What is a Corvette?
Is it something other than another angular exotic that gets to 60 in less than 3 seconds? A Tesla equipped with the “Plaid” performance package can do that already. So can all the other exotics.
So what?
What else can the “electrified” Corvette GM has just announced will be forthcoming – in 2023 – do?
If all it does is emulate the quickness (and quietness) of the Tesla Plaid, et al – the same generically high-powered battery pack/electric motor drivetrain, the same absence of engine and thereby, all the specificity and emotional grab that goes along with it – then what is it if not a differently shaped version of the same thing?
If so, why bother?
Arguably, this is already nearly the case as regards the current, non-electrified Corvette. It is no longer front-engined, as Corvettes always were – and which made them different from the mid-engined exotics it now emulates in both function (no more manual transmission) and form.
It is hard to tell it is a Corvette – a problem prior Corvettes, like Hulk Hogan, never had. The front is all scrunched up; behind it an insectoid-looking rump, like squatting Praying Mantis.
Just like all the rest.
Historically, Corvettes were provocatively, immediately-identifiably long-nosed, Coke bottle’d sides tapering to one of the best-looking and most recognizable rear ends to ever conclude a car. It is a shape as definitively iconic as that of the Porsche 911, which it aggravated for generations by being the superior performer while costing half or less as much.
Now, how do you tell the difference?
There isn’t even the color-specific brand-differentiation that lets you know a superbike is a Honda (red) or a Kawasaki (green) or a Suzuki (blue) or a Yamaha (yellow). These, too, have been homogenized into dreary interchangeability, each rendering the others duplicative and implicitly irrelevant.
Seen one, you’ve seen ’em all.
Performance? Yes, more than ever. Superbikes and supercars. But is it everything? Is it the defining thing? Is it the thing that makes you feel something more than the same rush of speed common to them all?
Zero to 60 is certainly something.
It is not everything.
Ask the owner of a Miata – or a Lotus 7.
If all there is is how quick it is, there’s something missing. That thing that transcends the numbers. It is hard thing to describe but all of us know it when we see it. And so, feel it. Without even driving it.
A ’63 split-window Stingray had it. So did the ’68 “mako shark” that followed – and remained, more or less the same, but also different – straight through to 1982.
Even the controversial at-the-time 1984 “C4” (fourth generation) Corvette was unmistakably a Corvette and unlike anything else. Here’s an old Car & Driver review of that one, if you’re interested.
Visually, the only remaining tell that the latest Corvette is a Corvette are the vaguely familiar four tail-lights.
These seem afterthoughty on the supercar-generically-shaped body, much as the ’60s-era leaping Impala badge affixed to the flanks of the front-wheel-drive/V6-powered anonymous-box that last was called by that name seemed a disconnected attempt to re-establish an emotional connection long dissipated. Like bumping into an ex at the bookstore. Her name’s the same and she’s familiar – but it’s not the same and never can be, again.
But there was one thing left that was still uniquely Corvette. 
No other exotic was powered by the insolently excellent two-valve, not-overhead-cam and large displacement (6.2 liters) V8 that has long-defined a Corvette. This engine is fundamentally ancient, the basic configuration the same as that of the famous “small block” V8 that made its debut back in . . . 1955. It is cast in aluminum now rather than cast iron and the fuel is injected, electronically – but it still has just one camshaft. Lifters and pushrods. It does not have several or even one turbocharger. No power-adding, displacement replacing artifices.
And still it kills.
Easily. The big V8 is hardly working to produce almost 500 horsepower without a turbo (or two). And because it is not an exotic engine, a Corvette only costs about half as much ($60,9000 to start) as most of the exotics it aggravates. The average guy who can aspire to ownership – another thing that made the Corvette different – could probably afford to add a turbo or supercharger later on, to further aggravate the exotics.
He could probably install it himself, too – because the V8 is not exotic. Just good at humbling exotics.
But that is coming to an end – along with the sound that also made a Corvette different. The low rumble at idle that only a big American V8 makes, gone with the wind.
Sentence has just been passed.
The Corvette has been found guilty of internal combustion. Barring a successful appeal or injunction, its V8 engine will walk the Green Mile come 2023. That year – which is less than eight months from now – the Corvette will be “electrified.”
Thereby killing off any remaining reason for the Corvette.
An electrified Corvette will be just another skate – a body on top of electric underthings, not meaningfully different than the electric things under other electric things. This time, exotically priced, like the Tesla Plaid.
Without an engine – without a transmission, which EVs don’t need – what is left of what was the Corvette?
Just an echo of the past – reflected probably in those four vaguely familiar tail-lights.
. . .
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Like the new 911’s the Corvette EV will be less of a driver’s car
1973 Porsche 911 Carrera RS 2.7
The RS is the ultimate 911 and is special because of the way it drives. Sure it is rare and expensive, but it is the driving experience that elevates the 2.7 RS to icon status. The sound, the acceleration, the free-revving engine, the feel through the steering and chassis, the cornering poise, the wieldy dimensions, the look and smell of the thing. It is engaging, fun and it just sucks you in. Sure, 210 bhp and 188 lb/ft of torque doesn’t sound like much today but remember the RS Sport weighs only 900kg (2000 lb.) so that power is more than enough.
It is genuinely fast, in both outright acceleration and point-to-point pace. It hits 0-60mph in 4.9 seconds and tops out at 155 mph. It is small and narrow with deep windows and slim pillars, so there’s road to spare and you can see it all, it feels faster and the speed is more encompassing than in today’s models.
