Results 1 to 7 of 7

Thread: Automated Cars and Dumbed Down Drivers

  1. #1
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    The Land of The Edentulites
    Posts
    22,666

    Automated Cars and Dumbed Down Drivers

    One of the arguments used by automated car pushers (I use the term deliberately, to convey the fact that the market isn’t asking for automated cars any more than it is electric cars; both are being forced upon the market by parties who are frustrated by the market’s reluctance to “embrace” either thing) is that they are saaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaafer than cars controlled by us.
    In a sense, this is true.
    If you begin with the premise that “us” consists of the typically dumbed-down 18-year-old driver. Whose driving has been dumbed on purpose to create the pretext for automated cars.
    This process has been under way for a long time but desultorily - until fairly recently. Something changed for the much worse in the early years of this new century.
    It used to be both common - and legal - for 15-something-year-olds to drive. One got one’s learner’s permit that year and in many cases, had already learned how to drive years prior. Parents - fathers - usually being the instructor. Dad would take son - or daughter - out to the shopping mall parking lot, or maybe a mostly empty back road - and begin the schooling.
    That was before kids were strapped into Hannibal Lector saaaaaaaaaafety seats in the back seat, of course. They rode up front, often in Dad's lap - holding the wheel while he explained.
    That would get Dad arrested today, of course.
    But back then, most American boys, at least, had some behind the wheel experience before the government-prescribed minimum age. Just as most also had some familiarity (and this they still do) with beer before the government gave its royal okay.
    Regardless, by fifteen and change, American kids - boys and girls - could begin to learn to drive, legally, in most states - as recently as the late ‘80s and probably well into the ’90s.
    And at sixteen - that very day - they were legally licensed to drive. Full privileges, the same as anyone else. And with it, independence. Freedom. They could come and go as they pleased, almost anywhere, almost anytime. This made the getting of the license attractive to a teenager; gave the teenager incentive to learn how to drive.
    Most wanted to - badly. And so, made it happen, whatever it took.
    And made the grade.
    Basic competence was expected - and achieved - at an early age, years before nominal/legal age for drinking, being drafted or being able to sign a valid legal contract; years before the boy or girl typically left their parents’ home for college or work. So that by that time, the young man or woman already had years of driving experience - which generally has the effect of making one a better driver by the time one embarks upon the adult world.
    A better driver - who likes to drive.
    Today, it is very depressingly different.
    Most states now impose a regime that seems deliberately contrived to perpetuate childhood by delaying the age at which a kid may legally begin to even undertake driving lessons; the “learner’s” stage is also effectively extended for years - the boy or girl not being full privileged (loathsome term) until they are 18. And thus are turned loose on the adult world with fractured/limited experience and marinated in Fear Talk about the Dangers of driving. Many states don’t permit those under 18 to drive at all with other teens in the car - or at night. It defeats the point of driving.
    It becomes a chore - and a bore.
    And so no great surprise that something like a third of all 16-24-year-olds not only don’t drive but have no interest in driving.
    Many do not drive well, either.
    This cohort of marginally skilled, not-much-experienced drivers without much affection for driving is the cohort engineered for the automated car - and the one used as the reference point to make the (meretricious) case that putting cars in charge of us will be saaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaafer.
    Well, speak for yourself - please.
    Many of us can drive, quite safely. Evidence of that being crash-free driving (irrespective of the number of government extortion letters - i.e., "tickets" - we may have received over the years for various contrived "offenses" and "infractions").
    The accident-free driver of several decades presents an irrefutable counterargument to the one presented by the pushers of the automated car. The two are at least equally safe and arguably, the accident-free human more potentially so because his brain can think while a programmed car can only react.
    Which fact, while we're on the subject, accounts for the fact that automated cars are programmed for uber-cautiousness, to a degree that makes even Safety Nazis tap their feet in frustration.
    Or, more.
    Automated cars are being attacked by autonomous humans. A New York Times story details at least 20 such incidents, just in Arizona. They are being pelted with rocks, their tires slashed and their algorithms toyed with. The Times quotes one Erik O'Polka, who brakes in front of automated cars to frazzle them into pulling themselves over - and "bricking," going inert as a result of computer catalepsy.
    O'Polka told The Times he does this out of anger over an automated car almost running over his 10-year-old son.
    And there is the Replacement Angle.
    Zero Hedge quotes New York City University media theorist, who characterizes automated cars as "scabs" on wheels. "Just think about the humans inside these vehicles, who are essentially training the artificial intelligence that will replace them."
    He adds: "There's a growing sense that the giant corporations honing driverless technologies do not have our best interests at heart."
    Of course they don't. They have their profits at heart - and those profits can be maximized when they have control over our cars. And that interest meshes with Uncle's interests.
    That's not a rip directed at profits, per se - with which there's nothing the matter, if it's a matter of voluntary free exchange. But there's nothing free about being controlled by your car.
    Especially when you didn't ask to be.
    . . .
    Got a question about cars - or anything else? Click on the "ask Eric" link and send 'em in!
    If you like what you've found here please consider supporting EPautos.
    We depend on you to keep the wheels turning!
    Our donate button is here.
    If you prefer not to use PayPal, our mailing address is:
    EPautos
    721 Hummingbird Lane SE
    Copper Hill, VA 24079





