I was thinking aloud the other day about how they can do whatever they like – while we are allowed to do what they say and are punished when we don’t.
We know who we are, of course. We are the ones who are expected to obey the rules laid down by them. The rules they ignore with impunity. It is, accordingly, easy to know if you are one of us – or one of them.
Did you get punished for not wearing a “mask”? Then you are one of us.
Were you declared “non-essential” – by them? Then you are one of us.
Do you have to pay what they say you “owe”? And if you do not (and sometimes, even if you do) are you certain to be punished for it? Then you are one of us.
Are you being forced into an electric car you cannot afford to buy and do not want to drive? Then you are one of us. They continue to be driven around in luxurious “gas hogs” – and have “carbon footprints” larger than Lizzo’s rump.
If you toss a gun you lied on the forms to get into the trash, where anyone might find it and do anything with it (including something criminal) would you be going to jail for it? Then you are one of us. If you did it – and they did nothing about it – then you are one of them.
Just a few examples – or cases-in-point – to make the point. We know very well the rules – and consequences for not abiding by them – are different for us than they are for them. It is now blatantly evident.
This latter is a good thing, though, in the sense that it is now obvious that we and they are not the same. More to the point, it is no longer possible to entertain the degrading delusion that we are – and we’d be fools to continue to indulge it. They have depended for generations on us being fools. They succeeded, for a very long time, in fooling most of us. In getting us to believe there was no us – and them.
Just us.
They even had he effrontery to state it. As in “we are all in this together.” No, we are not. And never have been. We have been duped – a different thing.
Failing to recognize this is a worse thing. As it is for the steer who does not recognize the intentions of the rancher. 
The “refugees” – as they are styled by them, to make us feel ashamed for objecting to these hordes flooding the country, to be used against us by them – recognize it and understand and act on it. They don’t give a flip about the rules – and good for them! We could learn something from them. They ignore the rules as a matter of course, understanding it is not in their interests to do so and (more to the point) why should they do so when it is evident that only fools do?
They say, screw the rules!
They do not beg permission from them to drive. They just drive. They do not waste their money on taxes – including the ones levied for the profit of legalized mafias, such as the insurance mafia. They do what they like – and do their best to avoid being caught.
For they are not fools.
Is it not time for us to stop being fools, too?
. . .
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Wow. I had no idea we had so much in common with the ruling class, but you put it so succinctly in the first paragraph:
They are free to do as they like, and we are free to do as they like.
>>> Were you declared “non-essential” – by them? Then you are one of us.
Do you truly believe that all jobs are essential? If some sort of natural disaster or global pandemic was happening is a hostess at Bob Evans as essential as doctors and nurses, engineers running the power grid, soldiers, police, etc…?
>>> If you toss a gun you lied on the forms to get into the trash, where anyone might find it and do anything with it (including something criminal) would you be going to jail for it?
No one goes to jail for lying about the about using drugs on an ATF form. They only prosecute people for that if they commit some other crime with that gun.
>>> Did you get punished for not wearing a “mask”? Then you are one of us.
Good. I’m glad you people were fired or whatever punishment occurred. Fuck you for putting other people at risk because you’re having a hissy fit about being told what to do, like a petulant spoiled brat.
>>> They continue to be driven around in luxurious “gas hogs” – and have “carbon footprints” larger than Lizzo’s rump.
This will probably change as there are less and less gas powered vehicles to buy. When GM stops making a gas powered GMT-T-whatever-it’s-called SUV then people will buy whatever the EV replacement is.
>>> Do you have to pay what they say you “owe”? And if you do not (and sometimes, even if you do) are you certain to be punished for it? Then you are one of us.
Other than parts of Somalia and rural Afghanistan, Antartica, and international waters can you provide an example of a place where you wouldn’t be compelled, under penalty of jail or worse, to pay taxes of some kind? How would any government exist without the ability to tax (and force people to pay those taxes)?
Somalia!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Will Garland:Good. I’m glad you people were fired or whatever punishment occurred. Fuck you for putting other people at risk because you’re having a hissy fit about being told what to do, like a petulant spoiled brat.”
If masks are effective and you had one on why would you care if I didn’t?
If the common areas were so dangerous, why wouldn’t you avoid them?
If masks worked so well why did nearly everybody catch covid with all the forced masking?