You can do 100 mph in a McLaren 720S and not even blink an eye. Doing 60 mph in the 2.7 RS it feels like 100 mph and you are enthralled by the experience. Too many modern cars of great pace slip up here; the 911 RS 2.7 is more usable and enjoyable than any of them.
It’s such an easy car to drive fast too. The rear engine and the plentiful high-revs torque simply make this a car steerable on the throttle. The sound is unmistakable – a deep bass driven yowl overlapped with fast-paced tapping and the rush of accelerated air. The higher the RPM, the better it sounds.
The Carrera RS earned a reputation as the ultimate driver’s 911. Even today, superlatives like thrust, pointability and adhesion are levelled at the Carrera RS driving experience. It’s raw, unadulterated air-cooled 911 at its most focused. The signature flat-six wail, as it passes through the 4500rpm mark on its way to the redline is one of the more iconic soundtracks and, with such low weight and respectable power, it’s still quick by today’s standards
the 911 Carrera RS 2.7 won world championship races including Targa Florio and the 24 Hours of Daytona where it beat all the prototypes.
None of the new cars including the supercars/hypercars can give you the same experience they are all over weight.
The quickest cars in the world usually weigh 2000 lb or less, a modern 3000 lb to 4500 lb supercar/hypercar will never be as fast, you can’t overcome that much extra weight.
To overcome the weight they add huge hp, this makes the car unstable so they control it with, stabilize it with AI, computers, they drive the car you don’t. These aren’t driver’s cars you are just along for the ride….
The new EV’s are worse they are all far over weight and they lack any emotion, you can’t hear, smell or feel these cars.
One auction result: 1973 Porsche 911 Carrera 2.7 RS Lightweight 9113600883 – sold for $1,402,500
https://www.supercars.net/blog/1973-porsche-911-carrera-rs-2-7-lightweight/
Paris suspends electric bus fleet after fires
https://tallbloke.wordpress.com/2022/04/29/paris-suspends-electric-bus-fleet-after-fires/?fbclid=IwAR0KFlCBCAPiAW8TaSWndrhsxyWPCA50ofTFshSjAw5RIrNQbNX5oe6HxH8
An electric corvette? I had to laugh my head off. That is like drinking warm, non-alcoholic beer on a hot Summer’s day.
Steam power
External combustion engines, steam engines, were dropped 100 years ago because they aren’t energy efficient
with EV’s we are right back to external combustion, boiling water, steam power. Why do it remotely? it is too complicated, expensive, wasteful.
Thermal efficiency of power plants using coal, petroleum, natural gas or nuclear fuel (boiling water to power a steam turbine to drive a generator, converting it to electricity) are around 33% efficiency, natural gas is around 40%. Then there is average 6% loss in transmission, then there is a 5% loss in the charger, another 5% loss in the inverter, the electric motor is 90% efficient so another 10% loss before turning the electricity into mechanical power at the wheels.
33% – 6% – 5% – 5% – 10% = 25% efficiency for EV’s.
(under not ideal conditions, like if it is very cold, it might be 12% efficient).
If you are just boiling water just bring back steam powered cars, do it in the car and skip the big expensive power grid, very heavy expensive dangerous battery, the charger, converter, electric motor, just have a steam engine, they have the same advantage as an EV, 100% torque at one rpm,
steam engines have another huge advantage over EV’s, The 1925 Doble Steam Car could out-accelerate the mighty Model J Duesenberg of 1930, doing 0 to 75 mph in just 5 seconds, with its engine turning over at less than 1,000 rpm, they are very low rpm, the tesla motor turns up to 19,000 rpm, these EV motors are way too high rpm, will wear out quickly . The tesla battery lasts ten years, the motors are probably worn out too.
If you want more secure, continuous mobility get a steam powered vehicle, there will always be some sort of fuel available, no other engine has that flexibility, the other advantages are, no spark plugs (ignition system needed), no cooling system, no transmission required, no electronics, 100% mechanical, goes 600,000 miles without an overhaul, the greatest dependability, lasts 100’s of years. 1500 mile range on 17 gallons of water.
EV is the worst choice, steam engines don’t lose 50% in efficiency in very cold weather, they don’t eat up more energy for heat for the car, they don’t need 1000 lb, very expensive, rapidly wearing out, dangerous batteries, they don’t take hours to charge, they aren’t dependent on non existing or defective chargers with huge lineups, they don’t have to be towed, just bring more fuel, they use multiple fuels, some fuels are free.
There is a new technology steam engine for your car or truck, etc., it is 30% to 60% energy efficient which is better then EV’s, gas or diesel engines. It has lower emissions then EV’s gas or diesel engines. If it burned hydrogen for a heat source it would be zero emissions.
It has full torque at one rpm so requires no transmission, it can run in reverse so no reverse gear required.
Cyclone Engine, a high-efficiency, modern American steam engine.
Cyclone Engine is a eco-friendly external combustion engine (EXE), ingeniously designed to achieve high thermal efficiencies through a compact heat-regenerative process, and to run on virtually any fuel –
from gasoline and diesel to green alternatives like locally grown bio-fuels, an “all-fuel” combustion engine that can operate on biofuels, synthetic gas and solar energy. It can also run off waste heat, like a truck exhaust system or geo thermal.
