefits, and you are responsible for the maintenance.”
That’s fascism applied to us mundanes. For the elites, fascism is a system of collusion between corporate and state interests; whereby the corporate class cedes ultimate control and a share of the profits in exchange for subsidies, protective barriers to entry and near immunity from risk and the consequences of malfeasance.
Much of FDR’s “new deal” was inspired by Italian Fascism. Clinton pushed Fascism by dubbing it “the third way”. Corporate/State collusion is the dominant practice of Western democratic governments. “Democracy” is not a system of government but merely an easily manipulated method of appointing rulers. The PTB figured out a long time ago that “democracy” allows for whatever ruling system is desired and, more importantly, legitimizes that system while neutering any effective opposition to it.
Churchill had it half right.
Cheers,
Jeremy
Democracy is the worst form of government because everyone becomes a slave and a slave master at the same time, except for the ruler(s).
Hi Brian,
Yes – agreed. I also loathe it (democracy) because it is Gresham’s Law applied to politics; everything is brought down to the level of utter morons. I’d rather be ruled by a Fuhrer who at least exalted the superior man.
Glad that the US isn’t a democracy. . . they sound terrible.
3 rules to create a police state:
1. Have lots of police.
2. Make nearly everything illegal.
3. Selectively enforce the laws against those you do not like.
Long ago, I fell asleep at the wheel of a Ryder truck I was driving in order to move myself between domiciles. Alcohol was not involved, only fatigue. The truck drifted to the gravel on the right shoulder, which woke me.
I parked the truck and took about a 30 minute nap. Should I have been arrested for that? I think not.
Bottom line: this occurred on a two lane stretch of old U.S. 66. Had the truck drifted the opposite direction, into opposing traffic, likely a fatal accident. Does the law think it would have been better for me to have killed someone by not stopping to rest?
“Does the law think it would have been better for me to have killed someone by not stopping to rest?”
Yes. But only as long as you crashed into another mundane and did not injure any of the ruling class.
While seemingly ‘as written’ this local ordinance appears totally crazy, if they actually start arresting/ticketing people on private property w/o any owner complaints triggering that, then the first time this goes to court it will be overturned. Bet on that, even in Amerika.
Look, in many places like the entire West Coast, hordes of criminals, addicts, illegals and crazies are sleeping anywhere they want, no problem Legal efforts to regulate (in any reasonable fashion) have been overturned by communist local courts there. So this nonsense about sleeping in cars is going away or be drastically modified. They might be able to justify a peaceful “wellness check” to see if the person is alive and well, but nothing further. Even then, on private property they will need to justify trespass.
Hi Muggles,
I hope so; hope there is pushback. Lots of it.
The day isn’t coming.
It is here.
I followed the Dead back in the mid 80’s “Touch of Grey Head’s, they called us”. Sleeping in vehicles was of course something almost all of us did. I was also just a vagabond by nature I guess, well before I even had a license I would head out and drive all night then find a place to park and I would sleep like a baby.
The freedom of the road came hand in hand with sleeping in your vehicle, for us poor folk anyway. I didn’t have the money to rent a hotel room, I just had enough for gas and that was it. Some of the absolute best times in my life were had in parked cars, as I’m sure it was for many of you guys too. At least one of my kids wouldn’t be around without being allowed privacy in parked cars.
I started calling California “Communist California” during my time traveling because you could NOT park without getting rousted. “Move Along” was the name of the game. If you parked anywhere they would come and tell you to “move along” and you had better listen too. For such a “tolerant” state, they have very little tolerance for liberty.
By the time I finally found my way back to Michigan the laws were starting to change here as well. Get caught drunk sleeping and you were in trouble.– That was fucking bizarre. Nobody got arrested for driving around with a beer between their legs when I was growing up and the only drunks that got arrested would weave so bad (on a daily basis) that they truly were a menace. Suddenly it became very profitable to jail drunks and then, Boom, you could get in trouble for doing the right thing and taking a nap.
