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gail
08-15-2008, 09:01 PM
William Shakespeare wrote; “To be, or not to be that is the question.” Hamlet 3/1). This is a classic statement used in many forms of jest. I use it today in the context of “If only”
If only I could impart to others my feelings of patriotism. The love of my country runs deep. Not because I think she is perfect, because I know that she isn’t. I love this country because she is mine. I will work to help perfect this great country in every way that I can.

I have noticed that the countryside of the USA is varied and beautiful from the shores of California to the New York Island and all areas in between this great nation. I have been in 48 of these great states. Only the Dakotas are the only ones that I have missed. I have been all across this great nation, and do you know what makes her great? Us. We, the people are who make this country grand. We too are flawed, but most of us try hard everyday to maintain our lives and families. We - you and I - are good honest people, and we are greater than our nation’s imperfections. We have the ability to rid the government from slack, ineptness and corruption.

However, if we just sit in our own little space and complain the problems will become worse. There is never a vacuum in life, if we do nothing - someone or something will rush in to fill the void.

"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." Edmund Burke (1729-1797),

So my question to you is if we do nothing are we the evil element?

Some of the readers of this column are not US citizens, and yet some have voiced a dislike for my country. Have you visited here? Were you treated badly or are your opinions made up from what the media prints or airs on TV? Is your vision clouded with half-truths, myths and out-right lies about the USA?

Is there the possibility that those without a belief in GOD do not honor their country, and if this statement is true, then does it mean that they do not honor their families as well? What causes some people to feel loyalty and others void? Who decides where to draw the line and for what reasons?

Jim Rose
08-16-2008, 12:30 AM
>>Is there the possibility that those without a belief in GOD do not honor their country, and if this statement is true, then does it mean that they do not honor their families as well? What causes some people to feel loyalty and others void? Who decides where to draw the line and for what reasons?<<

Why are you so concerned with what other folks believe. You have no way of knowing what anyone believes unless you stick you unwelcome nose into business that is no concern of yours.

gail
08-16-2008, 09:07 PM
>>Is there the possibility that those without a belief in GOD do not honor their country, and if this statement is true, then does it mean that they do not honor their families as well? What causes some people to feel loyalty and others void? Who decides where to draw the line and for what reasons?<<

Why are you so concerned with what other folks believe. You have no way of knowing what anyone believes unless you stick you unwelcome nose into business that is no concern of yours.



Rudeness doesn't become you, Jim. Besides why would you take my wonderings personally?

DonTom
08-17-2008, 12:13 AM
"Is there the possibility that those without a belief in GOD do not honor their country,"

Some of the most evil people ever strongly believed in God & religious nonsense. And sometimes hate their own country. Take Osama Bin Laden for an example. He doesn't think much of Saudi Arabia , yet he's very religious. He even refuses to live there, because he hates this own country so much.

"To what great evils has religion been able to impel men!"
-Lucretius

"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal


-Don Quoteman

Jim Rose
08-17-2008, 01:07 AM
>>Is there the possibility that those without a belief in GOD do not honor their country, and if this statement is true, then does it mean that they do not honor their families as well? What causes some people to feel loyalty and others void? Who decides where to draw the line and for what reasons?<<

Why are you so concerned with what other folks believe. You have no way of knowing what anyone believes unless you stick you unwelcome nose into business that is no concern of yours.



Rudeness doesn't become you, Jim. Besides why would you take my wonderings personally?

I don't take them personally-- you make them personal for everyone! Your problem is that you simply can't leave folks alone. If that statement is rude to you, then you probably are guilty!

gail
08-17-2008, 12:47 PM
>>Is there the possibility that those without a belief in GOD do not honor their country, and if this statement is true, then does it mean that they do not honor their families as well? What causes some people to feel loyalty and others void? Who decides where to draw the line and for what reasons?<<

Why are you so concerned with what other folks believe. You have no way of knowing what anyone believes unless you stick you unwelcome nose into business that is no concern of yours.



Rudeness doesn't become you, Jim. Besides why would you take my wonderings personally?

I don't take them personally-- you make them personal for everyone! Your problem is that you simply can't leave folks alone. If that statement is rude to you, then you probably are guilty!



Guilty? Guilty of what? I don't think so. What I do think is that Eric has given me this column to RANT, and he has even personalized it for me - Gail's Rant. What is the definition of the word RANT? It means to scold violantly. Also to talk/write in a declaratory, grandiloquent, or impassioned manner, or to reproach angrily and abusively, and even, if you will, pretentious inflated spech or writing.

Now I would imagine Eric has allowed me this vent for his amusement, as we all know that he rarily shares my views on life, libery and the pursuit of happiness. So, until Eric pulls the plug on me I will continue to post my take on the daily news, commentaries, my beliefs, politics, and occasionally a motorists issue (but usually only to boast about my long past accomplishment). I welcome most, if not, all comments. I am always polite and courteous in my replies. You are free to ignore me, or comment as you wish, but not to flame me. I respect you, please respect me. Thank you one and all.

In the meanwhile -- buckle your seat belt, it's going to be a bumpy ride. 8)

Jim Rose
08-17-2008, 05:51 PM
>>Is there the possibility that those without a belief in GOD do not honor their country, and if this statement is true, then does it mean that they do not honor their families as well? What causes some people to feel loyalty and others void? Who decides where to draw the line and for what reasons?<<

Why are you so concerned with what other folks believe. You have no way of knowing what anyone believes unless you stick you unwelcome nose into business that is no concern of yours.



Rudeness doesn't become you, Jim. Besides why would you take my wonderings personally?

I don't take them personally-- you make them personal for everyone! Your problem is that you simply can't leave folks alone. If that statement is rude to you, then you probably are guilty!



Guilty? Guilty of what? I don't think so. What I do think is that Eric has given me this column to RANT, and he has even personalized it for me - Gail's Rant. What is the definition of the word RANT? It means to scold violantly. Also to talk/write in a declaratory, grandiloquent, or impassioned manner, or to reproach angrily and abusively, and even, if you will, pretentious inflated spech or writing.

Now I would imagine Eric has allowed me this vent for his amusement, as we all know that he rarily shares my views on life, libery and the pursuit of happiness. So, until Eric pulls the plug on me I will continue to post my take on the daily news, commentaries, my beliefs, politics, and occasionally a motorists issue (but usually only to boast about my long past accomplishment). I welcome most, if not, all comments. I am always polite and courteous in my replies. You are free to ignore me, or comment as you wish, but not to flame me. I respect you, please respect me. Thank you one and all.

In the meanwhile -- buckle your seat belt, it's going to be a bumpy ride. 8)


Pardon me for not realizing that you have a license to be a big PITA--- and I have a permit to dis your rant!

gail
08-17-2008, 06:47 PM
Pardon me for not realizing that you have a license to be a big PITA--- and I have a permit to dis your rant!

You'e welcome 8) Pssst -- what's a PITA?

Jim Rose
08-17-2008, 08:20 PM
Pardon me for not realizing that you have a license to be a big PITA--- and I have a permit to dis your rant!

You'e welcome 8) Pssst -- what's a PITA?


Being that you asked, I guess it will be allright to say that ---Pain In The Ass--- PITA

gail
08-17-2008, 08:57 PM
Pardon me for not realizing that you have a license to be a big PITA--- and I have a permit to dis your rant!

You'e welcome 8) Pssst -- what's a PITA?


Being that you asked, I guess it will be allright to say that ---Pain In The Ass--- PITA


Hey, that's good. Now that you know that I'm fully qualified and licensed - May I continue? :-\

gail
08-17-2008, 09:11 PM
"Is there the possibility that those without a belief in GOD do not honor their country,"

Some of the most evil people ever strongly believed in God & religious nonsense. And sometimes hate their own country. Take Osama Bin Laden for an example. He doesn't think much of Saudi Arabia , yet he's very religious. He even refuses to live there, because he hates this own country so much.

"To what great evils has religion been able to impel men!"
-Lucretius

"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal


-Don Quoteman



Yes, Don, there are some evil people who claim to be religious and some even that wear the monikers of a Christian.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.(New Testament | Matthew 24:24)

This is sad, but true. Each of us can know our own heart and even then we can be desceived.

9 ¶ The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
10 I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

(Old Testament | Jeremiah 17:9 - 10)

Most people who turn against God, faith and religion have had a bad experience or feel guilty about their behavior. Think in terms of other walks of life -- do you stop driving a car because of recalls, do you stop going to school because there are bad teachers, Do you stop shopping at stores because corporations are tainted? Some people believe, but are just too lazy to get up and get ready for church. Each of us must choose our own way in life - I have chosen to follow Jesus and His teaching. This gives me peace, and confidence.

15 And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.

(Old Testament | Joshua 24:15)

Jim Rose
08-18-2008, 02:37 AM
>>Hey, that's good. Now that you know that I'm fully qualified and licensed - May I continue? <<

Why do you ask now--you never have in the past!

DonTom
08-18-2008, 08:51 AM
"Most people who turn against God, faith and religion have had a bad experience or feel guilty about their behavior."

IMAO, only the exact opposite is true. People who feel guilty about "their behavior" often turn to religious nonsense so they can feel forgiven. Catholics have their confessions so they no longer need to feel the guilt. Some others might have to be "reborn" so they no longer have to feel guilty. Other religions have their ways to do the same thing.

And they often continue their behavior, because they will be forgiven no matter what as long as they strongly believe in their superstitious nonsense.

This is why:

"A Christian is a man who feels repentance on Sunday for what he did on Saturday and is going to do on Monday."
--Thomas Ybarra

-Don Quoteman

gail
08-18-2008, 02:53 PM
"Most people who turn against God, faith and religion have had a bad experience or feel guilty about their behavior."

IMAO, only the exact opposite is true. People who feel guilty about "their behavior" often turn to religious nonsense so they can feel forgiven. Catholics have their confessions so they no longer need to feel the guilt. Some others might have to be "reborn" so they no longer have to feel guilty. Other religions have their ways to do the same thing.

And they often continue their behavior, because they will be forgiven no matter what as long as they strongly believe in their superstitious nonsense.

This is why:

"A Christian is a man who feels repentance on Sunday for what he did on Saturday and is going to do on Monday."
--Thomas Ybarra

-Don Quoteman


It is human to err and divine to forgive. Everyone feels guilty about something, and wishes that they could have another chance to make better choices. I have certainly made my fair share of bad choices. The crux of the issue though is to stop the behavior that one knows is wrong or harmful. A person can never reach perfection in this life, regardless of how together they may appear.

You and I both know that it is wrong to "confess," and feel forgiven if a person plans on continuing bad behavior. Some behavior is downright evil. We read about these behaviors everyday in the daily news. Some behavior is purported as evil when it is not, and at times evil behavior is deemed acceptable. Who judges? Some laws are laid out by our justice system, others are from our childhood training, and sometimes we came up with our own set of right and wrong. Some people love rules and regulations, and others hate any form and strive for anarchy.

But do you know what I like best about my religion? It gives me purpose, and it gives me guide lines. When Joseph Smith was asked how the Mormons became such an honest and hard-working group of people, he replied, "I teach them correct princles and they governed themselves." Why do I go to church on Sunday? It gives me the opportunity to take the sacrament. During this time of reverence it gives me the time to reflect on my goals in life, and how I can better myself. I quietly bow my head and pray to my Heavenly Father. I thank him for the many blessings that He has bestowed on me, and pray that I will always be mindful of others not as fortunate. To share what I can with others. I pray for His blessings on others, including you, I pray for health and happiness too. I pray for strength to do the things that I should do, and to resist the temptations that come my way. I pray to be the best that I can be.

DonTom
08-18-2008, 06:37 PM
"Everyone feels guilty about something, and wishes that they could have another chance to make better choices."

Could be, but if you have learned from your mistakes than feeling guilty is a waste of time to even be thinking about it.