The point of wearing a surgical mask is to contain the majority of the spit cloud you generate while speaking or coughing. It’s to slightly reduce the transmission rate to other people, not really to provide protection to the person wearing it. Depending on which study you look at, masks decreased transmission by about 10-20%.
The only masks that actually provide substantial protection to the wearer are properly fitted N-95 (or better) masks.
Will writes:
“The only masks that actually provide substantial protection to the wearer are properly fitted N-95 (or better) masks”
And yet, any old bandana would do – proving it was not about “health.” It was about compliance.
And demoralization.
Anyone who still defends what was done is evil. Or a tool of evil.
Jesus. You are the apotheosis of everything I warn about: A vicious, entitled, angry psychopath who thinks his feelings entitle him to have others do violence to people he dislikes.
I doubt you’d do that in person.
A “hissy fit about being told what to do.”
Thank you for providing another case-in-point as regards what’s wrong with this country. Or rather, what’s wrong with people like you.
Libertarians seem to have a reverse definition of psychopathy. Having a completely amoral “I’ll do whatever I want, fuck everyone else.” attitude is more or less the definition psychopathy.
The psychopath would think: Why should I wear a mask? I’m relatively young and healthy, I’ll be fine. Besides – I’m the boss! I’m not going to let anyone tell me what to do!
Will,
It’s false that libertarians advocate “I’ll do what I want and, fuck everyone else.” I defy you to find a single example to support your claim.
We do advocate leaving peaceful people in peace. We advocate not harming those who have not caused any harm. In agreeing to disagree – and live and let live. We do not believe anyone “owes” anyone anything other than respect for their equal right to be left in peace and not harmed if they do not cause harm.
But these are very different things.
I did not wear a “mask” because (a) I was not sick and so could not get anyone sick and (b) because “masks” do nothing meaningful to prevent the spread of respiratory infections and (c) because they became a tool to tyrannize people.
The latter was particularly vile. The kind of thing that psychopaths do.
What is wrong with the owner of the property being able to decide on what precautions to take? A private store owner can decide to require or not to acquire masks and the customer can decide if that’s where they want to shop. Outside it doesn’t make any difference as most experts agreed. In government buildings they would have required masks, as would be the choice of the government decision makers. In hospitals they might require masks or not. In a free society why is that not the best option.
You mentioned masks prevented 20-10% of transmission. That is disputed and would be hard to prove either way. Masks certainly did not do much about stopping the spread. Nearly everyone got it. It might have been better to not do anything, let it spread through the population until herd immunity was reached, as now.
Hi Cashy,
Will, like all-too-many others, does not support free association and also thinks private property is a “public accommodation” (per the Supreme Court) even though it is – obviously – private property. If you cannot choose to associate (or not) with whomever you like, then you are in the same position as a minor child, under the supervision of a parental authority. If you are not free to open (or close) the doors to your business to whomever you wish, for any reason you like then it is not your business – and you are the employee of the owner of the place.
Every government is founded upon its usurpation of authority to kill you if you disobey.
Every person’s job is essential to themselves and their family.
The point is we are adults, not “spoiled brats”, and are fully capable of taking such matters in our own hands. We have no need of being told what to do by a gang of psychopaths.
One or another vehicle maker will continue to make exactly the vehicle the Psychopaths In Charge ask them to, or else.
“How would any government exist without the ability to tax (and force people to pay those taxes)?” Exactly! governments are nothing more nor less than psychotic criminal gangs which decided it would be more economical to settle in place and collect tribute.
Compared to governments, ordinary criminals are no more than an inconvenience. I will give them credit for the effect of their propaganda, that we can’t get along without them. That and killing people are the only thing governments are really good at.
“The ‘refugees’… recognize it and understand and act on it. They don’t give a flip about the rules.”
Well, good. Too many of the rules are ridiculous, onerous, codified thievery and intrusive interventions as we here are well aware.
It seems so many who would call themselves “conservatives” and libertarians actually have much more in common with your typical “refugee” than they think. Often times, illegals (aren’t we all “illegal” when our lives are scrutinized heavily enough by The Powers?) start their own businesses doing landscaping, cleaning, construction etc, and be paid “under-the-table”, avoiding the government’s sticky mits, just like most of us would like to do.
It occurs to me that these people would often make useful allies if that could be accomplished. Of course, there are others who come to be fed and be “taken care of”, but it appears that people of this sort are actually more often multi-generational “Americans”, sadly enough.