Cops will absolutely tell you that rousting sleeping drunks makes the roads more dangerous, not less, but our value as tax cattle is obviously higher than our value as mere citizens.
As for the “move along” laws in California, that is so incredibly ironic now. The last time I went back they had so many homeless that there was no place left to make them move along to. My Mother in Law lives in one of the nicest parts of Salinas and it’s now a dump, homeless shit in her hedges daily. Ten grand a year in taxes and the homeless shit in her hedges and piss on her cars like dogs do. She got a bullet hole in her Truck not long ago. Salinas now ranks up there with Chicago and Baltimore for murder rate. It’s the most authoritarian place I have ever lived and yet it’s got the most crime as well. Put up a garage sale sign and it’s a thousand dollar fine, cut a dead limb off a tree without a permit and go to prison, but shit on the sidewalk and they will give you some free needles and ask if you need dental help from the moving care van.
One of my first vehicles was a pickup with a topper on the back //wink
Mine too. 1980 GMC three on the tree. Having a topper was nice but the bench seat wasn’t bad either.
Yeah, I slept in the seat a few times before I got a topper.
Mine was a 4×4 so I was always headed as far as possible into the backcountry to camp.
Hi Brad,
That’s my experience as well; in high school and college (’80s) we were encouraged to “sleep it off” – for the obvious, common-sense reasons. Now people are subject to crucifixion for being responsible and – thus – encouraged to be irresponsible.
Similarly with regard to speed laws. In my state, one can be arrested for “reckless” driving if caught doing 80 on the highway (speed limit 70)… or more than 20 MPH above any PSL – regardless of the absurdity of the PSL in many areas. “Reckless” is a serious bust. Ergo, it incentivizes fleeing. I’ve driven (and ridden) well in excess of 150 MPH to get away from an armed government worker attempting to get me for cruise-controlling at at 85 o a highway posted 70 with everyone doing at least 75.
Yep, blast fast enough past a tax feeder and you might as well put the hammer down. They will probably grab someone else rather than bother, most of the time. Although my days of pulling that are over, after my last trouble.
I drove for a bunch of years without having any idea how fast I was going, at least when I was on the expressway. My 87 Camaro had a speedometer that only went to 85mph and a good radar detector back then and knowing where the traps were was all it took to stay clear.
I wonder who thought up having a speedometer on a “sports” car that only goes to 85mph?
It’s time to go slow around here right now, though. I woke up yesterday morning with two deer fetuses frozen to the end of my driveway. Someone hit the doe hard enough that the two babies shot out and landed in the driveway, the rest of the deer must have landed further down, from where most of the blood and hair was. Car parts and blood splatter frozen all over everything. I’d say it flew a good 50 feet too. Someone picked up the deer, but not the rest of the crap.
I hope that any cops who enforce this law get the response they deserve.
Hi JdL,
With tremendous sadness, I suspect this will not end until certain people are swinging from lamp posts, like Mussolini in the spring of ’45
It’s inevitable unfortunately. Political violence is the norm in human history. We have been part of a rare exception (for the most part) but it’s pretty clear those days are numbered.
Political violence is a relief valve to prevent some of the kookiest actions of our so called “leaders”. Since we don’t have much of it, the anger grows silently. The elite will have to learn fear of the population.
The elite have been insulated long enough, (and don’t know history very well) they won’t change until enough of them get killed because of it. It won’t be like the JFK type assassin (way different kind of political killing) either. It will more likely be mobs (unplanned) overwhelming their secret service guards. That is why the secret service doesn’t like their protectees in open at places with large amounts of people. Even with their guns they know they will be quickly overrun once it begins. Maybe at minimum, they will be forced to live in bunkers someday. It’s already the case for presidents and the most visible elite.
Mussolini was captured while fleeing and executed by a communist partisan patrol. Then his corpse was displayed. The myth that the populace dispacthed him is just that. A myth.
Few months ago I was driving home. But less than an hour to go it was clear I needed s nap. There’s a big government sign encouraging me to do just that. I pull over in the government rest area and take a nap. Usually half an hour, forty-five minutes, gets me refreshed and raring to go. I’m woken up by sirens and spotlight twenty minutes later. “What are you doing? How long have you been here? Where do you live?”