Old school steam power
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUg_ukBwsyo
The 1925 Doble Steam Car could out-accelerate the mighty Model J Duesenberg of 1930, doing 0 to 75 mph in just 5 seconds, with its engine turning over at less than 1,000 rpm, and it could sustain speeds of 95 mph right from the factory.Hughes’ did 133 mph in his tweaked Doble.
The tesla plaid motors runs at up to 19,000 rpm, that sounds dangerous, will wear out quickly.
Well, let’s just wait till it arrives before we render final judgement.
There’s potential here. (Or should I say “potential” potential?)
It’s gonna have to be really beautiful. And way faster than any Tesla ever imagined. Phenomenal handling beyond any previous street car. Legendary in every way, except for no ICE.
But it is going to be created by General Motors……and they will find a way to totally screw it up.
I don’t understand the logistics of this whole EV thing. Everyone will have to upgrade their power services to accommodate fast charging, there will be extension cords to trip over everywhere, we’ll need bigger lines (even bigger than they have to be, since for some reason everything just HAS to be underground these days), more power plants (and not solar ones), and somehow we have to get rid of all the constraints that plague our grid. Electricity doesn’t care how much generation capacity we have or how overloaded this line or that transformer is, the plurality of it will go down the lowest resistance path, thus constraints are born, and they only get more numerous the more load we’re pulling.
This can’t possibly work. That’s why the government has to subsidize it to force the issue.
With the speed limits on the Interstate varying between 60 and 80 miles an hour a vehicle that can lap Nuremberg at better than 7:04 is pretty meaningless and with some of the roads out their I hope it comes with skid plates or at least a fire extinguisher when the batteries get punctured. I’ve owned cars that were fast that handling was interesting and I’ve owned slow cars that were fun to drive. As I’m not the average car buyer I might be guessing when I say that most people buy a car that looks nice, handles and brakes great, with good overall performance.
I think the new Corvette will appeal to the same sort of person who would buy a HD Live Wire or in other words another vehicle that won’t sell to a lot of people that know better.
PS- Zora’s probably spinning in his grave at what they did to his pretty little sports car and remember nothing says sporty like a probable weight of about 3 tons……..
The internal combustion engine is the ultimate achievement in man’s quest to control fire.
Change my mind.
…and the most practical, efficient means of turning chemical energy into motion.
You hit on something here. A big draw of cars is the way they make us feel.
Why else would someone restore & drive a family sedan from the past? ICE is both past & present, a connection between old & new. They have a feel (some still do) and evoke an emotion.
Who doesn’t smile when their v8 powered car rumbles at idle or thunders when you go pedal down on the highway?
Cars are more than utilitarian appliances. People spend time researching and test driving before buying that car they really want, then they plunk down their money to buy something that in a way defines them.
You don’t get that from a go cart that you can’t tinker with to make it your own.
Let me parse a few quotes here:
“all the specificity and emotional grab that goes along with it.”
Eric, you’re making a profoundly emotional argument here, I’m going to offer some hard-nosed realism.
The problem is that emotional arguments are completely subjective depending on WHO is doing the “feeling”:
“It is hard thing to describe but all of us know it when we see it. And so, feel it. Without even driving it.”
“The average guy who can aspire to ownership.”
Exactly who is the “US” here? Who is the “average guy”? Frankly, and I hate to say this, but there is no more “us” and the “average guy” is now the “average gay” or the “average trans” or the “average woman.”
And the question is, what pushes he/her/xer emotional buttons? Because he/her/xer are the ones in power.
The Corvette was in many ways an icon of white male industrial power, the car for the hard-charging executive type who had a Playboy bunny air freshener hanging off his rear-view mirror, gold chains, an open shirt, and was banging his secretary on her desk after coming back from a three-martini lunch and smoking a pack of Marlboros a day.
Like or or not, those days are OVER. I am personally indifferent as to whether this is good or bad; I never had any money or power, so what always pushed MY emotional buttons were things that were cheap, thrifty, practical and reliable. I was never a babe magnet, never had money to burn, never had any status. So I am a bystander in this argument. Henry Ford marketed the Model T to farmers who felt that way. But GM marketed the two-seat (which screamed “NO kids allowed, just me and my woman!”) Corvette to the golden aged of post-war white male conspicuous consumption.
Detroit is not controlled by guys like Iacocca and DeLorean any more, it is controlled by Mary Barra and Pete Buttigieg. And they are going to produce what pushes THEIR emotional buttons, and that is “safety” and “climate change.”
The elites in our society during the 1950s, 1960s and 1970s were white guys who worked in heavy industry and nearly all of them were combat vets. In their free time, they were into things like hot rods, boats, guns, and airplanes.
Our elites today are not testosterone-fueled wrench-turners or engine-builders or guys who build their own guns or airplanes just for the hell of it. They are whores like Kamala Harris, grifters like Hillary Clinton, corporate axewomen like Barra, fake affirmative action jobs like Elizabeth Warren, racial grifters like Obama and gays like Buttigieg. In their free time they are going to be pedaling a bicycle with a safety helmet on during the pride march in Provincetown, not mounting blowers on big-blocks (no pun intended, Ms. Harris). These are not people who want to drive a fast, loud, performance coupe, they want an electric SUV with child seats and a bicycle rack.