>Of course, there are others who come to be fed and be “taken care of”, but it appears that people of this sort are actually more often multi-generational “Americans”,
That’s what I am seeing, BaDnOn. Of course, we do get the riff raff, just because of the sheer numbers involved, but most of the recent immigrants I have seen are very hard working people, who come here to live the “American Dream.” The people who *REALLY* piss me off are Americans who take advantage of the immigrants by underpaying, or otherwise cheating, them. Now that is really low.
A Mexican citizen of my former acquaintance told me that, in Mexico, people are used to transacting business “bajo del agua” (under water, i.e. off the books) to avoid taxes. He said it is common for real estate sales to have an officially recorded price (which is heavily taxed), whereas the “real deal” includes significant amount of money paid in cash, on the side, to cut the government out of it.
Having earned my living in the construction industry in SoCal, I have seen *plenty* of “cash” payments with no withholding, but I always regarded it as sort of like pure, “uncut” drugs, which, by the way, I do not do. A little bit of the pure, “uncut” cash is unlikely to hurt you, but the more you take, the greater the likelihood of getting busted by the IRS, who will show you no mercy.
The “cash” payments tended to show up near the end of a recession, such as in 1983, the tail end of the infamous Reagan recession. Some contractors had bid jobs “down in the dirt” to get them, at prices which meant they were unable to pay the union wages to which they, as signatories to the master labor agreement, were obligated. Hence, “off the books” payments, in cash, were common, until the economy stabilized.
One company I worked for was running about $25,000 per week in cash payroll (1983 dollars, remember) at one point. This clearly could not continue indefinitely. It was actually a “split” payroll, with some employees getting a normal paycheck, with deductions, while others of us got greenbacks, with no deductions. The owner, an (otherwise) honest man, would show up on the jobsite in his Cadillac with a bag of cash and a .357 to protect it. His son, a USC student, was the payroll guard.
The way they phased out the cash payments was to give those of us getting paid in cash tasks which did not pay very well (all assembly operations were piecework), to induce us to quit. It worked.
It worked the other way around, too. I had a co-worker at that time, a U.S. citizen, who had spent a year in Australia, working off the books, because he was in Australia on a tourist visa and was not legally allowed to work in that country. But, *somebody* was willing to give the Yank a job. 🙂
At the height of COVID hysteria, when authoritarian politicians had face diaper mandates in place and/ or public spaces closed, ordinary people who REFUSED to comply or enforce it at a business they owned were FINED by state or local government or ATTACKED by local “law enforcement”. However, many “elected officials” openly broke their OWN mask rules they had imposed on the masses. There’s that video of fmr House Speaker Nancy Pelosi getting her hair done when salons in her district were under orders to be CLOSED, as well as fmr President Barack Obama having a party with a LARGE group of people, NONE (IIRC) wearing a face diaper.
And now they wish to BAN gas vehicles and gas stoves for the public, claiming it’s “Gotta be done right now! because ‘Cliiiiiiiiiiimate change'”, while THEY would exempt THEMSELVES from such a ban. They’re also pushing to SEIZE private farms and foist consumption of bugs and lab grown food on the public, as well as seizure of private homes through eminent domain.
Don’t forget the parties where the ruling class attendees were not masked, but the hired help were.
>And now they wish to BAN gas vehicles and gas stoves for the public, claiming it’s “Gotta be done right now! because ‘Cliiiiiiiiiiimate change’”, while THEY would exempt THEMSELVES from such a ban.
I bet I know how they will exempt themselves from the “evil gas stoves” mandate.
First, restaurants will be exempted, because “chefs” (who are not mere “cooks”) will claim (probably correctly) they cannot get the desired results using electric stoves. So, there will be an exemption for “commercial kitchens,” along with elaborate (and expensive) ventilation requirements (per OSHA) to “protect the culinary workers.”
Next, there will be a provision in the building code which allows a “commercial kitchen” in a private residence, provided it is built to “commercial kitchen” $$$tandards. Et voilá, “commercial kitchen” (“has a gas stove”) will become an expensive status symbol for high end housing. Meanwhile, we “little people” will be required to cook our food using electricity.
Liberty: The state of a free person; exemption from subjection to the will of another claiming ownership of the person or services; freedom; — opposed to slavery, serfdom, bondage, or subjection of any person.
Only exists for the extreme wealthy in the claimed land of the free
The word government definition: govern = control,,, ment = mind. And they do it so well in Merica.