Hi Gruhn,
I may have to start selling yellow vests… der tag kommt…
eric, you have my address. Bill me and send me one. I am truly an anarchist but realize we have to work with/against/etc. whatever govt. is in place. As much as I’d like it to not be so, it is, so I have to try to work around it.
BTW, I’m working for govt. now…..my county. I do everything I can to arrange my hours and days to get the most bang for the buck for the taxpayer of which I am one.
I bring skills that have saved money for the county already. One big rig had a ruined muffler and while the commissioner tried to find one, I found one instantly at a truck dealership parts dept I’ve done business with for nearly 50 years. I’d say $59.95 for a 5″ inlet/outlet, 10″ X 53″ body is a deal. The boss thought so too. I removed the old stuff and installed the new one. I then skipped a day of work since we only work 4 day weeks to be there to haul loads for a road repair.
Everyone there said it couldn’t be done in a day but I nailed that old truck and hauled every single grain of caliche in one day with seconds or minutes to spare.
The only problem I had all day long was being run off the road at 80 mph by the fuckin state fools who don’t give a shit. I’d have chunked a grenade had I had one.
So no, I don’t like govt. but something has to be in place for us poor folk to be able to use the roads(loose interpretation since no pavement is involved). The commissioner is the youngster of the bunch at 64 and my two other coworkers are both 72 to my 69. We put in long, hard days and try to do so giving the best bang for the buck. I have to admit I had second thoughts about working on a big rig first thing Tuesday morning when it was 13 degrees and only got past 20 about mid day and never got above freezing.
OTOH, the state guys have this attitude of doing the least they can since hell, it’s just a state job where they make twice what we do. Guess I should have chosen the latter but I don’t work that way. BTW, we have a scrap trailer we’re loading to sell for a fund to a nearby titty bar. Every time I think about it I have to laugh. No doubt it will be used for something else but it’s funny when you consider our ages. A brisket and tater salad is probably more along the lines of what we can handle and a few cold ones although one guy doesn’t drink and never has…..and good for him. I might not survive seeing a real titty in person at a bar.
For some reason I have inherited a Deere road grader, a hoss of a machine with 6 wheel drive. The only change I’d make to it would be an elevator into the cab.
Eight, I wish you would move up here and work for our county. Need someone with an IQ >70 to run the grader. I mean, how the f*ck hard is it to crown the road and feather off the last pass instead of pushing the remaining remnant of gravel off into the ditch ???
dread, it must be hard for some folk. The last commissioner had flattened the roads and we’re just waiting on rain so we can pull the stuff in the ditch back up and add(initially typed “ass”)crown.
It’s so damned dry here we can’t do any good grading except to cut deep and remove the washboard. We did a few mile long road the other day we’ll be using soon hauling caliche. Took two machines quite a while to cut, roll it over, cut the other side and roll it back.
We work with such a meager budget it’s not funny. We have a quarter county to bring back to some semblance of passable dirt roads. So many of our roads are pounded by trucks hauling brine and oil they get badly washboarded. Some between perpetual cotton fields continually get washed away and others get covered quickly in 3 feet of blowing dirt. Never a dull moment in west Texas weather-wise.
When we moved out here the road was fairly good, rough sometimes but passable in most weather. Then two things happened:
The county widened out a narrow curve about a mile below our place, just digging dirt out of the bank and dumping it over the outer edge, and eliminating the ditch on the inside. So now this spot (with no more gravel!) becomes a 4wd only bog every time it rains or when the snow is melting. For several years the outside half kept subsiding but it has sort of settled now.
The county kept just grading the middle of the road so that the shoulders just kept getting higher and holding all the water in the driving surface. After years of complaining, I got them to clean up some ditches and put their blade out to the edge of the road and bring that gravel to the middle. It was sort of okay for a couple weeks, then they graded again and pushed all the gravel off into the ditches, filling them level full to the fence line in places where it had been several feet deep. So basically the original road has been completely destroyed and it’s just a wide flat firebreak.
