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Thread: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

  1. #1
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!


    No one thought much of the first Lexus LS sedan.

    Remember?

    "Japanese" and "luxury car" could not even be uttered in the same sentence -- at least, not without a smirk. Today, BMW, Mercedes-Benz and Audi have learned the hard way to think otherwise.

    Tomorrow, Ford, GM and Chrysler might have to, also -- when it comes to full-size trucks.

    Up until now, Detroit has not been challenged much on this front -- even though they've lost ground in just about every other market segment. The Ford-F-series is (and has long been) the best-selling large pick-up; behind it is the Chevy Silverado 1500. The only other import truck that could even qualify as "full-size" is Nissan's Titan -- and it has been handicapped by limited body/bed/trim configurations -- rendering it no real threat to Detroit's absolute dominance of the full-size truck market.

    Now Toyota has made it clear it's going for the jugular -- with a brand-new Tundra that one-ups everything Detroit has on the field -- size-wise, power-wise and features-wise.

    For starters, the new Tundra's standard engine -- a 236 horsepower 4 liter V-6 -- is almost as muscular as the F-trucks's optional 4.6 liter V-8 (248 hp), while its step-up 4.7 liter V-8 (the previous Tundra's biggest engine), at 271-hp, easily outmuscles the F-truck's optional 4.6 liter V-8 -- and isn't too far off the pace of the F-150's biggest available engine, a 5.4 liter V-8 offering a so-so 300 hp. But the Tundra's got one more round in the clip -- a brand-new 5.7 liter V-8 packing a thunderous 381 horses. Do the math: That's 81 more hp than the F-150's strongest available gas V-8.

    The Tundra simply kicks the F-truck in the head when it comes to power -- and acceleration, too. It rushes forward like a muscle truck, while the F-150 feels like it's got a load of cement blocks in the bed, even when it's ordered with the 5.4 engine (and even when the bed is, in fact, empty). The Toyota also beats it on towing and payload -- with a 10,800 lb. rating vs. the F-truck's formerly class-leading 10,500 lb. rating. You'll also get a six-speed transmission with the mighty Toyota V-8 -- vs. a frankly outdated four-speed automatic in the Ford. Those extra gears allow for tighter spacing between gears, for smoother acceleration -- and not-bad fuel economy (given what we're talking about here). EPA gives the Tundra (with the 5.7 V-8 and 2WD) a city/highway rating of 16-20 mpg. That's actually better than the 5.4-equipped 2WD F-150 (EPA rated at 15 mpg city, 19 on the highway) despite the Tundra's having 81 horsepower more under its hood.

    Chevy's just-redesigned Silverado 1500 is much improved -- especially its beautifully finished interior. But in standard form, the Silverado's even weaker than the base F-truck, with just a 195-hp, 4.3 liter V-6 to bring to the table. That's 40-something horses less than the Tundra's standard engine -- a deficit that's hard to ignore.

    The Silverado's step-up 4.8 liter Vortec V-8, at 295-hp, is stronger than the Tundra's 4.7 liter V-8 -- but the Chevy's next two optional V-8s (a 315-hp 5.3 liter V-8 and, at the very top of the list, a 6 liter, 367-hp Vortec V-8) still don't outgun the Toyota's 5.7 liter mill. Nor does the Chevy out-tow the Toyota; like the Ford, its max rated capacity is 10,500 lbs. And like the Ford, the Chevy doesn't offer a six-speed transmission -- or even a five-speed, for that matter. Result? The Silverado's fuel economy -- even with the smaller 5.3 V-8 -- is only 16 city/22 highway.

    Over at the Dodge store. you'll find a base Ram 1500 comes equipped with a 3.7 liter, 215-hp V-6, with the step-up 4.7 liter V-8 offering 235-hp. Even the once-mighty 5.7 liter Hemi -- with a mere 345 hp on tap -- seems a little swishy compared with the pushing four-hundred-horses Tundra. And the Hemi's a pig at the pump -- slurping fuel like a '70 Hemi 'Cuda at the rate of 15 mpg in town, 19 mpg on the highway.

    Oinkl!

    But at least you can get a five-speed automatic with the Dodge. On the other hand, the Ram's max tow rating -- 8,500 lbs. -- isn't even in the same ballpark as the Tundra's near-11,000 pound rating.

    See where this is headed?

    The Tundra is also the first Japanese pick-up that matches the Big Three trucks when it comes to available bodystyles and bed length options -- offering regular cab, double cab and CrewMax four door cab styles, with five-foot, 6.5 foot and 8-foot bed lengths. Trim lines runs from the base DX (a "work truck") all the way tthrough sporty SR5 and top-of-the-line Limiteds. Prices start at $22,290 and run to $41,850 and up for a 4WD CrewMax Limited with all the bells and whistles.

    And there are lots of both.

    Available equipment includes a rear-view back-up camera built into the overhead console, electroluminescent gauges, power-retractable mirrors, GPS, 10-speaker JBL stereo rig, 20-inch rims, Bluetooth wireless hook-up -- and a TRD Off-Road group that adds BIlstein shocks, BF Goodrich M/S-rated knobby tires, HD suspension, skid plates -- the works.