If government disappeared and along with it wealth transfers the you owe me groups would be rioting in the streets
as everyone expects something.
You have to realize that the psychological operation is ongoing and fluid.
A set up, a trick, all lies and deception.
A trap, you were snared.
Who would fall for a stunt like that? Ooh, ooh, I know, I know!
Today is June 25th. In the year 1876, some fool name George Armstrong Custer foolishly rode and marched to the Little Big Horn and was promptly shuffled off from his mortal coil.
Vaccinated by two bullets, one to the head.
It was a trap.
The Cheyenne and Lakota Sioux finally resisted.
Happy Custer’s Last Stand Day!
Little Bighorn National Monument –
sponsored by The Arrow Shirt Co.
(too soon?)
The advantage the refugees have in resisting the rules is that don’t have much to take. The best weapon the government has over the rest of us is our accumulated wealth and possessions. The more impoverished we are made the easier it will be to resist.
There is a lot of talk about “not bending the knee” yet I’m sure very little action by those saying it. It’s much easier to whine about something then to actually do it. And I understand why.
“ Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient Causes; and accordingly all Experience hath shewn, that Mankind are more disposed to suffer, while Evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the Forms to which they are accustomed. ”
The advantage the invaders have is that Uncle leaves them alone.
Heh, when I still lived in the People’s Republik Of Nueva York, I sold some
just off the boatjust out of the trunk Mexicans a used car out of my storage yard on junkyard row. On that day, the fuzz had taken up a position on that street just to the west of my yard, looking to nab speeders and people rolling through the newly erected stop signs. I warned to Mexicans to go east, as they were driving the car away with no plates (a big no-no in NY that will quickly get you pulled over and your car impounded)- Told them how to easily get to where they were going via the alternate route without encountering the fuzz. So what do they do? They leave the yard, driving the plateless car, and go EAST, right through the fuzz gauntlet…and made it through with absolutely no problemo. You or I would have been immediately stopped; the car impounded, and would have had to deal with a slew of repercussions.Dammit! Meant to say “They went WEST”
Cashy,
It annoys me when you say things like: “There is a lot of talk about “not bending the knee” yet I’m sure very little action by those saying it.” I never wore the god-damned “mask.” I walked into stores and so on and looked the bastards in the eye and told them no. I will never wear a “mask” – nor take any drugs I do not freely wish to take. I will never accept CBDC or gun confiscation. I am not a brave man. But I am not a pussy, either. There are many of us. Including those of us who stand up to being told it is “necessary” to hand over money to scumbag rent-seeking corporations like the insurance mafias.
I’m with you Eric. I’ve been engaging in acts of defiance whenever I can. I never wore a mask and chose not to do business with any outfit that insisted I do. The tag on my rv expired last year, and I will not give the state one more damn dime for the privilege of owning something that’s actually on the road maybe 2 or 3 times a year. I gave up my homeowners insurance after the bastards refused to pay me for damage from hurricane Irma, about 5 years ago. I got 2 speed camera tickets last year in DC and they went right in the trash, and I’ve finally decided that I’m smart enough to decide whether I can go through an intersection or turn onto a street all by myself. I don’t blow through without slowing down, but I no longer sit there and waste gas when there’s no traffic around just because some government installed light is a certain color. Im not brave either, and I’ve certainly been called a pussy plenty of times, but im just sick of getting played and ass fucked at every turn. Will my little acts of defiance change the world? Of course not, but we all gotta start somewhere.
haha, I do the go through the light thing all the time. It started because I’m on my motorcycle a lot more lately and rarely does the auto-light thing pick it up, so I just go. I am routinely driving/riding off hours, so do it a lot now.
Of course I do a cursory look to make sure no cherry tops are around, cause if they are awake they would certainly pull me over. And they’re harder to spot now with a lot not wearing ‘cherry tops’ anymore, but their cars are all usually very similar, chevy tahoes, ford explorers, etc… and I tend to know where they sit.
I do it with my kids in the car too and at first they protested, but not anymore. That was fun. They’ve learned how/why/where to break BS rules.
Amen, Mister!
This is how it begins. And if enough of us start, we can end it. I continue to try to explain this to Cashy. Dick, of course, is a hopeless case.
You don’t have to buy home insurance if you own your home. If a bank owns your home, they will require it to protect their investment.
I paid off my home in 1998, but still voluntarily buy insurance to protest my equity.
You could buy auto insurance for a day, or a week, or a month, to register a car or truck, and then cancel it. Lot’s of people in Detroit do that.