The commissioners claim that they are so short of money, but they never tell us how much total they have from the road assessment versus how much they spend. We finally found out that they had been holding back wildland fire money from the various county VFDs and transferring it to general fund as “unspent” for years and years, so I suspect the same thing is happening with road money. Worse than that, the little bit that they did spend on the roads just made them worse!
Did you point out the sign? If so, what was their response? And WTF are they jamming you up in a rest area anyway? Isn’t the purpose of a rest area to-gasp-REST?! SMH…
Resting in a rest area. How dare you.
Brent,
“Resting in a rest area. How dare you.”
It almost seems too easy.
Whatever the government says turns out to be the opposite of what happens in reality.
Rest Area = NO rest area.
Drug prohibition = Drug proliferation.
Automotive safety = Cars with huge blind spots, Claymores, …
Improved education = Dumbing down.
Aviation safety = Planes falling from the sky.
And of course the all time favorite. No New Taxes = MORE New Taxes.
Yeah T, read his lyin frickin lips…..no new taxes. Nobody could have guessed a Bush might fib. Just look at Preston who made his money selling supplies to the Nazis.
“It is obscene.”
And so is the fact you will probably be getting a tax increase soon (sales or property) to fund their enormous pensions that are enormously underfunded.
Just another stop on the train to tyranny.
All Aboard!
Think voting will help?
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/mar/8/house-votes-favor-illegal-immigrant-voting/
The whole trick to sleeping in your car unmolested is this: pull in some place where other cars are around. Pull into a rest area if one is available. If not, find a shopping center or mall; that only works during business hours though. Gas stations with cars parked in the lot are also good places to catch a power nap; that’s what I did when coming up from Philly the other day. A 24 hour station is best, since there will always be cars around. Once you’re in an area with other cars (the more, the better), park among them; you want to look like just another car there. If none of those places are available, then pull into an office park, as they often have big parking lots with lots of cars. If it’s after hours or the weekend, then go around behind the office building out of sight of the road, so any roving AGWs don’t see you. After I was accosted by an AGW in college (referenced above), that’s what I did. I’d make sure there weren’t cops around, then slip in behind the office building for my power nap.
On routes I travel even semi-regularly (i.e. I have an idea of the lay of the land), I have certain designated places I’ll use for power naps. If I need or want a power nap, the LAST thing I want is some AGW a-hole knocking on my window, waking me up, and asking me a bunch of STUPID questions!
The whole idea is to not ATTRACT THE AGW’s attention. If he doesn’t notice you, then he won’t fuck with you. He’ll chase another target, which is what you want. Ideally, we don’t want them going after anyone. However, as long as they’re around, then staying out of their sight is the only option open to us.
Once word of this law gets out there will be no shortage of “first responder” bootlickers who will call 911 upon seeing anyone sleeping in their car.
parking decks are generally good if available
Walmart and other enterprising retailers invite RVs to park in their lots overnight. Good for business. I wonder if sleeping in an RV (a motorized vehicle) is allowed? Seems as if this is a big mess waiting to explode.
Hi Steve, that depends upon where you live. Some towns prohibit living in an RV for any length of time within city limits (such as Big Lake, Tx). I am presently living in an RV, but it is parked at a trailer park. Missouri doesn’t have zoning laws, yet I got run out of a state park for trying to spend the night in a camper on so-called public land, yet there are plenty of people living in RVs on their own private property in this state.
Big Lake, it makes my teeth ache as eric says. The very first well in the Permian Basin was drilled just north and west of BL and is called the Santa Rita. The little shithole is awash in petroleum taxes but chooses to keep those people who make all that money possible for them “out of town”.
I personally don’t see the problem since I’d rather live in a hole in the ground than Big Lake. I’ve spent plenty of bad time in Big Lake. Their businesses sure don’t mind taking your money and I don’t mind spending as little there as possible. To quote Craig Robinson, “They can kiss my ass”.