I don’t like to have to say this, but a lot of things in life are about who/whom. People in power call the shots and dictate things. As Thucydides wrote, “the strong do what they will, the weak do what they must.” The people who designed and built those V-8 Corvettes fifty years ago were once strong. Now they aren’t. Feminism, gay rights and racial egalitarianism since the Sixties have profoundly redistributed power, and the “us” and the “average guy” Eric referenced above are on the losing end.
Trump was a “Corvette guy.” You could easily imagine him driving one with his arm around some hot Eastern European girlfriend on his way to bang her in the Presidential Suite of one of his swank hotels. (And look what they did to him).
You can’t imagine “Mayor Pete” or Elena Kagan driving one.
And that’s all you really need to know.
Dayum! That is some really real on the runny kine. The question I have is why. Satanic puppetry? Fiat money? Gov’t and/or a long march through “the institutions” in general? Trained to be middle class “nice”? Why do these people have the power to do this?
You are 100% correct in your comment. People have changed. I told Eric a long time ago. It hit me at a car cruise years ago…all old guys. They will soon will no longer be with us and with their passing is their passion for all things automotive. I hate to say this, but Eric what are you going to review if all the cars and trucks are the same?
Why do you think Eric hates these new cars so much? He might as well write reviews on washing machines and sail fawns if real drivers cars are forced to extinction. I was never into big cars or big engines preferring nimble gas sippers to deny uncle scam his gas tax. That being said I sure love other folk driving muscle cars and jacked up custom trucks. It’ll be a sad day when all the cars you see on the road will be silent CRV’s plodding along like grannies, terrified with range anxiety.
As for an electric vette… I hope it FLOPS like the Cadillac ELR.
Hi Oskar,
I will hold down the fort as long as I can! It may come to pass that there are no new cars worth talking about – if there are no longer anything other than electric transportation appliances left – but I doubt this will come to pass. We’re in a rough spit now – as Cuba was. As the Soviet Union was. It is unknowable how long it will last. But I do not think it can last forever.
I’ve still got tread on my tires and won’t be shuffling off anytime soon. Unless, of course, they engineer some sort of “accident” for me!
Guess where we are now on the “Tytler Cycle” and is this why I recoil in fear from cars so ugly they could stop a clock?
As I’ve gotten older, I’ve grown to appreciate the Corvette. I even like the way the modern Corvette’s look (and sound).
But an electric Corvette? Other than “virtue signaling”, what is the point? With that kind of a car, you get nothing that makes a ‘Vette a ‘Vette….. Sad.
Aliens on distant galaxies read EP autos, they mistake it for ET autos; flying saucers page.
They all keep reading to learn what it is all about before hop-skipping across the Universe.
Aliens need to stick around, they’ve got a lot to learn.
I tried with all of my might to be a vegan vegetarian, didn’t work. I dreamed one night I was eating a roast beef sandwich. After the dream, you go and eat a roast beef sandwich with mashed potatoes and gravy to make the dream come true. Nothing wrong with that. How to live, vegan diets are a death sentence. Enjoy life while you can, go for the gusto. Eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow may never come.
If you want to teach survival methods, a fast is recommended. You will find out what it’s like to be with an empty sto-match for a few days. However, your body and mind work the best and at optimum efficiency with good food, the best medicine, well, maybe laughter is first.
You are only hurting yourself if you deny yourself your culinary desires.
More musings, maybe even more wisdom, it don’t get no better. lol
Robert Palmer’s “Addicted to Love” is killer music.
A message to the great fraud Fauci: Fuck you, get off my back, ya dumbass. GFY
If you happen to see Fauci on the street, punch him in the snoot. Do it for the children.
The phrase “internal combustion” was developed to distinguish it from “external combustion,” such as a steam engine or sterling engine.
It’s therefore appropriate that EVs be referred to as “remote external combustion” vehicles. Yeah yeah, there’s also hydro, solar, wind and nuclear, but they make up a small amount electricity generation and they can negatively affect the environment.
Hi ML
External combustion engines, steam engines, were dropped 100 years ago because they aren’t energy efficient, with EV’s we are right back to external combustion, boiling water, steam power. EV = back to the stone age boiling water.
Switching from a 50% efficient diesel (or 35% efficient gas engine), internal combustion engine……….
to a remote external combustion (boiling water) 33% efficient steam turbine/generator with more efficiency losses over a power grid – 6%, at charger – 5%, at converter -5%, and at the electric motor – 10% to end up with a 25% efficient EV. (in very cold weather 12% efficient EV) now how stupid is that? there has to be a different real agenda here……One reason centralize everything for control…..
NOTE: Thermal efficiency of power plants using coal, petroleum, natural gas or nuclear fuel and converting it to electricity, boiling water which powers a steam turbine/generator, are around 33% efficiency, natural gas is around 40%. Then there is average 6% loss in transmission, then there is a 5% loss in the charger, another 5% loss in the inverter, the electric motor is 90% efficient so another 10% loss before turning the electricity into mechanical power at the wheels.
33% – 6% – 5% – 5% – 10% = 25% efficiency for EV’s.
(under not ideal conditions like very cold weather it might be 12% efficient).
An Ev is 25% efficient in turning original source of energy, petroleum in this example into mechanical energy to push the car down the road.
If you are just boiling water just bring back steam powered cars and skip the big expensive power grid, charger, converter, electric motor, just have a steam engine, they have the same advantage as an EV, 100% torque at one rpm.