    PS: Get an EPautos magnet (pictured below) in return for a $20 or more one-time donation or a $5 or more monthly recurring donation. (Please be sure to tell us you want a sticker - and also, provide an address, so we know where to mail the thing!)
    My latest eBook is also available for your favorite price - free! Click here.



  2. #2
    Senior Member grouch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,095
    Over the Thanksgiving weekend I rented a Nissan Altima to drive to Florida. 1800 miles round trip. Nice car generally and if I were to buy a newer car, I'd probably get one. However, the nanny systems drove me up the wall. I watch traffic and my mirrors. A light would blink if someone was beside me. If I turned the signal on to drop in behind someone, it would blink faster, beep in an insulting manner and the steering wheel would shake. That wasn't the worst part. We had rented a beach house in a private community for the weekend. It had a gate to go through to go in and out. Enbtering you typed a code on a key pad. Leaving, you just drove up and the gate would open. Except the car kept stopping. I'd drive slow to the gate for it to open but the car would stop. Creep and stop, creep and stop. The settings for stopping had the range at maximum and speed at minimum. I know how to drive and have a pretty clean driving record. Maybe I'm not as young as I used to be but I feel replying on these nanny systems isn't as safe. Especially back up cameras.
    Honk if you love Jesus.

    Text if you want to meet him.

  3. #3
    Senior Member DonTom's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Auburn, CA & Reno, NV & Cold Springs Valley, NV
    Posts
    660
    Quote Originally Posted by grouch View Post
    Over the Thanksgiving weekend I rented a Nissan Altima to drive to Florida. 1800 miles round trip. Nice car generally and if I were to buy a newer car, I'd probably get one. However, the nanny systems drove me up the wall. I watch traffic and my mirrors. A light would blink if someone was beside me. If I turned the signal on to drop in behind someone, it would blink faster, beep in an insulting manner and the steering wheel would shake. That wasn't the worst part. We had rented a beach house in a private community for the weekend. It had a gate to go through to go in and out. Enbtering you typed a code on a key pad. Leaving, you just drove up and the gate would open. Except the car kept stopping. I'd drive slow to the gate for it to open but the car would stop. Creep and stop, creep and stop. The settings for stopping had the range at maximum and speed at minimum. I know how to drive and have a pretty clean driving record. Maybe I'm not as young as I used to be but I feel replying on these nanny systems isn't as safe. Especially back up cameras.
    My Tesla won't stop, but it will beep, unless I am in the auto-pilot mode where it does everything for me.

    I have a free month trail of auto-pilot and auto-steer and I really don't care for it. I found it scary at first until I got used to it, but even after getting used to it, I don't really care for either.

    But I do like the backup cameras as well as the blind spot detection. I don't know why you would think the backup cameras are less safe. Mine will beep if things are in the way that I cannot see (unlikely) and shows the lines of where I am reversing toward. I see no reason to even turn my head while reversing, I can see the rear a lot better by looking forward.

    -Don- Auburn, CA

  4. #4
    Senior Member grouch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,095
    Quote Originally Posted by DonTom View Post
    My Tesla won't stop, but it will beep, unless I am in the auto-pilot mode where it does everything for me.