State parks I have gone to only permit staying the night if you rent a campsite. Then you pull your vehicle on to the campsite and they don’t care if you sleep in the vehicle or a tent or out in the open air. They just don’t want anyone staying for free in the day visit parking lot. In other words its a money thing.
I recall the first time I went to a park(New Mexico)with a “no firearms allowed” sign. I wondered how far I’d need to go to find one with no such restriction. It was close to dark, fuck em…..and then a big black bear came through about 1 am and sniffed me in my sleeping back from foot to head…..sure wished I had taken that gun into bed with me.
More and more I think it would have been better if the Germans had won the war. We would probably still have some rights…….
Not sure if I am kidding..
You really think the level of GRV (Government Related Violence) would be lower if you were reading this in German?
Yes. German police murder far fewer people. Single digits v. 1000+
Slight difference in population between 50 states and Germany // roll eyes
This too.
http://www.hideoutnow.com/2019/03/watch-police-in-colorado-draw-gun-in.html
Race baiting article. Why label him as a black man? Why not just a man? They want you to think it’s black vs. white issue instead of parasite vs. producer issue. If it was a white man, would they have labelled him as such? Doubt it.
That is what you focused on in the article? SMH
Of course the fact the man was black had nothing to do with it right? Duh, no. People of color are susceptible to EVEN MORE harassment by AGW’s because they dont have the RESOURCES to fight back. Its easy pickins to pull them over for minor infractions then initiate a search or w/e because the AGW suddenly ‘feared for his life’. If the individual survives the encounter and doesn’t walk away in handcuffs rest assured there’s a nice fat ticket coming with a gob of cash due for the State coffers.
I often catch a quick nap on the way home after working the night shift. I’ll usually pull off into a strip mall parking lot, but I’ve done it in unmetered street spaces too.
This is all about “urban camping” and getting the riff-raff (millennials attempting to pay off their student debt and priced out of the housing market) out of the neighborhood. There are thousands of old work vans that are in actuality RV conversions that people who cannot afford a state-sanctioned home live in until they get on their feet.
Once again, Uncle creates a problem, someone comes up with a creative solution/work-around, and then Uncle has to outlaw the solution. I get that you might not like it if there’s a transient living in a van in your posh neighborhood, but then put up gates and let the HOA manage the street cleaning. Or fix the broken zoning laws and let the free market build some affordable housing.
What’s that they say about the road to hell?
Oh, right! It’s paved with good intentions!
Assuming there are any to be found, in this case. Somehow, I doubt there are.
This is thinly disguised class warfare. Poor people (who don’t own homes, or cannot spend the money on a $120 a night motel) sleep in their cars. Don’t want poor people around? Forbid the sleeping in cars!
Pretty sure much of the Northeast already has these laws, as it’s illegal there to park your Class-B RV along the road (even if you feed the meter!) and spend the night.
Just leads to more drowsy driving (like that video I posted yesterday). You’re damned if you do, damned if you don’t. It’s like the 14 hour time clock that trucker are stuck on now, nope, no taking a rest when your tired you got to wait out the clock.
Is there something about the river water people are drinking ???
First the Missing Colony, and now this.
Another fantastic article by Eric that is anchored by a fundamental principle – keep them coming. This one is “that precedent become practice. That if X is permitted, Y will follow – if the two are based on the same general principle.”
This has always been my argument against those who are pro taxation but complain about the form or degree of it.
This also applies to those who believe in a ruling class but complain to their masters when they whip them too hard.
General principles: Theft is immoral and authoritarianism is a superstition.
Laws are created to devalue and dis-empower us. I have just found a very, very good free e-book yesterday entitled The End Of All Evil by Jeremy Locke. Here is the description:
From Jeremy Locke:
Never in all of history have the elements been arrayed against the evil manifest in tyranny and slavery as they are today.
The dreams that burn in the hearts of billions have been growing stronger through the millennia.
The children of this world are owed a liberty from slavery that few are able to comprehend.
This is the most exciting era in all of human history; it is the dawn of the freedom of mankind.