EV is the worst choice, steam engines don’t lose 50% in efficiency in very cold weather, they don’t eat up more energy for heat for the car, they don’t take hours to charge, they aren’t dependent on non existing or defective chargers with huge lineups, they don’t have to be towed, just bring more fuel, they use multiple fuels, some fuels are free.
There is a new technology steam engine for your car or truck, etc., it is 30% to 60% energy efficient which is better then EV’s, gas or diesel engines. It has lower emissions then EV’s, gas or diesel engines. If it burned hydrogen for a heat source it would be zero emissions.
It has full torque at one rpm so requires no transmission, it can run in reverse so no reverse gear required.
https://cyclonepower.com/#
I can just imagine Buzz and Todd cruising down Route 66 in the electric Vette…yeah, right. They’d have to have a theme song from some Mario Bros video game instead of the one by Nelson Riddle…close your eyes and imagine…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbvsqtPmaHc
‘The Corvette has been found guilty of internal combustion.’ — eric
Busted again … for ’emitting’ again.
So the new she-vette has ‘transitioned’ to silent remote-emitting power, though its sound system is wired to voice fake moans and rumbles as if it still possessed a fat hot pipe downstairs.
Don’t get any fancy ideas about cruising this shiny toy through HBCs (Heavily Bidenized Communities), where its flash will quickly get you robbed, before it’s stolen right out from under you.
Nearly everything men love about cars is being legislated away much like manhood itself. I once owned a burgundy 1977 Corvette. I transformed it from a 180 hp lap dog into a wild wolf in my parent’s garage. The old Corvettes were works of art and true performers. It is a shame what progress will take from it.
And I’m sure it will run an extremely fast,extremely consistent ,and extremely boring,computer controlled ,quarter-mile time.
If this is the future of performance,I’m out.
The EV’s will never be the quickest cars because of the extra 1000 to 1800 lb for the batteries, ice will always be quicker, here is a good example……
Rimac Nevera electric vs Audi RS 3 vs new Tesla Roadster comparison
Rimac Nevera
1900 hp 4 electric motors
4500 lb.
1/4 mile 8.6 seconds
0 to 60 2.08 seconds
$2.8 million
https://www.hotcars.com/worlds-fastest-audi-rs3-drag-races-ken-blocks-1400-hp-mustang-hoonicorn/
Audi RS 3
A brand name new Audi RS 3 starts off at a base price of $56,200 in the USA, MSRP.
You can buy and tune an RS 3 for less then a tesla plaid or a lot of other supercars, hypercars and it is quicker
one gas engine 1100 hp
3000 lb
this RS 3 ran an 8.17 second quarter mile.
0 to 60 1.3 seconds.
2023 Tesla Roadster
With a 0-60 mph time of 1.9 seconds,
a quarter-mile time of 8.8 seconds
$200,000
You can build a Mk. IV Supra like this one with 750 hp for not a lot of money that’ll run 10 second 1/4 miles all day long. I’d much rather have that 2JZ beast that one of these anodyne dorkmobiles.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hM-1FLY_18
The best handling cars are the front engine rear transaxle cars, some examples:
The C5 to C7 Corvette, The 924/944/968/928 Porsches, The Nissan GTR, The Mercedes AMG GTR, The Porsche 924 Turbo Carrera GTR, multiple Ferraris, Lexus LF A, etc..
Another reason the Porsche 924 Turbo Carrera GTR was a great car is because it weighed 2000 lb. you can’t get a 2000 lb sports car anymore, an exception is the ultralights like the Super 7.
1980 Porsche 924 Carrera GTR 375 hp 0 to 60 = 2.9 sec. 9.95 sec 1/4 mile curb weight 2000 lb and perfectly balanced…..because of government regulations you can’t get a 2000 lb car anymore, they are all overweight whales, weight is compensated by huge hp which makes them unstable so they have to driven by AI, computers, horrible things.
Recently the quickest street legal car on the Nurburgring was the Mercedes AMG GTR a transaxle car.
A comparison of the 911 to the transaxle Porsches
Air cooled Porsches have great sound but transaxle 924/944/968 are better in every other way, better handling, 911 understeers 924/944 doesn’t, 911 snap oversteers, 924/944 doesn’t, 924/944 turns in better, 911 wanders around at high speed, 924/944 is planted, very stable at high speed, doesn’t wander around, transaxle is better then midengine because it doesn’t snap oversteer.
The C5 to C7 Corvette handled very well because it was a transaxle car, the C8 is midengine, transaxle is better then midengine because it doesn’t snap oversteer, so it is a step backwards.
A C5 to C7 Corvette is one of the best track cars because they are transaxle.
https://corvettestory.com/1997-Corvette-C5-Chassis-Suspension-Hydroformed-Side-Rails-Rear-Transaxle-3.php
The Corvette turned into an overweight AI computer driven whale but it had the great V8 rumble and a stick shift was available, the EV version won’t have any sound, they will ruin it completely.
The best driver’s cars were made between the 1950’s and 1980’s, totally analog you had to drive them.
You have to have a way to generate electricity if you want a battery-powered electric vehicle.
Can’t depend upon a million volt lighting strike to charge the EV by happenstance, you need a steady supply of usable electricity. What counts the most-est.
If you are in the business of making cars and then selling them, you have to have a product that people will buy. Only so many Corvette buyers, only so many Cadillac buyers. Not all car buyers buy General Motors vehicles.