    But even the base DX comes with climate control AC, 18-inch wheels, traction and stability control, side-impact and curtain airbags and a CD-playing stereo -- along with that impressively strong standard engine (which also comes with a five-speed automatic and stout 3.90 rear axle ratio).

    The truck's outsize personality makes it seem bigger than its competitors, too. Only the Ram comes off as similarly aggressive -- but as the stats reveal, it's unfortunately more show than go.

    But its sheer overkill massiveness may turn out to be the Tundra's only vulnerability. Even a big guy can feel kind of small driving this monster. I took our garbage cans up to the dumpster and felt 12-years-old trying to get them out of the Tundra's bed. And I'm six-feet-three. The walls are so high, you almost need a step stool to see what's in there; my normally adventurous Black Lab wouldn't even try to leap up onto the tailgate. The interior's so huge that the shifter console is off-center -- so the driver can reach it without arm extenders. A pot roast would fit in the center console. You could rent out the door pockets to migrant laborers. And on a purely practical level, maneuvering it into parking spaces can be difficult -- even for skilled drivers. It will take up every inch of your garage -- and make your McMansion seem small.

    Even by today's out-sized standards, the Tundra is an absolutely huge vehicle that may overwhelm some folks. Especially the faux cowboys and suburban types who have glommed onto large pick-ups as a totem of their affluence -- and expression of their egos.

    But then again, the absolutely dominating power it offers -- from the standard engine all the way to its top dog 5.7 liter thumper -- along with the fact that it's the first ever Japanese truck to offer the same panoply of bed and boy configurations, features, etc. as the Detroit-brand stuff -- makes it a safe bet that history's about to repeat itself. People who really need trucks -- and big power -- are about to fall in love.

    Five years hence, no one's going to be snickering about "Japanese trucks" anymore, either.

    END

  2. #2
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    There was never any technical reason for the Japanese to not built large trucks. They just chose not to.

    And if anyone from Detroit ever said "They're not able to", this ought to prove them wrong.

    Chip H.

    Former owner: 2012 Honda Civic LX, 2006 Honda Ridgeline RTL, 2000 Honda CR-V EX, 2003 MINI Cooper S, 1992 Honda Accord LX, 1999 Mercedes ML-320, 1995 VW Jetta GLX, 1991 Mercury Capri XR2, 1981 Mercury Zephyr, 1975 Chevrolet Impala

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    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Quote Originally Posted by chiph
    There was never any technical reason for the Japanese to not built large trucks. They just chose not to.

    And if anyone from Detroit ever said "They're not able to", this ought to prove them wrong.

    Chip H.
    Agreed.. they're whistling past the graveyard if they take that line...!

  4. #4
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Quote Originally Posted by chiph
    There was never any technical reason for the Japanese to not built large trucks. They just chose not to.

    And if anyone from Detroit ever said "They're not able to", this ought to prove them wrong.

    Chip H.
    Agreed.. they're whistling past the graveyard if they take that line...!

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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    We ain't just whistling dixie.

  6. #6
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Quote Originally Posted by swamprat
    We ain't just whistling dixie.
    I happened to have a Chevy 2500 after the Tundra... felt sluggish, didn't steer as precisely as the Toyota. Things are going to get hard, soon....

  7. #7
    mrblanche
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    In my personal opinion, the nicest thing about the Tundra is it's very pretty rear axle, which looks great under hot rods. Didn't notice that, did you?

  8. #8
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrblanche
    In my personal opinion, the nicest thing about the Tundra is it's very pretty rear axle, which looks great under hot rods. Didn't notice that, did you?
    No... but I did admire the "multi-boxed" frame; have you seen that?

  9. #9
    mrblanche
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Nope. Guess we're even.

    The rear axle is gently tapered, like the old Buicks were.

  10. #10
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrblanche
    Nope. Guess we're even.

    The rear axle is gently tapered, like the old Buicks were.
    I'll see whether Toyota has any images of the axle available on the media site - and I'll post 'em if I do!

  11. #11
    XRocketman1967
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Not so fast.... ???
    Tundra Recall Could Cost Toyota

    Toyota's latest quality issues could lead to a recall of the brand-new Tundra pickup.
    Some owners of V-8 Tundras have reported camshaft failures in their trucks. Toyota told the Detroit News that it had logged 20 such complaints. The problem could affect as many as 30,000 Tundras built at assembly plants in Indiana and Texas.
    Toyota had planned to sell 200,000 Tundras in the truck's first year as a part of an aggressive expansion plan in the United States. The company has opened a new San Antonio plant to assemble the truck; has expanded an Alabama engine plant to supply to factory; and has also started construction on plants in Ontario and Mississippi as it tries to match demand for its vehicles.
    The Texas plant had suffered cost overruns before it opened late last year. The News also reports the Tundra had failed to match Ford's F-150 and Dodge's Ram in frontal crash test scores.