    I have a free month trail of auto-pilot and auto-steer and I really don't care for it. I found it scary at first until I got used to it, but even after getting used to it, I don't really care for either.

    But I do like the backup cameras as well as the blind spot detection. I don't know why you would think the backup cameras are less safe. Mine will beep if things are in the way that I cannot see (unlikely) and shows the lines of where I am reversing toward. I see no reason to even turn my head while reversing, I can see the rear a lot better by looking forward.

    -Don- Auburn, CA

    Lot's of people don't turn their heads. That's the problem. Even when I drive the GF's car with a backup camera, I'm rotating my head. A kid on a bike can get behind you before the system can tell you and you react. I do like the camera, don't get me wrong. It makes parallel parking a breeze. We went to a really nice eatery and there was a spot right in front. Three cars passed it by. I parked on the first try and a couple sitting on the bench for their call were impressed. I'll admit the first try surprised me too. The camera made it easier.

    I don't rely in side mirrors either. I'm always rotating my head. I work in industry and if you don't rotate your head, people can be hurt or killed. I'm always checking my blind spot. Especially when I change lanes. I'm always afraid I'll rely on a system that fails and you don't know it.
    Honk if you love Jesus.

    Text if you want to meet him.

  5. #5
    Senior Member grouch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,095
    Quote Originally Posted by DonTom View Post
    My Tesla won't stop, but it will beep, unless I am in the auto-pilot mode where it does everything for me.

    I have a free month trail of auto-pilot and auto-steer and I really don't care for it. I found it scary at first until I got used to it, but even after getting used to it, I don't really care for either.

    But I do like the backup cameras as well as the blind spot detection. I don't know why you would think the backup cameras are less safe. Mine will beep if things are in the way that I cannot see (unlikely) and shows the lines of where I am reversing toward. I see no reason to even turn my head while reversing, I can see the rear a lot better by looking forward.

    -Don- Auburn, CA

    I saw a video clip on the news yesterday from the Las Vegas area of a Tesla driving along and the driver was fast asleep. He appeared to be snoring.
    Honk if you love Jesus.

    Text if you want to meet him.

  6. #6
    Senior Member DonTom's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Auburn, CA & Reno, NV & Cold Springs Valley, NV
    Posts
    660
    Quote Originally Posted by grouch View Post
    Lot's of people don't turn their heads. That's the problem.
    IMO, I am MUCH more likely to miss seeing something by turning my head than by not turning it. But I normally do both, just by habit. I will also get a loud beep if a bicycle gets too close to the rear of the car while I am reversing.


    Quote Originally Posted by grouch View Post
    I saw a video clip on the news yesterday from the Las Vegas area of a Tesla driving along and the driver was fast asleep. He appeared to be snoring.
    They now force us to keep our hands on the steering wheel to use auto-steer, which IMO, defeats its purpose. I don't mind steering my own car.

    -Don- Auburn, CA

  7. #7
    Senior Member grouch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,095
    Quote Originally Posted by DonTom View Post
    IMO, I am MUCH more likely to miss seeing something by turning my head than by not turning it. But I normally do both, just by habit. I will also get a loud beep if a bicycle gets too close to the rear of the car while I am reversing.


    They now force us to keep our hands on the steering wheel to use auto-steer, which IMO, defeats its purpose. I don't mind steering my own car.

    -Don- Auburn, CA

    Most of the people who come to this site actually LIKE to drive. Porsche sells to people like that so they still offer manual transmissions. I'm looking at a new vehicle as my health is making it difficult to do work on my own cars. I was going to buy a new Escape as it was a basic vehicle. They sold it before I got there with my check book. They keep trying to sell me uploaded versions. One thing I WON'T have is automatic climate control. Those fail down the road and the manual version lets me heat or cool as I feel like. Some things I'll be stuck with. Tire monitors, even though I routinely check my tires. I do admit liking the backup camera on the GF's car as it makes parallel parking a breeze. All the other nanny systems drive me up the wall. When I learned to drive, outside rear view mirrors were options and most cars didn't have them. I use them but still turn to check my blind spots.

    I doubt I'll ever have a self driving car. If I get to where I can't drive, I'll call a cab (not Uber) or take the bus.
    Honk if you love Jesus.

    Text if you want to meet him.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •