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Thread: I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticket..

  1. #1

    I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticket..

    Before anybody tries to lambast me hear me out.

    The car I drove at the time was vandalized and I was shopping for another car. I responded to an ad for the sale of a vehicle and showed up to the owners house. I spent 15 minutes crawling over it, under it and inside it checking out the running condition. I ask if it is alright to drive it around a couple blocks and he says yes, no problem and all the papers are in the glovebox. I look at the liscence plate and it appears current. I open the glovebox and I see the registration and insurance papers in it, so I figure I am good to go.

    I drive it 3 blocks, turn around and 2 blocks away from the sellers house, I get pulled over by a police vehicle. So I got pulled over and the treatment was harsh (to put it mildly - I'd rather not get into the details). They inform me the plate doesn't belong to the vehicle and the registration and insurance are both expired. I give them my side of the story, providing the sellers name, address and phone number. They take my liscence and tell me to wait. They call the guy up and order him to show up to my location or they will send another officer to get him.

    The guy arrives and the cops have to separate us because I am yelling at the guy why he lied about the registration, plate and insurance (GRR!). He gives me a sheepish look and the cops spend the better part of 2 hours quizzing him and filling out paperwork. All this time I am doing everything not to lose my cool. The cops spend another 5 minutes talking to the seller of the car (meanwhile handing over a stack of fines). The guy then breaks down and cries on the side of the road. Now it's my turn to talk to the police.

    The officer apologizes for my harsh treatment right off the bat. He admits he didn't buy my story at first but everything checks out and he now knows I was telling the truth. He also complemented me on my composure. He gave me a failure to produce insurance ticket for $172. I inform him that I don't think it was fair to give me that fine. If the owner of a vehicle states the car is fine to take around the block how could I have know that he was lying???? The plate appeared current. The registration and insurance papers in the glovebox were present. I even possessed valid registration and insurance for my own vehicle on my person (which the officer was not interested in viewing). He retorts that the driver of the vehicle is responsible for determining if it is registered or insured if he or she is pulled over.

    I inform him that by this reasoning, every time I want to test drive a car at a dealership then I should demand to see all the registration and insurance paperwork - and not just accept the Dealership plate they throw on the back. If you ask a dealership this they will toss you off their lot in 10 seconds flat, 1 out of 2 times (I used to work at a car dealership....I know).

    He tells me that it is different in that circumstance, that dealerships are required by law to have insurance in order to conduct business. Well what about a shady two bit car lot as opposed to a "reputable looking" car dealer?? Should I do the same with them? Not all of those guys can afford that insurance (at this time I inform the officer that I have worked at car dealerships in the past). The officer contemplates my statement for a few seconds. He then tells me that basically I should have physically checked the paperwork to verify that the registration and insurance were current and for the vehicle. Then I wouldn't have been screwed over by the other guy.

    I tell the officer I have one last concern. What if the paperwork in the car appeared current, but were expired??? If I look at an insurance slip that expires sometime next year and it's actually been cancelled before that period how would I know???? Certainly not by looking at it. The officer tells me you ask the owner. To which I respond HOW DO I KNOW IF THE OWNER IS LYING??? CASE IN POINT.

    He ponders my statement for 30 or so seconds. He then tells me that he sympathizes with my situation but I should consider myself lucky because the other guy got $4200 in fines and his vehicle is being confiscated. There's nothing more he can do at this point. He also told me I am welcome to fight my ticket if I like.

    I went to speak with the Crown Prosecutor a few weeks later and he tossed the charge immediately. He asked me what happened and he stopped me in the middle of my explanation and said "This is garbage."

    At first I thought by that statement he thought I was lying. Then he kept asking me "What were these guys trying to prove?" I filed a complaint and the officers wound up with a reprimand because of how I was treated the day I was pulled over (big deal).

    Moral of the story: When you're test driving a car - COVER YOUR ASS!

  2. #2
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticke

    Good story!

    I agree the cop was a complete jerk to cite you after he knew what the situation was. In my opinion, you more than exercised "due diligence" - most people look for a plate on the back and that's it. You literally did everything you could have short of demanding to speak with the seller's insurance rep. on the phone to confirm he had current insurance - which would have been ridiculous.

    It's cops such as the one you dealt with that create great - and frankly, deserved - contempt for police among otherwise law-abiding, "normal" people who don't appreciate being hassled by some thug with a gun and a badge. And that is all that separates your cop from a street thug. If anything, the street thughas more balls - and honor - because he doesn't hide behind the lawwwwwww - and a badge.

    Cops like that one should be fired immediately and never allowed to "serve" in any law enforcement capacity again.

  3. #3
    Senior Member J. ZIMM's Avatar
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    Re: I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticket..

    Jeesh, some cops just can't take a joke... I'm sorry, they are the joke. They got their just deserts. Now in the State of Oregon, you have to carry proof of insurance in your vehicle at all times. Failer to do so will result with an automatic impounment. It's taken right then. I could see where this can go the wrong way in a hurry. And I can see this getting real ugly very quick. I know that if you purchased a vehicle, that most insurance companies will give you a thirty day rider until they can get the proper paper work to you. But each vehicle has to have it's own insurance card. If I were to operate a vehicle from a private party, I would hope that the papers are current. I only own three vehicles, so paper work is not a big thing. I have gotten into the habit of making a photostatic copy of each proof of insurance card. Most cases they will fit on one sheet of paper. This one I carry in my wallet. On that paper, I also have the plate number, and a breif descrition of the vehicle and any other thing that might make it easier to spot or find. And you also have the VIN. This I beleive will help you in case you are pulled over, showing that you do carry insurance, and you are just test driving the vehicle. Now in this guys situation, with bogus plates and all, things could get a little touchy. And this state is no differnt. Bogus plates will result in an inpounment, and possible jail time, while all this is being hammered out. So I can see where this is going. It's to the point that you cannot trust anyone any more. Bottem line, have them take you for a test drive, or make sure they go with you. Then they will tell the cop they are a hostage to keep their butts out of trouble for the time being. What a weird world we live in. I think i'll check the paper to see if my names in it. If not, then I'll get dressed. ;D

  4. #4
    Senior Member misterdecibel's Avatar
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    Re: I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticket..

    So did you buy the car?


  5. #5
    Senior Member misterdecibel's Avatar
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    Re: I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticket..

    And was the police officer present when you testified?

  6. #6
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticke

    Quote Originally Posted by misterdecibel
    And was the police officer present when you testified?
    Va is more relaxed in this area - an unusual thing. In all the years I have been driving (and pulled over) I have yet to be asked to produce proof of insurance. I do have it, of course - but it would be pretty easy to get away with not having it.

  7. #7
    Senior Member misterdecibel's Avatar
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    Re: I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticket..

    Here they can look it up on the computer.

  8. #8
    Administrator Ken's Avatar
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    Re: I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticket..

    Quote Originally Posted by misterdecibel
    Here they can look it up on the computer.
    The same over here. A quick radio check and, within a few seconds, they know: Whether the number plate relates to the vehicle it is fitted to, whether the car is insured, whether the car is taxed and whether the car has a valid MOT Certificate. They also have the name of the registered keeper and his full address. And they will still give you a producer! - probably because they don't have much faith in their computer system.

    Ken.
    Die dulci fruimini!
    Ken.
    Wolds Bikers, Lincolnshire, England.

  9. #9
    Senior Member J. ZIMM's Avatar
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    Re: I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticket..

    Rereading some of these old post, I guess that over here we are very fortunate we don't have MoT's inspections. Only thing here are DEQ inspections to see if our exhaust is working. At one time, the city of Portland Oregon did have a vehicle inspection station. I guess this was before the WWII. They may have had it a short time afterward as well. They did check for brakes, steering, horns, and of course, lights. Now they don't care if you can't stop, steer, if the lights work, and in some cases, I can pass gas louder than some horns toot. We have some of the most lackluster laws around where it comes to automobile safety inspections. Of course, if you said that next license time it will cost you $150.00 to have you car inspected before you get tags, this state would, for sure, explode. As it is , with DEQ inspection, and tags, depending on the plate, could cost as much as $200.00. So another $150.00 shouldn't bother anyone.....did I mention that tags are good for two years here?

  10. #10
    Stevew
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    Re: I recall a time when I received a Failure to Produce an Insurance Slip Ticket..

    Reason One:

    At the risk of distilling your sad (but ultimately happily ended) story down to a one liner, your solution boiled down to the line I've copied below.

    ""I went to speak with the Crown Prosecutor a few weeks later and he tossed the charge immediately. He asked me what happened and he stopped me in the middle of my explanation and said "This is garbage.""

    Most of us are not too fond of police officers, but, that being said, does anyone out there want their job? While I have, as you did, try to politely dialog my way out of an unpleasant encounter with the Gestapo, I've also come to realize, usually very early in the process, whether I've got the proverbial "snowball's chance". Although more and more jurisdictions are requiring college degrees for their officers (not necessarily a guarantee of fair treatment) there are still a lot of "Barney Fifes" on the road, and unlike the original Barney, they usually have more than one bullet to carry around, and for all you know just got seriously abused during their last traffic stop..

    "Yes Sir, No Sir" and tell it to the judge.. He (or she) will have most likely passed a Bar Exam somewhere .

    Thanks for telling us your adventure. Just think of all the opportunities to relate the experience at parties and gatherings ;D.

    Cheers, Steve


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