Fabian Socialism: https://www.britannica.com/event/Fabianism
The state is more than able to wait to get what it wants. And it has infinite resources to throw at a problem citizen.
ReadyKilowatt
March 8, 2019 at 10:00 am
Fabian Socialism:
Didn’t look at the link RK, but I have researched the Fabian Society from its inception to the creation of UNESCO and the ISO.
These folks do have a set of goals and those goals continue to be achieved.
WTF?! I remember how, when I was in college, I went to do some lab work on a Saturday. I didn’t have class but I needed to get stuff done, so I went in. On the way home, I got tired and pulled off for a rest. Just as I got a good nap going, my window got knocked on; the AGW asked me what I was doing, etc. Uh, wasn’t it OBVIOUS what I was doing?! Duh! Please keep in mind this was the late 1990s when there were PSAs about pulling off for a power nap if you got drowsy behind the wheel…
Oh, and that bit about getting charged with DUI if you’re sleeping it off in your OWN car is total BS! How can they say that you’re driving when you’re not actually-gasp-driving?! Seems counter intuitive to me…
Come to think of it, I had to pull off yesterday. I had a huge lunch, and on the way home it hit me; I got drowsy. So, I pulled off to rest. I got off at an exit and pulled into a gas station alongside a minivan. Thankfully, no one bothered me. I don’t think sleeping in one’s own car is illegal in NJ or PA-yet…
It’s not counter intuitive because DUI is a revenue racket combined with prohibition of alcohol consumption. The excuse they use is being ‘in control’ of the vehicle which means having the keys accessible to you. So the game to play is to hide the keys far from the vehicle before reclining in the car to sleep it off. Now when officer Bob Speed comes along you can show you don’t have the keys and the officer can go play hide and go f himself. But finding car keys hidden a 100+ft away at night is unlikely. Then proving you knew where they were hidden in court even more so. So now the solution, criminalize sleeping in a vehicle.
You’re playing semantics, sir. It’s counter intuitive because you’re not DRIVING the vehicle; it is not in operation. DUI/DWI shares what in common? What does the first letter stand for? Oh, that’s right-driving! If you’re not driving the vehicle, how can you be guilty? If you’re not on the road, you’re not operating the vehicle; how can you be in control of something NOT in operation? If you’re not driving the vehicle, you’re not in a position to harm anyone else, correct? As the famous man once said: “The law, sir, is an ASS”.
I am not playing with semantics. Forget about the nonsense they tell you about DUI. You think the D is for driving? What do you think the Patriot in Patriot act is for? Government _LIES_. People who use government _LIE_. They put misleading and false names on things because people like you will fall for it.
But you go ahead and keep believing their lies. Keep thinking they are just ‘stupid’. Keep thinking things are counter intuitive because you believe what they tell you. That’s what they want you to think. That way they get a pass.
The DUI industry was created by partnership of prohibitionists, government, and traffic ticket lawyers. The laws are doing exactly what they are designed to do. These aren’t stupid people. They didn’t construct this income stream for themselves and the social engineering the prohibitionists desire by accident. It was done with intent.
I know what you’re saying. I do NOT believe gov’t lies, either. WRT the USAPATRIOT Act, all the capital letters spell out some crazy acronym I can’t remember now. All I DO know is that the so-called USAPATRIOT Act makes an absolute MOCKERY of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.
My only point is that these laws defy COMMON SENSE. As I said above, the law is an ass, and these laws make that point for me. Such trickery only breeds contempt for the law…
MarkyMark,
To be convicted of DUI/DWI you do not need to be
1-Driving
2-Above a BAC of 0.0
3-In a motor vehicle
You are absolutely right Tuanorea and BrentP. See:
https://www.verywellmind.com/dui-vs-dwi-what-is-the-difference-67214 and
https://www.kulplaw.com/top-10-weird-ways-to-get-a-dui-in-the-us/
“There’s no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren’t enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.” -Ayn Rand
Brian, I checked out both links, and they make my point: the law IS an ass! Where’s the COMMON SENSE? The logic behind this legal BS is the same that says 2+2=5! Such twisted ‘reasoning’ or ‘logic’ only breeds contempt for the law…
That is precisely what happened to me back in 1987 MarkyMark! I parked my car to sleep it off because I could not safely make it home. There is no Taxi service available in rural America! It was very cold outside, so I left the engine running. A coproach knocked on my window to wake me up, and I was arrested for DUI because my key was in the ignition! My insurance rate skyrocketed, and I had to pay a huge fine and attend a few days of classes.