-Don-

Dave Brand
08-19-2008, 11:45 AM
Some of the readers of this column are not US citizens, and yet some have voiced a dislike for my country. Have you visited here? Were you treated badly or are your opinions made up from what the media prints or airs on TV? Is your vision clouded with half-truths, myths and out-right lies about the USA?


I am not a US citizen; I have visited the USA for both business & pleasure. I have also visited a couple of dozen other countries; the more I see of the world, the more similarities I find - people are people, wherever they live. The sort of jingoistic tribalism which you continually spout is, along with your, & other, nation's blind religious fundamentalism, the biggest problem the world faces. I've never voiced a dislike for the USA; what I have voiced is an abhorrence for your country's continual warmongering. Whatever the problem, killing people is not the answer.

Tell me, Gail, how many countries outside the USA have you visited? How many languages do you speak?

ColleenC2
08-19-2008, 12:28 PM
The sort of jingoistic tribalism which you continually spout is, along with your, & other, nation's blind religious fundamentalism, the biggest problem the world faces. I've never voiced a dislike for the USA; what I have voiced is an abhorrence for your country's continual warmongering. Whatever the problem, killing people is not the answer.

As the era of Nationalism around the world is replaced with Globalization the need for "police" powers becomes more and more evident. Whether by collective resolution of the other countries or because the United States "stepped up to the plate" and took on the role is not relavent, the fact is the United States is the arm of Globalization that embodies the "military might" so that all countries conform. It is not by the U.S. standards that dictates this but by all of the governments for what is in the best interest of all Nations who have signed onto this philosophy.

While this new pyschology and philiosphy is taking root there will be many that resist, many nations that will strive to keep the status quo. But to say that the United States are "warmongering" denies the fact that no other nation but China has an army equal to the United States. Now if China wants to take over this task I am sure that many Americans would welcome the role reversal since we don't have any GDP maybe all Americans can work for pennies on the dollar or Euro and not have to endure the ignorance of citizens around the world accusing the United States of "warmongering"

Eric
08-19-2008, 01:56 PM
The sort of jingoistic tribalism which you continually spout is, along with your, & other, nation's blind religious fundamentalism, the biggest problem the world faces. I've never voiced a dislike for the USA; what I have voiced is an abhorrence for your country's continual warmongering. Whatever the problem, killing people is not the answer.

As the era of Nationalism around the world is replaced with Globalization the need for "police" powers becomes more and more evident. Whether by collective resolution of the other countries or because the United States "stepped up to the plate" and took on the role is not relavent, the fact is the United States is the arm of Globalization that embodies the "military might" so that all countries conform. It is not by the U.S. standards that dictates this but by all of the governments for what is in the best interest of all Nations who have signed onto this philosophy.

While this new pyschology and philiosphy is taking root there will be many that resist, many nations that will strive to keep the status quo. But to say that the United States are "warmongering" denies the fact that no other nation but China has an army equal to the United States. Now if China wants to take over this task I am sure that many Americans would welcome the role reversal since we don't have any GDP maybe all Americans can work for pennies on the dollar or Euro and not have to endure the ignorance of citizens around the world accusing the United States of "warmongering"


Up is down, black is white... it truly is astonishing.

The US has its arrogant nose in so many pies it is hard to even know where to begin. Two wars of choice in Iraq; a war in Afghanistan; wars against dangerous countries like Grenada; proxy wars in Afghanistan and El Salvador; Chile and Honduras; Panama. Bosnia, Somalia... Hundreds of military bases in almost every corner of the globe. Obstreperous provocations the likes of which we would never allow - such as pushing the Cold War-era military pact NATO to the very borders of Russia.

It just goes on and on and on.

It takes the kind of solipsistic ignorant-arrogant self-righteous sense of exceptionalism that only modern America - and some Americans, unfortunately - have to not see the hilarious/tragic vacuity of remarks such as yours.

Here is something for you to consider - written by the Russian Ambassador to NATO. There is not one fact in his statement that can be disputed:


Washington's Hypocrisy

By Dmitry Rogozin

18/08/08 "IHT" -- The U.S. administration is trying to stick the label of "bad guy" on Russia for exceeding the peacekeeping mandate and using "disproportionate force" in the peace-enforcement operation in Georgia.

Maybe our American friends have gone blind and deaf at the same time. Mikheil Saakashvili, the president of Georgia, is known as a tough nationalist who didn't hide his intentions of forcing Ossetians and Abkhazians to live in his country.

We were hoping that the U.S. administration, which had displayed so much kindness and touching care for the Georgian leader, would be able to save him from the maniacal desire to deal with the small and disobedient peoples of the Caucasus.

But a terrible thing happened. The dog bit its master. Saakashvili gave an order to wipe Tskhinvali, the capital of South Ossetia, from the face of earth.

The Georgian air force and artillery struck the sleeping town at midnight. More than 1,500 civilians perished in the very first hours of the shelling. At the same time, Georgian special forces shot 10 Russian peacekeepers who didn't expect such a betrayal from their Georgian colleagues.

The Kremlin attempted to reach Saakashvili, who was hiding, by phone. All this time the Russian Joint Staff forbid the surviving peacekeepers to open return fire. Finally our patience was exhausted. The Russian forces came to help Tskhinvali and its civilian population.

In reply to the insulting criticism by President Bush that Russia used "disproportionate force," I'd like to cite some legal grounds for our response. Can shooting peacekeepers and the mass extermination of a civilian population - mainly Russian citizens - be regarded as hostile action against a state? Is it ground enough to use armed force in self-defense and to safeguard the security of these citizens?

Tbilisi concealed the scope of the humanitarian catastrophe in South Ossetia. Saakashvili's constant lies about the true state of affairs in Georgia were attempts to lay the fault at somebody else's door.

The Russian response is entirely justified and is consistent with both international law and the humanitarian goals of the peacekeeping operation conducted in South Ossetia. I will try to explain.

The Georgian aggression against South Ossetia, which came as a straightforward, wide-scale attack on the Russian peacekeeping contingent - Russian armed forces legally based on the territory of Georgia - should be classified as an armed attack on the Russian Federation, giving grounds to fulfill the right to self-defense - the right of every state according to Article 51 of the UN Charter.