  12. #12
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Quote Originally Posted by XRocketman1967
    Not so fast.... ???
    Tundra Recall Could Cost Toyota

    Toyota's latest quality issues could lead to a recall of the brand-new Tundra pickup.
    Some owners of V-8 Tundras have reported camshaft failures in their trucks. Toyota told the Detroit News that it had logged 20 such complaints. The problem could affect as many as 30,000 Tundras built at assembly plants in Indiana and Texas.
    Toyota had planned to sell 200,000 Tundras in the truck's first year as a part of an aggressive expansion plan in the United States. The company has opened a new San Antonio plant to assemble the truck; has expanded an Alabama engine plant to supply to factory; and has also started construction on plants in Ontario and Mississippi as it tries to match demand for its vehicles.
    The Texas plant had suffered cost overruns before it opened late last year. The News also reports the Tundra had failed to match Ford's F-150 and Dodge's Ram in frontal crash test scores.


    You may be right.. and I may have missed this one. I based my opinion on the usualy tendency of Americans to love bigger/stronger/more ostentatious to anything else.

    Also, the Toyota doesn't have 2500 or 3500 levels (as the domestics do) nor a diesel for true HD work...

  13. #13
    XRocketman1967
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    You may be right.. and I may have missed this one. I based my opinion on the usualy tendency of Americans to love bigger/stronger/more ostentatious to anything else.
    Except when it comes to women......at least that's my taste....... ;D :P

  14. #14
    XRocketman1967
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!


  15. #15
    XRocketman1967
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    2007 Toyota Tundra
    Tundra tows with the best of ?em but doesn?t turn domestic heads

    By PHIL FLORADAY

    You?ve surely seen the war for half-ton-towing bragging rights on dozens of prime-time commercials by now. It all started back at the 2006 Chicago auto show, when Toyota promised a towing capacity of at least 10,000 pounds for its 2007 half-ton Tundra.

    All 5.7-liter-powered Tundra models are rated to tow more than many of the gasoline-powered V8 three-quarter-ton Dodge Rams and Ford Super Duties (all heavy GM trucks can tow more than the Tundra). But don?t expect owners of heavy-duty trucks to trade down. Most people want a diesel for regular towing in the 10,000-pound range. Currently, no half-ton offers a diesel.

    What does this mega tow rating mean? You?ll never even notice a typical trailer behind a 2007 Tundra. We hauled an old Toyota Hilux out for a long four-wheeling weekend. It was a fitting load for the Tundra and amazing to see how Toyota trucks have grown since the Hilux was introduced.

    Our trailer weighs about 5000 pounds loaded, and it doesn?t affect the Tundra one bit. Leaving most other vehicles in your wake is easy. Mash the gas, and you?ll be checking the mirrors to be sure the trailer is still attached. We don?t condone speeding with a loaded trailer, but it?s very possible, even uphill. Credit the 4.30 axle gears, six-speed automatic and a healthy 401 lb-ft of torque. Only the GMC Denali, with its 6.2-liter V8, offers more power.

    You will notice a trailer, however, if your Tundra has the optional off-road suspension package. There is noticeable sag with 500 pounds of tongue weight, much more than with our long-term Suburban, and its air-ride suspension showed under the same load. Unlike the F-150 and the Silverado, there is no heavy-duty suspension package available.

    The problem we found with the Tundra is that domestic pickup owners don?t even notice it. There were almost a dozen other tow vehicles in our campground, and nobody stopped by to check out the Tundra.

    The Tundra tows well, returns a respectable 11.4 mpg while doing so and has plenty of power in reserve. These traits are impressive but won?t make much difference until the Toyota folks figure out how to change the brand?s perception in the eyes of domestic truck owners. If you?re able to look past the badge, the Tundra is a solid choice in the full-size segment. It?ll tow, haul and drive at the top of the class, but sales are still hovering near the bottom.

  16. #16
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    I'd bet on Toyota burning the midnight oil to get it right; unlike GM and Ford, Toyota will not rest until success has been achieved...

  17. #17
    XRocketman1967
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    With that mentality(Toyota)makes me wonder why Japan lost in WWII and why we won.

  18. #18
    mrblanche
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Quote Originally Posted by XRocketman1967
    With that mentality(Toyota)makes me wonder why Japan lost in WWII and why we won.
    Some would say the difference in natural resources (mainly oil and metal). In fact, the attack on Pearl Harbor was precipitated by the US cutting off the shipping of scrap metal to Japan.

  19. #19
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Quote Originally Posted by XRocketman1967
    With that mentality(Toyota)makes me wonder why Japan lost in WWII and why we won.
    As in the cas of Germany - it was simply a question of numbers; we outproduced them.

    The Russians won World War II in Europe; we just picked up the pieces.

  20. #20
    XRocketman1967
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    Re: 2007 Toyota Tundra - be afraid, Detroit... be very afraid!

    Very true and now look who is still our enemy......Russia.
    Should have listen to George S. Patton when he said in the movie 'Patton', 'While we are here in Russia why not make friends with the Germans and kick a$$ the Russian. We are going to have to fight them anyway one day'....

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