Hi Brian,
I slept in my running car many times during my college years; luckily, I was not assaulted for being responsible, as you were. As many have been. This business is just another piece of evidence that saaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaafety has nothing to do with what government does to us. That is just the excuse for what government does to us.
This law encourages people to be irresponsible. To drive after drinking. Why not? The chances of being arrested are greater if you spend 4-6 hours sleeping in a car than the 1 hour or less it would take you to make it home.
But no keens about how these laws which encourage people who’ve had too much to drink to drive constitute a threat to saaaaaaaaaaaaaafety… which they obviously do.
I had a pickup with a canopy with a crawl through hole (Remember those? where I would get into the back with very dark tinted windows with curtains on all four sides and sleep peacefully, I wasn’t in the seat and the cop didn’t know I was in there. Kind of like the forerunner of stealth vans people use today to urban camp.
Ced, in Texas there was a couple decades that “stabbin cabins” were in vogue. Seemed like a good idea to me since nobody could see in them and it was a custom made sleeper for a pickup. A curtain covered the back window you used for egress/ingress just like a big rig sleeper…..except smaller.
I’m sorry that that happened to you, Brian. All I can say is that is FUCKED UP-pure and simple. As the man once said: The law, sir, is an ass! This DWI business and sleeping in your car are Exhibit A as to why that old cliche is true.
Luckily, I hadn’t been drinking. I’d just had a busy week at school and work and was in need of a quick power nap. Even so, I didn’t appreciate the coproaches (good one!) waking me up to ask me a bunch of stupid questions. I had an old Buick with a bench seat at the time, and I was laying across said bench seat. Uh, wasn’t it OBVIOUS as to what I was doing? Wouldn’t a simple look in the window answer their stupid, fucking question?! Did you really have to ask, let alone wake me up t do so?
Why couldn’t the cop have complimented you on being responsible? Why couldn’t he have encouraged you to finish sleeping it off, then have a safe trip home? Why did he have to arrest you?
Because I violated a man-made law, and coproaches take such laws seriously, except for when they don’t. Because this gave him an opportunity to bully me. Coproaches are extremely obedient to their higher ups while at the same time enjoying the power they have over the mundane. Because he wanted to raise revenue for his higher ups via highway robbery. Because he was bored until a dispatcher called him about a complaint someone had made. I was told that someone called them out of concern that I might be a cattle thief parked in front of a gate to a field. Really? I was alone in a Ford Escort! How in the hell could I put cattle into its hatchback?
A more complete answer can be found by reading the book I linked to in another post in this comment section. Here is a sampling of what the book says:
Evil is the destruction of freedom. It cannot be stated more simply. Everywhere you look, you will find the obfuscation of evil.There are countless ideas which are taught about the nature of evil. Every false idea is created by evil to hide truth from you. Evil is not darkness and it is not a frightening unknown. Evil is not some mystical psychology of man ,nor is it inherent in our natures. It is not supernatural, and it most definitely exists. As with all principles, the principle of evil is simple. Evil is the destruction of freedom. When free, you can build glory, peace, prosperity and joy into the world. Around you, you will find all these things. Men and women like you built these things. Evil enslaves. Evil is found in words such as force, compulsion, tax, violence, theft, censure, and politics. Notice that in such things, there is no joy. None have any value to humanity. Control Evil seeks to be a master over you. Evil wants you to be a slave. What we consider as real “slavery” is indeed only one form of slavery. The African slaves in the United States were compelled to work and toil for other people’s benefit. Their lives were mostly controlled for the benefit of the master, but they had some very limited freedoms. Some were able to create distinct traditions and maintain families. They did their best to build joy into their lives despite the tyranny wrought upon them. Because they were in control of portions of their lives, were they free? How much freedom does a person deserve? How much freedom can be destroyed before we recognize that it is evil? Slavery is not a concept of totality. Slavery exists wherever the freedom of man is destroyed. Theft and bullying are slavery. In history, African natives, Jews and many others have experienced lifelong slavery. The ultimate slavery is murder. Slavery stops people from being able to make choices for their own lives. Everything that restricts your mind, your movements and your speech is evil. Slavery is found in both the partial and complete destruction of freedom. Evil compels you to behave in manners that do not benefit you or those you love. Culture and law exercise overwhelming force in the name of propriety and public good. They destroy freedom, and put human lives under other people’s control.