Most people would voluntarily choose to buy home and auto insurance, although they may want less coverage than is currently available. That’s why I would do, if I had a choice.
Richard,
“You don’t have to buy home insurance if you own your home. ”
Yet. Wait. I own my car. Yet I am forced to “cover” it.
This is one of my several logical/moral objections to forcing anyone to “cover” anything (excepting in the case of a car or home you have not yet paid off; obviously that is another matter).
People like Cashy will say that even if I own my home, I might not be able to pay for damages in the event of a major “accident,” such as fire. Then, “society” will be left holding my bag (so he says) and so “society” has the “right” to force me to “cover” my house against the possibility of loss. Never mind that in that case, I lose for sure as opposed to maybe and probably not. Let’s say I am forced to pay “only” $1,500 annually for home insurance. Over 30 years, that will amount to $45,000 (not counting opportunity cost).
Add in the cost of car “coverage” over 30 years. Plus “coverage” for health care. It probably exceeds $100k. Imagine what a person might have done with that money. Imagine how much wealthier – financially secure – he would be. Instead, he had (past tense) “coverage.” And now has nothing to show for it.
By and large, “coverage” is a con – leaving aside the thuggery. The insurance industry – and it is an industry – uses fear to exaggerate risk so as to maximize profits.
Why are many people barely able to make ends meet? It is because they have so much “coverage.” Which leaves not much for anything else.
Sixty years ago, most people did not have any “coverage.” Maybe they had a life insurance policy. Otherwise, that was usually it. Were most people as broke – as in debt – as they are today? The question answers itself.
“Yet. Wait. I own my car. Yet I am forced to “cover” it.”
And why in hell are you required to buy liability insurance on each and every vehicle you own, as if you could drive them all at once? The liable party is me, not the vehicle. Insurance is a scam. Even the very few not for profits out there, if there are any since it became mandatory.
Indeed John, that is the biggest “gotcha” having to have coverage for each vehicle, when the insurance should be applied to the driver. As you noted, no matter how many cars you own you can only drive one at a time. Just another way the insurance mafia gets govco to aid in mulcting the public.
Not arguing about whether you should have auto insurance. But if you do you should have coverage for each vehicle. Auto insurance is mostly about getting the vehicle repaired in case of damage. Different vehicles cost different amounts of money. And someone else can drive a vehicle and still be covered so each vehicle needs to be covered. I don’t see how you can get around that?
Hi Cashy,
Liability-only “coverage” pays only for damage you cause to someone else; whatever the damage to your vehicle, you pay for it. In this case, it is entirely reasonable to have just one liability policy for everything you own – as opposed to being forced to “cover” every single vehicle you own (as I must).
I appreciate your spirit in standing up to the man and telling the old lady at the store you will not wear a mask. You could do the same for auto insurance, do as the poster suggested buy auto insurance for a day, or a week, or a month, to register a car or truck, and then cancel it. Why wouldn’t you do that if you wanted to avoid paying?
Who says I haven’t, Cashy?
Me gusta!
I don’t ask. And I don’t tell.
Used to do that when I was a kid, 17/18 years old. There was an insurance agent in town, named Clem, don’t remember his last name, but he specialized in getting low or no down payments on insurance policies. Common knowledge, go to Clem to get your insurance paperwork with little or nothing down, take it to the DMV to get your tags, and then, of course, never pay the premium when the insurance company sent the bill. This was back in the 70’s, the tags were good for 2 years. No computers or anything like that, so nobody ever caught up with you. Clem was a good guy, come back in two years and he’d start the cycle for you all over again. Even if you got stopped by the cops, you had paperwork showing you were insured, they had no way to know it was canceled. Massachusetts is a small state, I remember reading that nowhere in the state is more than 40 miles from another state. I was about 25 miles from Vermont, which didn’t have mandatory insurance for a long time. I knew more than a few guys who went up there and rented a post office box and registered their cars with Vermont tags, no insurance necessary. Ah, for the good old days before big brother knew every goddamned thing we do.
Dang, Floriduh man, you had to do that in the 70’s?
I thought the insurance requirement scam was newer than that (!) as here in Iowa that fuckery didn’t start until the late 80’s.