As for the defense of our citizens outside the country, the use of force to defend one's compatriots is traditionally regarded as a form of self-defense. Countries such as the United States, Britain, France and Israel have at numerous times resorted to the use of armed force to defend their citizens outside national borders.

Such incidents include the armed operation of Belgian paratroopers in 1965 to defend 2,000 foreigners in Zaire; the U.S. military intervention in Grenada in 1983 under the pretext of protecting thousands of American nationals, who found themselves in danger due to a coup d'êtat in this island state; the sending of American troops to Panama in 1989 to defend, among others, American nationals.

We also have to keep in mind the present-day military interventions by the U.S. and its allies in Yugoslavia, Iraq and Afghanistan. By the way, the last three cases are examples of tough American interventions when its own citizens did not need direct protection. But in spite of those countries' massive civilian losses at the hands of American soldiers, no one blamed Washington for a "disproportionate use of force."

Of course, the history of international relations is full of abuses committed under the pretext of defending citizens.

In order to draw a clear line between lawful and unlawful use of force, one can single out a number of objective criteria: first, the existence of a real threat to life or systematic and violations of human rights; second, the absence of other, peaceful means of resolving the conflict; third, a humanitarian aim for an armed operation; and four, proportionality - i.e., limitation on the time and means of rescue.

Russia's actions were in full compliance with these criteria. In conducting its military action, Russian troops also strictly observed the requirements of international humanitarian law. The Russian military did not subject civil objects and civilians on the territory of Georgia to deliberate attacks.

It is hard to believe that in such a situation any other country would have remained idle. Let me quote two statements:

One: "We are against cruelty. We are against ethnic cleansing. A right to come back home should be guaranteed to the refugees. We all agree that murders, property destruction, annihilation of culture and religion are not to be tolerated. That is what we are fighting against. Bombardments of the aggressor will be mercilessly intensified."

Two: "We appeal to all free countries to join us but our actions are not determined by others. I will defend the freedom and security of my citizens, whatever actions are needed for it. Our special forces have seized airports and bridges... air forces and missiles have struck essential targets."

Who do you think is the author of these words? Medvedev? Putin? No. The first quote belongs to Bill Clinton, talking about NATO operation against Yugoslavia. The author of the second quote is the current resident of the White House, talking about the U.S. intervention in Iraq.

Does that mean that the United States and NATO can use brute force where they want to, and Russia has to abstain from it even if it has to look at thousands of its own citizens being shot? If it's not hypocrisy, then what IS hypocrisy?

Dmitry Rogozin is Russia's ambassador to NATO.

ColleenC2
08-19-2008, 02:56 PM
Me thinks you are too quick with the pen due to your level of bombastic response to anything that I write. If you go back and read my posts regarding the whole mess with Russia and Georgia, I have argued that Russia is in the right and that the President of Georgia acted recklessly and has thrown the US into this mess and is hoping that the US will get them out of his mess.

To put it simply, I think Russia was right to come to the aid of the Ossetias when the Georgians were randomly killing them. Over 2, 000 Ossetias died as a result of the order of the President of Georgia.

Now to your other "flowering" and complimentary comments: You argue that we are not moving from Nationalism to Globalism. You do not see that "possibly" this is orchestrated that the U.S. becomes the police force for this one World order? Many things go on behind the scenes that we have no privy to and will never have. But make no mistake about it, in the very near future, one my Grandchildren will live in, there will be no "national anthem", no flag for our country or any others, to use past logic and behavior to explain future events is futile in this new coming one world order. Same Government, same currency, etc., etc.,

gail
08-19-2008, 06:26 PM
"Everyone feels guilty about something, and wishes that they could have another chance to make better choices."

Could be, but if you have learned from your mistakes than feeling guilty is a waste of time to even be thinking about it.

-Don-


How can one learn from their mistakes unless they think about it? Do you suppose if someone got their arm or leg cut off, even though they very well may get on with life, that they would ever forget it? How about a lapse of judgment and a child dies because of its consequences - do you suppose that that parent would ever stop thinking "What if - - - -? Many women who have had an abortion never recover from the mental trauma and then live with a ghost. Even though you are adament about your life style how many people in a similar situation, do you suppose, think about "What if I'd never taken that first step?" I certainly do, and if you don't, I'd say you have pretty much shut down your feelings, and that can be dangerous.

gail
08-19-2008, 07:02 PM
Dave Brand wrote: <<Tell me, Gail, how many countries outside the USA have you visited? How many languages do you speak?>>

Well, Dave, to be upfront and truthful with you - very few, and I struggle with the English language, as Eric will be quick to point out. Any energy that I will put out in the area is lobby for English to be our national language and rename it American. I have no desire to put my foot on any soil other than American. There is so much to do and see in the USA, and I've spent a lifetime trying to see it all. My selected mode of travel is by automobile. I get sea-sick on ships and I am the proverbial white-knucke flyer.

My ancestor came over on the Mayflower in 1620, and I have an ancestor that signed the Declaration of Independence. My ancestors have fought in every war in this country. I have two sons currently serving in the military. Both have been to Iraq, and one is in Qatar presently. My son told me an interesting happenstance just before he shipped out to Iraq. He was at a wedding in Turkey - his wife is a Turkey National, but her friend was German. Both had gone to school together in Germany. The grandmother of the bride was German. The grandmother kept smiling at my son and nodding, finally she got up and sat next to my son. she spoke to him in German and patted his knee, still smiling. My son does not speak German and did not know what she was saying. The bride, her granddaughter told my son she said, "When I was a little girl the American Army came to my country. I am alive today because of you." My son wrote, someday an old Iraqi woman will tell my grandson a similar story, because of us many children will live. Warmonger, I think not!