Here is an excerpt from the book which answers your rhetorical question better MarkyMark:
Enforcement
There are times when authority must revert to violence in order to maintain obedience.
There will always be a small minority who refuse to obey the tenets of cultural law. Because of this, authorities employ a constant stream of violence known as law enforcement, or police. These are not police in the defense of liberty, but police in the defense of authority. Cultures always teach that liberty and authority are one and the same; but the design of police is to wield the weapons of violence in the preservation of authority, not to defend liberty.
Authority must also employ violence when cultures break down. Throughout history, people have slowly and steadily
learned more and more about their own worth, and hence demanded more and more freedom. Different cultures have fallen as people realized that culture is a lie.
When cultures begin to break down, it is because people are learning about their value. Such cultures and the authorities they protect are doomed. Never once in history has a culture in decline been redeemed. When authorities see that their culture is being dismantled, and obedience is no longer theirs to enjoy, they return to violence. These returns to violence are historically extremely brutal. The violent enforcement of law is a sign of coming liberty.
I just downloaded the book. Thanks for the link.
All I can say is that today’s LEO has to be a sociopath or psychopath; how else can they harass others and not be bothered by it? That, and they can’t be too smart; someone who’s too smart might QUESTION the validity of their orders, the justice of the laws they enforce, and so on-can’t have that!
Yep, and what about the politicians and bureaucrats that dream up ever more “laws” against any damned thing you can imagine. Sleeping in a car….on your own property…is illegal. Soon the bedroom police will be there to make sure you don’t slip into the “wrong hole”. How can there be sodomy laws while those extremist LGBT’s get elected? Are sexual acts only “wrong” when you are straight? This country has gone to hell and it can damn well take it’s politicians with it. I’ll help.
I once worked for/with a supervisor who made the statement “I think the cops should be able to come into your house whenever they want”. He was a dyed in the wool Democrat back when it wasn’t the curse word it is now. I asked if he knew of the Texas sexual laws and how you could be sent to prison for nearly anything at that time other than the missionary position. He had several kids and got this strange look(and color) and never replied or mentioned it again. Funny how that works since he was all for busting people who smoked something other than cancer-inducing cigarettes.
“Soon the bedroom police will be there to make sure you don’t slip into the “wrong hole”.
That’s exactly what’s gonna happen! It’ll start with some PSA telling the sheep that “sex kills via STD’s”; then it’ll be banned outright “for our safety”. Notice how the lack of reproduction would conveniently align with the Agenda 21/30 scheme; to gradually depopulate the planet. Yes, it’s all starting to make sense now…
I got a buddy who’s quite smart and quite libertarian. He got let go from a cop job on an administrative loophole and gave up on finding another after 10 years trying. Law enforcement carefully screens out free thinkers. I had a coworker gt hired as a state trooper. He dropped off our radar for a few months then popped back up to invite himself along to the gun show with us. It was transparent af that he was doing uc intel work on his former friends. THAT’S the type they hire nowadays!
Its operating a motor vehicle under the influence. I think in Florida you can sleep in your car drunk as long as you are not operating the vehicle- leaving the keys in the ignition with the radio on.