Hi Floriduh,
Those were the days, as the song says, I knew the owner of a local gas station back then and I could just buy my saaaafety inspection sticker from him without the annoyance of having to bring in the car; lots of others did the same. When the state added the “emissions” test and required your registration be entered into Big Brother’s computer that came to an end. Now I get an email from my insurance company reminding me to get my sticker promptly, else they’ll cancel my policy and rat me out to the DMV.
Hi Mike. I think just about everyone in MA knew someone who could get them a sticker without actually having the car inspected. I remember at one point my brother had a 67 Mercury Monterey and I had a 64 Ford Galaxy. They both had the same wheels and tires. Between the two cars we came up with 4 decent tires that would pass. So we put the 4 good ones on his car and then he went down to get his sticker. Came home and swapped all the good ones onto my car and then I got my sticker. Kind of the way you had to do things back then, we didn’t have money for new tires, and certainly nobody I knew had a credit card back in those days. On the other hand, it was a whole lot easier to fuck with big brother when he didn’t have computers and cameras and databases.
Cashy,
I stood up to anyone who tried to “mask” me – and was prepared to fight over it, if it came to it. But the point is I did not obey. All too many did.
Like Richard, for instance.
“ The advantage the refugees have in resisting the rules is that don’t have much to take “
Yep, exactly. Another facet is “equity” in law enforcement which translates into non-enforcement. Street racing is out of control (several deaths) in western WA now the libs are in a jamb, needs to end but since it’s not the tax paying “Amish” out of control they’re squirming on enforcement. The last statement in this news release sums it up:
https://www.king5.com/article/news/local/seattle/seattle-city-leaders-crack-down-street-racing/281-c52d2372-fc0d-47f0-a05d-13e0b241b661
“ The proposal does require an equity analysis before any cameras are installed… “
Which really means nothing will be done.
“ The advantage the refugees have in resisting the rules is that don’t have much to take. The best weapon the government has over the rest of us is our accumulated wealth and possessions. The more impoverished we are made the easier it will be to resist.”
Exactly right, Cashy. In the words of Janice Joplin, freedom is just another word for nothin’ left to lose.
Hi Cashy,
I ask this out of true sincerity…what libertarian values do you hold dear? You mentioned in several posts that you were Libertarian, but about the agenda drew you to it?
Hi RG,
I think – if I am remembering it right – that Cashy told us he is on the “dissident right.” I am not sure what that means as he seems to not “dissent” from anything that is Left. From forcing people to buy the services of for-profit private businesses to defending what was done to people during the “pandemic” by malicious “experts” and “authorities.”
Now, I do not want to be overly hard on him. He may be a Millennial and – if so – he has grown up in an authoritarian system he may never have learned to fundamentally question. Perhaps we can help him do that.
If he is willing to hang out at this site for a year or two I would be willing to bet his mind could be changed. 🙂
I hope so, RG!
Cashy seems like he might be ok.
Reply to Raider Girl: Thanks for asking.
I have always been a proponent of personal freedom. I have been involved in the Libertarian party for 30 years, trying to get people elected, you know, not just bitching about lack of freedom on the internet chats.
Two things have become clear. 1. We are moving in the opposite direction of freedom right now, the chances of any meaningful movement in that direction in my lifetime is nil.
2. The absolutist argument for freedom breaks down into a call for anarchy. The concept of a completely free world with no forced funding for even basic communal services has not been solved.
To that end I have tried to find ways to move in the direction of more freedom. Stuff like school vouchers, concealed carry laws, etc. None of those are true freedom, just a small step in that direction. Unfortunately, the way the internet works is that if you want to take small steps toward freedom because you think that is the best way, you are in reality a fascist that wants to enslave everyone with your naivete or stupidity.
I have found out that “libertarians” on the internet don’t want to “change minds and hearts” they realize that will never happen, what they want instead is to vent their frustration over the situation by attacking anyone unlucky enough to engage in conversation about the issues they say they want to “convince” you to understand.
Actually, the situation is pretty typical of human nature. Heck, I used to be like that. If you go to a Libertarian convention a lot of people are like that.
Cashy,
“The absolutist call for freedom.”
Why must you misrepresent my position? I have been arguing that it is wrong to punish people who’ve not caused harm. You might describe that as an “absolutist” position, but it is not what your statement implies – which is that I endorse “doing whatever the hell you want” (the original Clover used to say that). I do – but only to to extent that harm is not caused. If it is, then the person must be held accountable. But no one else.
How often must I explain this distinction to you?