However with that said, I am a US Navy Brat, born and bred. My father put 28 years in the Navy. During my growning up years I attended 20 school, and graduated from a Correspondence school. The times that I left my homeland was Military related. I found France distasteful, but Italy was kind of nice. Of course most Americans have visited the border countries, Mexico and Canada, myself included. But vsiting other countries is sort of like visiting a friend, you may like their decor, and your friend and even have a wonderful time, but as Dorothy said in the Wizard of Oz, "There's no place like home." The United States of America is my home, and she's a a Grand old Lady. I'm proud of her, and I do what I can to honor my country.

The world prospers because of the USA, and if the countries who gladly take our money, would repay their loans we wouldn't have a deficient. Then, they turn on us and bad-mouthed us, as if they deserve to take our generousity. How rude, how ungrateful, how pathetic. Yet, we keep on helping, and the Michael Moores of the Nation and around the world call us warmongers. Psash! ::)

Jim Rose
08-20-2008, 12:35 AM
>>The world prospers because of the USA, and if the countries who gladly take our money, would repay their loans we wouldn't have a deficient. Then, they turn on us and bad-mouthed us, as if they deserve to take our generousity. How rude, how ungrateful, how pathetic. Yet, we keep on helping, and the Michael Moores of the Nation and around the world call us warmongers. Psash! <<

And we have military now in 45 countries around the world while we are going broke here at home--- what BS--- I can understand fighting when it is a defined threat to us. I can't understand invading countries for the reasons we are in Iraq---

Eric
08-20-2008, 07:49 AM
"The world prospers because of the USA, and if the countries who gladly take our money, would repay their loans we wouldn't have a deficient. Then, they turn on us and bad-mouthed us, as if they deserve to take our generousity. How rude, how ungrateful, how pathetic. Yet, we keep on helping, and the Michael Moores of the Nation and around the world call us warmongers. Psash! ::)"


Are you really that naive? You really believe our global military presence is about "helping" anyone other than the elites who use the US military as the private security forces of corporate America?

No country in the world has been involved in more "wars of choice" than America; no country has more bases or military personnel in foreign lands; no country is more belligerent in its interference with the internal affairs of sovereign states; no country threatens to use - and uses - military force more.

You have to go back to the old Soviet Union - or Nazi Germany/Imperial Japan - to find a more militaristic/aggressive imperial state than the current United States.We have our fingers in everyone's pie. We bray unctuously about "freedom" and "democracy" - but only when it suits our purposes. We are grotesque hypocrites; bald-faced liars - obvious frauds.

And we are hated for it.

But to people who think as you do, countries like Iran (which hasn't invaded another country in hundreds of years and has no bases/military presence in a single other country) and Russia - which responded to an attack on civilian nationals - are the "warmongers."

It would be funny if such thinking were (as it once was) the thinking of a few isolated cranks and ignoramuses. But it's sad - and frightening - because such thinking now characterizes the leadership of the US as well as a great portion of the addled buffoons who support it.

Dave Brand
08-20-2008, 08:12 AM
Well, Dave, to be upfront and truthful with you - very few, and I struggle with the English language, as Eric will be quick to point out. Any energy that I will put out in the area is lobby for English to be our national language and rename it American. I have no desire to put my foot on any soil other than American. There is so much to do and see in the USA, and I've spent a lifetime trying to see it all. My selected mode of travel is by automobile. I get sea-sick on ships and I am the proverbial white-knucke flyer.


Just as I thought - your 'my country's better than your country' stance is based on a blinkered, parochial view of the world. Rudyard Kipling summed up that kind of attitude:

'And what should they know of England who only England know?'

You say you have no desire to put your foot on any soil other than American yet you are happy for your fellow Americans to trample rough-shod over other countries in your self-appointed role as 'the world's policeman'? Double standards, possibly?

1620? Makes you an immigrant by my standards...'your' country?

Eric
08-20-2008, 09:00 AM
Well, Dave, to be upfront and truthful with you - very few, and I struggle with the English language, as Eric will be quick to point out. Any energy that I will put out in the area is lobby for English to be our national language and rename it American. I have no desire to put my foot on any soil other than American. There is so much to do and see in the USA, and I've spent a lifetime trying to see it all. My selected mode of travel is by automobile. I get sea-sick on ships and I am the proverbial white-knucke flyer.


Just as I thought - your 'my country's better than your country' stance is based on a blinkered, parochial view of the world. Rudyard Kipling summed up that kind of attitude:

'And what should they know of England who only England know?'

You say you have no desire to put your foot on any soil other than American yet you are happy for your fellow Americans to trample rough-shod over other countries in your self-appointed role as 'the world's policeman'? Double standards, possibly?

1620? Makes you an immigrant by my standards...'your' country?


Dave -

Rest assured not all Americans have the "yankee mentality" typified by Gail's remarks and attitude.

Many of us are appalled and disgusted by the actions of the U.S. government - and yearn for a return to the rule of law (and live - and let live). We want no part of a global empire; we understand that our policies are making enemies around the world and bankrupting us at home while gradually turning our government into an authoritarian monolith that brooks no challenge to its authority.

I sometimes think an economic collapse might be our only salvation; that it might lead to the dissolution of this corrupted continental "superpower" - and pave the way for the rise of smaller, autonomous states and thereby diffuse the now-concentrated power that resides in Washington.

gail
08-20-2008, 05:31 PM
Dave Brand wrote: <<1620? Makes you an immigrant by my standards...'your' country?>>

I see that you've bought into the liberal crap that has permeated this country for the past 40 years. Did it seep in, or is it seeping out?

There is the strong and the weak, and it is obvious that Americans have proven to be strong. Although, it does seem that the number of those who desire to weaken our great nation is growing. Both here and across the pond. I would like to see all of our troops brought home and every bases around the world shut down. I would like to see the USA pull in the chips of every loan from every country that we have helped or loan money to, but that isn't going to happen. We are a benvolent country.

It truly amazes me that people want to blame America/Americans/Bush for everything that has and is going wrong in the world today. When we came over to this continent there were other countries vieing for the land, England, France, Spain, Russia, and rumors of others. When slavery was common practice the world over, only the USA, particulary the South get any flack over it. You can gage the worth of a country by how many people are trying to get in or get out. We have an immigration problem in this country. Does that tell you something?

I personally am an isolationist, but I understand that as the world shrinks we must keep a global presence, which in turn has created disloyality and disrespect among the citizenry. There was a popular song during WWI, "How are you going to keep them down on the farm after they've seen Pairee." I think that our country has been going downhill every since. What a shame. What is an even greater shame is to listen to compatriots trash her to each other, which escalates the discontent into thinking that everyone else must be better than us. Or paranoia sets in and we think no one likes us. Boo Hoo! And the trashing becomes unforgivable when they trash this great country to outsiders. My Forefathers are rolling over in their graves.

gail
08-20-2008, 05:48 PM
>>The world prospers because of the USA, and if the countries who gladly take our money, would repay their loans we wouldn't have a deficient. Then, they turn on us and bad-mouthed us, as if they deserve to take our generousity. How rude, how ungrateful, how pathetic. Yet, we keep on helping, and the Michael Moores of the Nation and around the world call us warmongers. Psash! <<

And we have military now in 45 countries around the world while we are going broke here at home--- what BS--- I can understand fighting when it is a defined threat to us. I can't understand invading countries for the reasons we are in Iraq---


I consider you right on the first statement, wrong on the second and I'm in total aggreement on the third. I am an Isolationist, and I would like to see us pull out of every country in the world, close down our bases, and then pull in the chips of what they owe us from loans, and such.

As to going broke at home - - - Jim, Jim, Jim - get away from your computer and turn of the TV news. Take a trip to your local mall, or Wal*Mart or take a drive - you will see droves of people loaded down with packages and bags of trival nothing to take home with them. In spite of the high gas prices, you can't hardly drive for the traffic jams. We are a rich nation. Rich, rich, rich.

I am a Depression baby. My father made $59 a month, and their rent was $11. All but the elite was thin and most of us ate hamhock and beans. When my father's ship would go out to sea, my mother would take me back to our ancestral farm in North Carolina. We did NOT have electricity, nor running water. They cooked on a wood stove, and used kerosene lanterns. In two houses there were four families. We had chickens, hogs, and cows. We didn't eat the cows though, they were for milking. I was near grown before I knew what beef was. We grew our own vegetables. We farmed cotton, watermelon and gobers. I can remember our first telephone, refrigerator, indoor plumbing, etc. I watch people today wearing desiger jeans, have manicures and pedicures routinely, everyone has a TV, cell phone, etc. Need I go on about how prosperous our nation is? I even see new Nike on beggars. There is NOTHING wrong with our economy, it is the people with an insatiable desire for more.

Whine, whine, whine

gail
08-20-2008, 05:58 PM
Well, Dave, to be upfront and truthful with you - very few, and I struggle with the English language, as Eric will be quick to point out. Any energy that I will put out in the area is lobby for English to be our national language and rename it American. I have no desire to put my foot on any soil other than American. There is so much to do and see in the USA, and I've spent a lifetime trying to see it all. My selected mode of travel is by automobile. I get sea-sick on ships and I am the proverbial white-knucke flyer.


Just as I thought - your 'my country's better than your country' stance is based on a blinkered, parochial view of the world. Rudyard Kipling summed up that kind of attitude:

'And what should they know of England who only England know?'

You say you have no desire to put your foot on any soil other than American yet you are happy for your fellow Americans to trample rough-shod over other countries in your self-appointed role as 'the world's policeman'? Double standards, possibly?

1620? Makes you an immigrant by my standards...'your' country?


Dave -

Rest assured not all Americans have the "yankee mentality" typified by Gail's remarks and attitude.

Many of us are appalled and disgusted by the actions of the U.S. government - and yearn for a return to the rule of law (and live - and let live). We want no part of a global empire; we understand that our policies are making enemies around the world and bankrupting us at home while gradually turning our government into an authoritarian monolith that brooks no challenge to its authority.

I sometimes think an economic collapse might be our only salvation; that it might lead to the dissolution of this corrupted continental "superpower" - and pave the way for the rise of smaller, autonomous states and thereby diffuse the now-concentrated power that resides in Washington.




Don't you dare apologize for me. And don't call me a Yankee either - I am Southerner through and through.

I have stated many times that I am an Isolationist, I would prefer that we bring our troops home from all over the world, close down the bases and pull in the chips of loans we have given to many countries and never been repaid. But I am not appalled, nor would I apologize to anyone over our countries behavior or choices. This started long before Pres. Bush come into office.

With that said and done, I too have wondered if an <<economic collapse might be our only salvation>> I have never said that I thought our country was perfect, but how dare you air our dirty laundry in public - to foreigners yet! Show some loyality and dignity, Eric.

Jim Rose
08-20-2008, 06:39 PM
>>As to going broke at home - - - Jim, Jim, Jim - get away from your computer and turn of the TV news. Take a trip to your local mall, or Wal*Mart or take a drive - you will see droves of people loaded down with packages and bags of trival nothing to take home with them. In spite of the high gas prices, you can't hardly drive for the traffic jams. We are a rich nation. Rich, rich, rich.<<

You're the one who has their head burried in the sand-- Do you own a business? Have you ever owned a business?? Do you ever read the business section of a newspaper or watch the business news on TV???
Resturants and retail stores are filing for bankruptcy --- BIG Chains that have been prosperous--- You better wake up before you go shopping and find the store closed and your neighborhood bank that has your millions in receivership----
And that doesn't even cover the automotive disaster that Chrysler, GM & Ford are weathering----- closing plants and laying off workers---

gail
08-20-2008, 08:41 PM
>>As to going broke at home - - - Jim, Jim, Jim - get away from your computer and turn of the TV news. Take a trip to your local mall, or Wal*Mart or take a drive - you will see droves of people loaded down with packages and bags of trival nothing to take home with them. In spite of the high gas prices, you can't hardly drive for the traffic jams. We are a rich nation. Rich, rich, rich.<<

You're the one who has their head burried in the sand-- Do you own a business? Have you ever owned a business?? Do you ever read the business section of a newspaper or watch the business news on TV???
Resturants and retail stores are filing for bankruptcy --- BIG Chains that have been prosperous--- You better wake up before you go shopping and find the store closed and your neighborhood bank that has your millions in receivership----
And that doesn't even cover the automotive disaster that Chrysler, GM & Ford are weathering----- closing plants and laying off workers---



There is a bell curve to everything. We are born, we grow old we die. The top of the bell we are wild and prosperous youth. Some die young, others live to ripe old age. Businesses also have the bell curve. TV show, towns, fashions, etc. Henny Penny it is just an acorn that hit you on the head. Honest, the sky isn't falling. Oh yes, even civilizations. I'm hoping that ours will last as long as the Roman Empire, but I won't take any bets on it.

One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:4)

Jim Rose
08-21-2008, 12:49 AM
>>There is a bell curve to everything. We are born, we grow old we die. The top of the bell we are wild and prosperous youth. Some die young, others live to ripe old age. Businesses also have the bell curve. TV show, towns, fashions, etc. Henny Penny it is just an acorn that hit you on the head. Honest, the sky isn't falling. Oh yes, even civilizations. I'm hoping that ours will last as long as the Roman Empire, but I won't take any bets on it.

One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:4)<<

It's absolutely amazing how you always try to squirm out of the subject with bibical BS

gail
08-21-2008, 01:10 AM
>>There is a bell curve to everything. We are born, we grow old we die. The top of the bell we are wild and prosperous youth. Some die young, others live to ripe old age. Businesses also have the bell curve. TV show, towns, fashions, etc. Henny Penny it is just an acorn that hit you on the head. Honest, the sky isn't falling. Oh yes, even civilizations. I'm hoping that ours will last as long as the Roman Empire, but I won't take any bets on it.

One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:4)<<

It's absolutely amazing how you always try to squirm out of the subject with bibical BS


Not squirm - document.

9 The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:9)

DonTom
08-21-2008, 07:15 AM
"How can one learn from their mistakes unless they think about it? "

Waste time by thinking about it all you want, but why bother to feel guilty if you've learned your lesson?

Only if you're going to make the same mistake again do you need to feel guilty.

"Every guilty person is his own hangman."
--Seneca


-Don Quoteman

DonTom
08-21-2008, 07:32 AM
"Even though you are adament about your life style how many people in a similar situation, do you suppose, think about "What if I'd never taken that first step?" "

If you're referring to being gay (which is no more of a lifestyle than being left handed), the first step is "coming out" and being honest about it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coming_out (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coming_out)

-Don-

Jim Rose
08-21-2008, 08:48 AM
>>There is a bell curve to everything. We are born, we grow old we die. The top of the bell we are wild and prosperous youth. Some die young, others live to ripe old age. Businesses also have the bell curve. TV show, towns, fashions, etc. Henny Penny it is just an acorn that hit you on the head. Honest, the sky isn't falling. Oh yes, even civilizations. I'm hoping that ours will last as long as the Roman Empire, but I won't take any bets on it.

One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:4)<<

It's absolutely amazing how you always try to squirm out of the subject with bibical BS


Not squirm - document.

9 The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:9)


Squirm is the proper definition--- anytime you feel like you are on the losing side of a discussion, you whitewash it with religious, out of context, hogwash. That cures all for you and makes you feel like a winner--- more like a WHINER ----

Eric
08-21-2008, 09:19 AM
>>There is a bell curve to everything. We are born, we grow old we die. The top of the bell we are wild and prosperous youth. Some die young, others live to ripe old age. Businesses also have the bell curve. TV show, towns, fashions, etc. Henny Penny it is just an acorn that hit you on the head. Honest, the sky isn't falling. Oh yes, even civilizations. I'm hoping that ours will last as long as the Roman Empire, but I won't take any bets on it.

One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:4)<<

It's absolutely amazing how you always try to squirm out of the subject with bibical BS


Not squirm - document.

9 The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:9)


Religious gobbledegook does not "document" anything more substantive than your own hackneyed religious viewpoint.

Dave Brand
08-21-2008, 02:41 PM
Dave Brand wrote: <<1620? Makes you an immigrant by my standards...'your' country?>>

I see that you've bought into the liberal crap that has permeated this country for the past 40 years. Did it seep in, or is it seeping out?


Thank you, Gail, for giving credence to the commonly-held view on this side of the Atlantic that irony is a concept beyond the ken of the average American!

gail
08-21-2008, 09:40 PM
>>There is a bell curve to everything. We are born, we grow old we die. The top of the bell we are wild and prosperous youth. Some die young, others live to ripe old age. Businesses also have the bell curve. TV show, towns, fashions, etc. Henny Penny it is just an acorn that hit you on the head. Honest, the sky isn't falling. Oh yes, even civilizations. I'm hoping that ours will last as long as the Roman Empire, but I won't take any bets on it.

One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:4)<<

It's absolutely amazing how you always try to squirm out of the subject with bibical BS


Not squirm - document.

9 The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:9)


Squirm is the proper definition--- anytime you feel like you are on the losing side of a discussion, you whitewash it with religious, out of context, hogwash. That cures all for you and makes you feel like a winner--- more like a WHINER ----


Not me, Jim. I'm on the proverbial merry-go-round and I don't like I'm last, I look behind me and I know that I'm leading. To deciper my alagory for those who aren't into this type of mental logic - I see hundreds of readers of my posts, but only a few posters. I think all those readers agree with what I am posting, and feel that I am so eloquent that they do not need to add anything.

gail
08-21-2008, 09:42 PM
>>There is a bell curve to everything. We are born, we grow old we die. The top of the bell we are wild and prosperous youth. Some die young, others live to ripe old age. Businesses also have the bell curve. TV show, towns, fashions, etc. Henny Penny it is just an acorn that hit you on the head. Honest, the sky isn't falling. Oh yes, even civilizations. I'm hoping that ours will last as long as the Roman Empire, but I won't take any bets on it.

One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:4)<<

It's absolutely amazing how you always try to squirm out of the subject with bibical BS


Not squirm - document.

9 The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 1:9)


Religious gobbledegook does not "document" anything more substantive than your own hackneyed religious viewpoint.