If you are an electric vehicle fan, you’ll maybe buy one. Elon is building two new plants to build electric cars. The plants are machines, engineered facilities. Well, they’re supposed to be that way.
I doubt you are a Luddite if you remain an ICE fan, you don’t have to buy any kind of vehicle if you don’t want one. Paul Homewood over at Not A Lot of People Know That was not happy with his purchase of an electric vehicle.
If you want a 250 horsepower diesel engine for your articulated 4-wheel drive tractor for farm work, you’ll choose the machine with the 250 horse power diesel engine, what you want to get the job done. Tractors can be programmed to drive themselves in a grid fashion in fields. Started up in Saskatchewan in Canada. They do work.
You won’t want the electric tractor that will run short of power in like five hours. Maybe a little riding lawn tractor can be battery-powered, works there.
If you refused to use a tractor when they are available to be used and you only use horses and mules, you might be a Luddite, well, Amish anyways.
Has to be increased carbon dioxide in the atmosphere during winter in the northern latitudes. There are no leaves on deciduous trees, no crops are growing, cold temperatures prevail, no growth of leaves and grasses means carbon dioxide has to be accumulating in the air.
You need humans driving cars with ICE’s that can throw excess heat to warm the air during winter months and keep belching out more carbon dioxide. Nice to be in a warm place when the weather is not cooperating. Makes perfect sense. Too much carbon dioxide due to low uptake of carbon dioxide by plants unable to do so during the winter months will be your fault.
If you don’t pay your carbon tax, you’ll be crucified or something. Never mind.
Spring comes around and the bleak winter conditions wane while the growing season finally arrives.
Coldest spring weather ever seen is here today.
There is a foot of snow on the ground, never seen anything like it is all my born days. Global warming needs to get here soon. Can’t get here fast enough. You know how the lying warmunistas lie all of the time.
Solar Cycle 25 is a Grand Solar Minimum. The sun is in control, not humans.
Maybe one day in the future, the Corvette Museum in Bowling Green, KY will have a “stupid idea” gallery that’ll include the elek-tro-vette.
Personally, I never understood the appeal of the Corvette…to each their own.
Not a Corvette fan boy BUT I agree with you that once GM went to the mid engine platform anything that made the Corvette “different and special” disappeared.
And now with an electric Corvette, why bother?
I get why engineers love the mid-engine layout since I’m a fan of IndyCar and in a lesser sense, F1. No extra weight of a driveshaft, transmission, etc. Somewhat better weight distribution (the great mass of the car is towards the center of it, rather than hanging out either end), and you can hide the engine in the aerodynamic “shadow” of the driver, and have a lower nose line (and narrower for race cars).
But for street cars, at some point the styling line is ruined since you have to hack in somewhere to let air into the radiators. The Corvette and Audi in your triple picture show that. I don’t even know what the third car on the bottom is, nor do I care.
When mid engined sports cars were rare (Ferrari, Lamborghini, Lotus), they were unique and exotic. When EVERY manufacturer has a mid engined sports car, they are like sedans or CUV/SUVs, they all blend together. Just my two pennies.
TL/DR: Mid Engined Corvette is dull, electric Mid Engined Corvette, why even?
The fastback Fiero GT was a very sleek mid-engine car. The only cutout on the rear was a small grill right behind the drivers door for a true cold air intake. The radiator was placed way up in the nose tilted forward to allow for a very low wedge shaped bumper. Only a very small “grill” was needed in the nose for fresh air with the majority being scooped up by a chin spoiler near the ground. Early non GT models relied on the chin spoiler exclusively. Coolant was circulated through stainless tubes running underneath the rocker panels. I think most of the scoops and vents on sporty cars are just for looks and probably serve no function. Owned a fiero gt for 20 years and got a solid 28mpg with the 2.8v6 running the snot out of it. Never had an overheating problem. Well made cars exceping the creaky 80’s gm interior.
Hi Po,
Big Fiero fan myself – although I’ve not owned one myself. I have always wanted a GT with the V6/manual. They are now getting hard to find; wish I’d picked one up 20 years ago, when they were abundant – and affordable!
I bought mine around y2k as my first car for $1800 american pesos! It was a 4 speed manual from early ’86. I sold it in the middle of 2019 to escape the vortex of evil (new england) for the redneck paradise of NWFLA. Best decision I ever made. I miss that little thing but it was worth it to get the hell outta there especially since the hoax was unleashed. Made it out just in time to avoid the faceless commie hoarde. Wish I knew you wanted one, would have gladly drove it down to VA for you if it got immortalised in writing. Oh well, keep looking! Most people don’t see them as the awesome classics they are so they’re still relatively cheap.
Dammit, Po!
I wish I’d known it, too. About the Fiero, I mean. There’s one around here owned by a local guy who used to take it in to the shop my buddy owns for service. I haven’t seen it in about two years – since the beginning of the “pandemic.” Hoping he’ll surface again. It’s a red GT with the V6 and in apparently good overall shape.
I miss cars like it – interesting/different cars. Now the “difference” are chiefly – this one’s got a 12.3 inch LCD touchscreen vs. that one’s 11 inch touchscreen…
But there are occasional exceptions. This week, I have the new Maverick to fool around with. I like this little mo’ fo… more soon!
Can’t wait to hear your take on it! I’ve been interested in the maverick from day one since it may just usher in a new era of cheap lightweight trucks. I’ve seen reports that the maverick hybrid has exceeded the MPG numbers from ford. Better mileage than even the Mitsubishi Mirage you reviewed recently for not much more cash in a way more practical package. I’ve got an 06 Ridgeline right now for an all round git-er-done appliance but the gas mileage has me riding the mocycle more for the savings than the pleasure. If the maverick looks easy to wrench on and generally good I’ll pick one up in the future when the hybrid batteries start to fail and they reach rock bottom prices. Always love a solid fixer-upper.
It will be interesting to see if the death (electrification) of the auto industry will be soundly rejected by the purchasing public. I think it will, when drivers start running out of power not quite where they wanted to go. When the tow truck shows up with a gas burning charger to let you limp along until you can get to the nearest hours long charging station, and probably wait in line due to the number of cars needing more charge. NAW, give me internal combustion, I enjoyed driving my straight 6, four speed, four wheel drive Ford pickup towing a three thousand pound machine behind on a trailer. Full confession, I have a Lincoln hybrid getting me 40-50 MPG, which get traded in before the batteries begin to deteriorate.
These EV’s just added another 1000 lb on to already overweight cars.
The quickest cars in the world usually weigh 2000 lb or less, a modern 3000 lb to 4500 lb supercar/hypercar will never be as fast, you can’t overcome that much extra weight.
To overcome the weight they add huge hp, this makes the car unstable so they control it with, stabilize it with AI, computers, they drive the car you don’t. These aren’t driver’s cars you are just along for the ride….
In 1961 F1 cars weighed 450 kg 990 lb, in 2022 700 kg. 1540 lb.
The Porsche 919 hybrid EVO 850 kg 1873 lb
The VW IDR EV race car aboiut 907 kg. 2000 lb
Porsche 917 30 845 kg 1863 lb.
Double A fuel dragster about 1400 lb.
The answer? Buy an ultralight like a Super 7, or a Super 7 clone, around 1200 lb. and totally analog no driver assists…you have to drive it, and more fun then any other car.
Over weight EV’s = no fun….
I actually like the new Corvette and understand the reason for switching to a mid-engine layout. It’s a great car with the small block and the Z06 takes it up a notch with that well-engineered flat plane crank V-8 that sounds awesome in racecar guise. It sucks that it doesn’t have a manual, but the car is well put together and is probably the best handling American road car ever built. GM engineers are some of the world’s best when it comes to sorting out a great suspension setup, if allowed by their management.
As for electrification of the ‘Vette, puke. What difference is one battery-powered lead sled from another, except battery-draining performance, range and charging times? I hate that we’re staring at the abyss of an economic meltdown, but maybe that will slow down or stop this push toward electrification?
I’m not buying a new car ever (EVs suck and are expensive and useless for transportation) and will focus on keeping my family’s four vehicles on the road for the foreseeable future.
Here’s a question Eric: Why have all of the buff books gone full-on EV fanboi after expressing a healthy skepticism of EVs initially? EVs will kill automotive enthusiasm and I think that is the point.
I do battle constantly with the EV fanbois in the comment sections and their rationalizations over the drawbacks of these soulless, glorified golf carts are hysterical.
Hi Dr –
In re “Why have all of the buff books gone full-on EV fanboi after expressing a healthy skepticism of EVs initially?”
For the same reasons the general “media” pushes “masks” and “vaccines.” The people working there are tools, agreeable ones. They are paid to say/write what they say… and that is determined by the owners of said “media.” They being the advertisers. Think CNN & Pfizer.
Well, it’s just the same with the fanboi car “media.” They get paid by the major automakers – via ads and such. Their coverage reflects who owns them.
Incidentally, I say this as someone who knows this. I have worked inside the “media” and saw how the thing works. I have been approached to shill – and be paid well.
Luckily, I am too irritable to be persuaded!
Hi Eric
Do you know Jason Cammisa and Derek Tam-Scot? automotive journalists, all in on the EV narrative push…..they work for big media……
Hi Eric
This is one of the few places that anti EV people can share real accurate info about EV’s. On facebook etc., the pro ev forums ban censure harass anybody with anti ev info, but the anti ev boards allow all the pro ev trolls to come in and harrass and spread the ev lies. The same thing happened with the official fake germ narrative, not one word was allowed against the official bs narrative…..no freedom of speech allowed.
Eric…” I am too irritable to be persuaded”….Thank the car gods for Eric Peters.
Thanks Zane – and for all you peoples, too!
I mean that. I am inspired and educated by the commenters here. Daily. So may good people, offering so many good (intelligent, thought-provoking) comments. I doubt I could do what I do and I know I could not do it as well without ’em!
Are they killing the ICE corvette when the E version comes out?
Like you, I loved that long nose on the old corvette, and all the reasons you stated why it was different. The new one? Could care less, don’t like it one bit.
“…found guilty of internal combustion.”
Great line, Eric.
The question is: will the government rent seeker Elon Musk restore free speech to America? I say he will play the crowd for a bit then… quietly do the bidding of uncle sam and his left-wing customers of his electric products.
Also I read that Twitter runs too much data capacity than can be justified under their books, which means Twitter might have been getting a free ride from data centers by uncle sam. Elon might find this out as soon as he tries to give back Trump his twitter account.
Hi Hans,
I begin to regard Musk as I have Orange Man. Both are seductively appealing in that they will say something that people desperate to hear someone in a position of power say, in favor of liberty and so on… and then they do things contrary to the same. I know it gets old to bring up the Hitler card, but that’s just what the chief did, too. He would speak a certain way, to certain audiences… and then another to a different one… and then do something else. In this way, he bamboozled enough support to become Reichskanzler – and by then, of course, it was too late.