And: When have I ever criticized incremental steps in the direction of freedom? My criticism is reserved for the reverse. For the steps in the direction of statism (of fascism) that you advocate taking.
I truly do not understand your ardent defense of using government power to force people to hand over money to private, for-profit business in context of your supposed “dissident right” politics.
The “Libertarian Party” is kind of an oxymoron, or at least problematic. You can’t have a “Party” without someone being in charge, without some group of people deciding who’s going to run, without some bunch of assholes deciding what the agenda is, etc etc. That’s not libertarian, that’s just a different kind of control that maybe gives some people a little more freedom than they have now, but they still have to follow your rules. I, on the other hand, like most of the people on this site, am the real libertarian. You know how many people are in my libertarian party? One. Me. As long as I don’t harm you or your property, what I do is none of your fucking business, and what you do is none of mine.
RE: “You can’t have a “Party” without someone being in charge, without some group of people deciding who’s going to run, without some bunch of assholes deciding what the agenda is, etc etc. That’s not libertarian”
I disagree.
There can be traditions and such guiding a ‘party’. Bionic Mosquito discussed such at great lengths but I’m too tired to find the exact article.
https://www.lewrockwell.com/author/bionic-mosquito/
His point was, the N.A.P. is not enough.
There has to be more.
Ya can’t be an island alone in a sea of people.
And, if there’s only one person in a room, it’s not a party, man.
…It’s more like,… hiding?
The Libertarian party is an abject failure. First because it can’t field a competent candidate, and second because it “believes” the system is fine, if we could just get our guy elected. Which is probably why they can’t field a competent candidate. I joined it many years ago, and never renewed membership once, because I realized the stupidity of it in fairly short order.
RE: “because I realized the stupidity of it in fairly short order.”
…So, what’s missing?
…What needs added, rearranged,…. whatever?
Bionic Mosquito writes about the, ‘what’.
The only questions are, will people add ‘it’, see, ‘it’?
I dunno, just the view from here. Currently, it’s all fucked up, that’s for sure.
“Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient Causes”
I’m afraid that our “causes” are a bit more than “light and transient”. The FedGov has “borrowed” over 32 trillion dollars in our grandchildren’s name, for example. People have been compelled to finance their lives with credit cards by the resulting inflation. Many now living in their cars. They flirt with turning the planet into a cinder to massage their ego. There is no end to the evil they are capable of, being psychopaths. Their power based on their assumption of authority to kill us if we disobey.
There is no such thing as good government, never has been, never will be.
Case in point, in the history of this nation, there have only been about 20 years during which the US military has not been actively engaged in killing people, often residents of their own nation. In fact, in the so called “Civil War” they killed about 650k of those residents, more than all casualties from all other wars combined. And immediately after, turned their expertise toward the plains Indian’s extermination. They are NOT the good guys. The only difference between them and Mao or Stalin is scale. They didn’t have a large enough population to exterminate as many. Who has killed the most people on foreign soil over the last 30 years? Russia, China, or US/NATO?
They are predators and vampires Cashy, they don’t know how to do anything good. Much less have a desire to.
Indeed, John –
“light and transient causes”?
Crikey! We live under an oppression beyond the imaginings of the Founders. The British Crown was practically libertarian relative to the federal government. The Crown did not tax income. It did not force a man to pay for the “education” or the “health” of strangers; did not force him to buy “coverage” or “contribute” to a government retirement scam. It did not tell him what sort of home he was allowed to build. It did not interfere with his right to travel, anywhere he liked. He was free to carry arms without having to beg permission.
Every single justification adduced by Jefferson in the Declaration to make the case for separating from England is applicable in triplicate (at least) today, to the government we suffer under.
Cashy has to be very young. If he is over 30 I will be surprised.
I pray he is very young, and still has has desire to educate himself.
Ok genius, enlighten me. If there has never been good government, and the government we have now is bad, what is it you are looking for other than to bitch about how things are?
Cashy,
What you present as an argument is in fact a fallacy. We do not pine for “good government.” That is utopian. We (libertarians) pine for no government as an ideal – and as little as can be achieved in the meanwhile. You have given in to government – in mind and spirit. So much so that you endorse government involvement in things government (in this country) never involved itself in, until rather recently (so, spare me the ancient history rebuke). You might argue that having a system in place to keep the peace, to assure contracts (and property) are respected and criminals punished is a necessary good. This was the position of most “conservatives” – until all too many of them gave up and became Leftists in everything but name. Endorsing the noxious idea that people who haven’t harmed anyone may be punished because fearful people worry harm might be caused.