And you believe the left-wing dribble that you post does? All that I see with the videos that you post links just degrade all that is precious in life. Soon a person becomes so embittered that nothing has any value.

Jim Rose
08-22-2008, 01:06 AM
>>Not me, Jim. I'm on the proverbial merry-go-round and I don't like I'm last, I look behind me and I know that I'm leading. To deciper my alagory for those who aren't into this type of mental logic - I see hundreds of readers of my posts, but only a few posters. I think all those readers agree with what I am posting, and feel that I am so eloquent that they do not need to add anything.<<

If they agreed, they would post-- they read it and know you are a hopeless case--- called I.D. 10 T.

Eric
08-22-2008, 07:03 AM
"you believe the left-wing dribble that you post does?"

What "left wing dribble (sic)" would that be?

You have no facts, nothing objective - just beeeeeeliefs fed to you by the likes of loads like Rush Limbaugh and your own unsupported (and unsupportable) vague generalizations about "patriotism" and "loyalty."

gail
08-22-2008, 03:11 PM
>>Not me, Jim. I'm on the proverbial merry-go-round and I don't like I'm last, I look behind me and I know that I'm leading. To deciper my alagory for those who aren't into this type of mental logic - I see hundreds of readers of my posts, but only a few posters. I think all those readers agree with what I am posting, and feel that I am so eloquent that they do not need to add anything.<<

If they agreed, they would post-- they read it and know you are a hopeless case--- called I.D. 10 T.


There you go again! Secret Combinations are of the devil. ;D

gail
08-22-2008, 03:12 PM
"you believe the left-wing dribble that you post does?"

What "left wing dribble (sic)" would that be?

You have no facts, nothing objective - just beeeeeeliefs fed to you by the likes of loads like Rush Limbaugh and your own unsupported (and unsupportable) vague generalizations about "patriotism" and "loyalty."


What you say is what you are. :P

Jim Rose
08-22-2008, 05:00 PM
>>Not me, Jim. I'm on the proverbial merry-go-round and I don't like I'm last, I look behind me and I know that I'm leading. To deciper my alagory for those who aren't into this type of mental logic - I see hundreds of readers of my posts, but only a few posters. I think all those readers agree with what I am posting, and feel that I am so eloquent that they do not need to add anything.<<

If they agreed, they would post-- they read it and know you are a hopeless case--- called I.D. 10 T.


There you go again! Secret Combinations are of the devil. ;D


Slide all those letters together and take out the decimal points--- there's your problem! I am the Devil! ;D

Eric
08-22-2008, 05:03 PM
>>Not me, Jim. I'm on the proverbial merry-go-round and I don't like I'm last, I look behind me and I know that I'm leading. To deciper my alagory for those who aren't into this type of mental logic - I see hundreds of readers of my posts, but only a few posters. I think all those readers agree with what I am posting, and feel that I am so eloquent that they do not need to add anything.<<

If they agreed, they would post-- they read it and know you are a hopeless case--- called I.D. 10 T.


There you go again! Secret Combinations are of the devil. ;D


Slide all those letters together and take out the decimal points--- there's your problem! I am the Devil! ;D



"Look Ye to the Loin of The Lamb" -

Eukanuba 2:24

gail
08-22-2008, 05:16 PM
>>Not me, Jim. I'm on the proverbial merry-go-round and I don't like I'm last, I look behind me and I know that I'm leading. To deciper my alagory for those who aren't into this type of mental logic - I see hundreds of readers of my posts, but only a few posters. I think all those readers agree with what I am posting, and feel that I am so eloquent that they do not need to add anything.<<

If they agreed, they would post-- they read it and know you are a hopeless case--- called I.D. 10 T.


There you go again! Secret Combinations are of the devil. ;D


Slide all those letters together and take out the decimal points--- there's your problem! I am the Devil! ;D


Got me! You are a sly one. LOL ;D

ColleenC2
08-22-2008, 05:16 PM
"Look Ye to the Loin of The Lamb" -

Eukanuba 2:24

Where and what is the Book of Eukanuba?

gail
08-22-2008, 05:18 PM
"Look Ye to the Loin of The Lamb" -

Eukanuba 2:24

Where and what is the Book of Eukanuba?


Baaaaa - Eric is jerking our chain. :-*

Ken
08-22-2008, 05:32 PM
"Look Ye to the Loin of The Lamb"


Preferably around 2p.m. on a Sunday. Served with mint sauce and surrounded by roast potatoes, roasted carrots, parsnips and red onions, brocolli and cauliflower the wholedrizzled with a rich gravy. To be followed by treacle sponge and proper hand made vanilla custard. ;)

Ken.

Jim Rose
08-22-2008, 09:07 PM
>>Got me! You are a sly one. LOL <<

Trained by the best-- the Devil's Advocate

ColleenC2
08-24-2008, 08:01 PM
Eukanuba 2:24

I thought he had written his own bible or pearls of great wisdom

Eric
08-24-2008, 08:31 PM
Eukanuba 2:24

I thought he had written his own bible or pearls of great wisdom


I just may - and the end result would be just as "holy," too!

gail
08-24-2008, 08:37 PM
Eukanuba 2:24

I thought he had written his own bible or pearls of great wisdom


I just may - and the end result would be just as "holy," too!


I have faith in you, Eric -- go for it! (where's my angel smiley?) 8)

Eric
08-24-2008, 08:39 PM
Eukanuba 2:24

I thought he had written his own bible or pearls of great wisdom


I just may - and the end result would be just as "holy," too!


I have faith in you, Eric -- go for it! (where's my angel smiley?) 8)


"Believe Ye only that which can be known; all else is mere opinion"

Colonoscopocus 13:3

ColleenC2
08-24-2008, 08:45 PM
Colonoscopocus 13:3

I can't stop laughing, OMG

Eric
08-24-2008, 08:49 PM
Colonoscopocus 13:3

I can't stop laughing, OMG

gail
08-29-2008, 11:25 PM
Do you draw moustaches too or just post silly monkey pictures? Aba da da do!