I’d be more inclined to give Musk the benefit of the doubt were it not for his Tesla operation, which is among the greatest – maybe the greatest – rent seeking scam, ever. And more dangerous than others because it has been the means by which this “electrification” juggernaut has been pushed. He had plenty of PayPal money to found Tesla on his own dime – and if the concept had market value, he could have found both investors and buyers. Instead he used the government – to mulct other car companies and cattle-prod the market into EVs.
Hi Eric,
I agree 100%. Elon will quietly cave by providing the illusion of free speech while turning the *gain* down on libertarian ideas and turning the *gain* up on Marxist ideas. Easy thing to do behind the curtain and will please his government masters.
Electrified Corvette…is just another pantsuit. Doesn’t matter if it is Hillary or Kamala wearing it is saying the same thing….we comply and genuflect to your gods of climate change.
Hi Eric,
Regarding someone in power saying something that people desperately want to hear, candidate Trump said the USSA should end the forever wars and get out of NATO, a statement which I heartily agreed with. President Trump on the other hand didn’t do a damn thing about any of that in four years. Perhaps if he had followed through with getting rid of long past its expiration date NATO we wouldn’t be having the present kerfluffle-possibly escalating to nuclear war-in Ukraine. Just another lying politician.
Also Eloon is a trans humanist….. I don`t trust him …not one little bit..
Also, Eric, this same, Elon Musk also wants to put implants in people’s brains starting this year.
If you can believe the articles out there…
The numbers boys will love it. Those people who brag about their cars in terms of dyno charts will love it. Those reviewers who get to run press cars around Laguna Seca on media day will love it.
Investors will park it.
Most of the people who aren’t going to buy the current Corvette aren’t going to buy this one either. GM built the current ‘Vette because they wanted to run the Nürburgring with Ferrari and Porsche. But they forgot that 90% of their market is North America, not Russian oligarcs and CCP officials. We drive in straight lines, not rings. This will give you that steel roller coaster launch feel though, and for some that might be enough.
The other day a video review of the Rivian e-truck came up on the YouTube rotation. The guys took it out to a drag strip where it proceeded to smoke just about everything on the track. By a lot. Just incredible to watch, but not unexpected. This will be what everyone does with this thing. Trailer it to the drag strip, punch the button and brag about how great they are. People will probably try to mod them to get an extra fraction of a second, and will probably fry windings and feeder cable too. And will be fun to watch as motor bearings seize up and catch fire.
Hi RK,
In re “numbers.” Incredibly ephemeral; next year’s better – as in computer processing speed, a bigger screen, etc. Then the last year’s numbers (and products) become a forgettable throw-aways.
The Corvette has become a kind of fraud. A car for people whose main skill as drivers is ramping up the launch control and flooring the accelerator.
I’d much rather have a Viper… with a manual transmission.
I’ve always been a “go fast, slow” driver, ever since learning to drive on a 1.8L Dodge Omni with a 4 speed. Keeping the weels on the ground and dealing with the massive understeer while keeping in “the powerband” was part of the fun. Keeping a late ’90s Viper on the track is much more about driving than knowing how to put the damn thing into Launch Mode with the least number of “oh wait…” mistakes.
Of course people probably said the same thing about the joys of driving a Stutz Bearcat after the open cockpit days were over…
Jay Leno has a Viper he really likes it, it was a totally analog car, you had to drive it, it was also in the cars that want to kill you list, so a great car, a modern Cobra
There will also be videos of the poor guy that tried to tow his boat to the lake in his E-truck and not making it, and worse being stuck on the side of the road, with a boat, with no relief in sight. Can’t wait.
GM: Gutless Motors in business to serve its new master, the government, instead of its soon to be former customers. We have a real example of government’s role in the private sector; if it moves TAX it, if it keeps moving, REGULATE it and if it stops moving, SUBSIDIZE it.
I wonder, how much will the Corvette’s battery weigh, and how will that weight affect handling? Not well I presume. And so much for spending a day driving twisty, hilly, two lane blacktop, lest you get out of range of a charging station.
Split-window coupe was 1963.
Meanwhile, over at Dodge…
https://www.foxnews.com/auto/dodge-reveals-chief-donut-maker-150k-salary
“Kuniskis said Dodge was chosen to be one of Stellantis’ lead brands in the transition to electric vehicles because the muscle car brand is like a burger joint in a vegetarian world and if it can make a salad that everyone wants to eat, then everything is going to be OK.”
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot…
RE: “a salad that everyone wants to eat” LOL.
Before all the Burger Kings closed I sampled an Impossible Whopper. It tasted, well, like a Whopper, in that most of the flavor of a Whopper isn’t from the meat anyway. Wasn’t worth the premium price for sure.
Being bean-based, the Impossible Burger™ left its mark later that evening. I’m talking “dinner scene in Blazing Saddles” bad! I mean, I love a good fart as much as the next man, but holy cow! (holy legume!)
https://youtu.be/VPIP9KXdmO0
Hi Anon,
Of course, that’s exactly the opposite – as regards Dodge. Which was the only brand selling something different. Now it wants to sell the same. That’s real smart. MBA smart…
We destroyed the
villagebrand in order to save it.Why can’t I get a job like that.