I’m looking for folks to realize how absolutely horrible government is, and but a square bit in its mouth, if not send it to the glue factory. It’s mostly comprised of murderous, evil psychopaths who take pleasure in the pain of others. It assumes authority to murder you if you disobey. And it certainly assumes that authority over the rest of the world.
Just for starters.
”put” a square bit in its mouth
I particularly like how this objection to King George currently applies.
“He has erected a multitude of offices, and sent fort a swarm of officers, to harass our people and EAT OUT THEIR SUBSTANCE.”
> The Crown did not tax income.
Neither does the U.S. government. The incorrectly named “income tax” is actually a tax on productivity, not income. Those who derive the bulk of their income from such activities as trading stocks and bonds are privileged to pay tax at a lower rate, which is styled “capital gains tax,” provided they “play by the rules.” Hence, expensive “tax advisors.” (No offense intended, RG.)
Of course, penny ante “interest” on savings by ordinary citizens is taxed as “ordinary income,” at the “productivity tax” rate. Can’t have the peasants accumulating wealth, now can we?
All hail public education, the longest running and most successful psy-op in the history of the species.
You’re not kidding. Worse than ever these days. It is changing our country for the worse. I certainly see it in my urban area, but I have been very surprised to see it in my rural area too. The different is the rural folks are attempting to do something about it. If you want to effect change, invest your time/money in alternate education. I believe we are obligated to do so.
Which is why I convinced my son and daughter in law to home school, with remarkable results. When the subject of expense came up, I told them that simply teaching them to read, write, and do basic math and turning them loose would be an improvement over public schools. My grandson had behavioral issues while in public school, gone now.
Sad[der] thing is, the majority of the sheeple have been so inculcated with the idea that the [s]elected Mafia is deity, that if one dares to keep the fruits of their labor and endeavors that they are ‘cheating’ the government nd committing a mortal sin.
If one managed to avoid paying ‘protection’ to the Sicilian Mafia, would they be ‘cheating the Mafia’?
If one managed to preserve their property by whatever means from being liberated by a mugger or robber, are they ‘cheating’ the robber?
But yet, if you manage to avoid being the victim of the biggest and most malicious band of organized criminals, you are a ‘dirty criminal’ and your neighbors will gladly agree with those criminals, and cast their vote to indicate that you should be punished by the same criminals which they are also the victims of.
Liberty can not be achieved amongst a society comprised of such people, because such a society does not value liberty or even know what it is.
I believe Karma catches up with Them.
Witness the OceanGate CEO’s demise thanks his own hubris this week.
*Old* lib money. So old that the hyphenated last name reflected two signers of the Declaration of Independence found in the family tree.
It’s sad that they all died, bur I think Darwin awards are appropriate.
The political party in power, when Democrat, does not operate under different rules. The rules are the same for them, but they rarely get prosecuted when they break the rules. Meanwhile, Republicans are prosecuted whenever possible, sometimes even when they did not actually break any rules (Donald Trump). The January 6 prisoners are an example of actual political prisoners … which is one element of fascism.
Hunter Biden does play by different rules, but he had paid most of his back taxes years ago — $2 million — so the remaining taxes due were not large enough for a prison sentence.
And lying on a gun registration form very rarely leads to prison time. … ” … according to newly revealed Justice Department records, the odds of being charged for lying on this form are virtually nonexistent. In the 2019 fiscal year, when Hunter Biden purchased his gun, federal prosecutors received 478 referrals for lying on Form 4473 — and filed just 298 cases, according to data extracted from the U.S. attorneys’ case management system. That’s out of approximately 27 million background checks undertaken in a 12-month period.”
SOURCE:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/06/09/lying-atf-gun-purchase-form-yields-few-prosecutions-new-data-shows/
The main problem with the Hunter Biden investigations is the IRS is ignoring the $5 and $10 million bribes he got for influence peddling that probably were “tax free”. In addition, Hunter also wrote off hookers and sex club fees as business entertainment expenses.
One of the biggest examples of “us and them” is the climate change leaders flying on private jets to global climate conferences. And their generally huge carbon footprints, with multiple large homes in the US and elsewhere. They tell everyone CO2 is evil, and then generate huge amounts of CO2 themselves.
Duh? You really do not “get it”. Richard, they lie. Accept that fact and move on, I have.