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Thread: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

  1. #1
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Are you an "aggressive" driver?


    In some states, you can be slapped with an "aggressive driving" beef simply for being issued two tickets in one traffic stop. For example, speeding and making a lane change without signaling. But is that "aggressive driving" -- or just dumbed-down traffic enforcement?

    We already have statutues on the books that cover reckless driving -- a far more objective, easy-to-define offense that everyone's clear about. But "aggressive driving"? What is that, exactly? Does it mean you grip the steering wheel too tight and make mean faces at others? And do we really want to tar drivers as "aggressive" just because the cop issues them more than one citation? Is it really "aggressive driving" -- that is, implicitly reckless -- simply to be doing, say, 68 in a 55 and make a lane change without signaling? Probably most people would say not -- yet there it is on the books: Two tickets, one stop -- you're an "aggressive driver."

    Now that most states have laws that make failing to wear one's seat belt a ticketable offense -- a moving violation with DMV "points," just like speeding or running a light -- the groundwork is there for tagging people as "aggressive drivers" simply for going with the flow of traffic (almost all of us "speed" because most posted limits are set absurdly low) while unbuckled.

    It's reasonable, of course, to argue in favor of abiding by speed limit laws -- and to take the position that people should buckle-up. But what's not reasonable is to package deal minor traffic infractions into the automotive equivalent of the Scarlet letter -- with punishments of a similarly extreme nature.

    Unlike ordinary traffic tickets --which almost everyone among us has received and will receive again at some point -- the "aggressive driving" charge carries with it big-time fines, license suspension (or revocation), even potential time in the county clink, according to the whim of the judge. And of course there's the Mark of Cain on your DMV rap sheet -- the one the insurance companies use to terminate your policy -- or simply hit you with a "surcharge" of 20-50 percent, on the basis of your "aggressive driving" conviction.

    Not only is all this grossly disproportionate to the offense -- comparable to throwing a kid into juvenile hall for being tardy a couple of times -- it muddies the distinction between objectively dangerous actions behind the wheel that ought to be the focus of vigorous enforcement efforts and technical infractions such as speeding and making right turns on red that maybe deserve a ticket, but sure aren't creating mayhem on the roads.

    Yet more and more localities are adopting these ill-conceived statutes -- in part to appease the various "mom's" groups out there that have have descended like a flock of termagants onto local politicos, demanding "action" against the ever-present threat to "the children" of dangerous driving --notwithstanding that reckless driving statutes are already on the books and need only to be enforced (when appropriate).

    Law enforcement (and the pols) stand to gain because a) it adds another "tool" to their ensemble of bully-boy hardware and b) both can preen and strut in the glow of the uptick in arrests and prosections for the dread offense -- since by lowring the var, more victims will be snared and those victims easier to nab, too. Why, with just about every other driver on the road technically guilty of "speeding" just to start with -- and probably two out of every eight also guilty of some other minor infraction at the same time -- racking up a big pile of gotchas for "aggressive driving" won't be much harder than manning a radar trap -- or downing a dozen Crispy Cremes over a single shift.

    Author Sam Francis coined the term "anarcho-tyranny" to describe the state of affairs in which basically law-abiding citizens are increasingly raked over the coals for commiting relatively minor (and mostly harmless) violations of law -- while the genuinely dangerous are ignored or given a pass. Either they're too dangerous to deal with, or just too much trouble.

    Or maybe there's just not enough money in it.


  2. #2
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    You hit the nail on the head. I like the anarcho tyranny description.

  3. #3
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Quote Originally Posted by swamprat
    You hit the nail on the head. I like the anarcho tyranny description.
    Thanks!

    And credit Sam Francis (conservative writer) for the "anarcho tyranny" concept; I knew Sam when I worked for the Rev. - he was a mean old fat so and so. But a very smart one.

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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Eric,

    Sam had some great sayings. One of my favorite of his was when he would refer to the Republicans as the "Stupid Party".

    Unfortunately there is a current trend to criminalize small little infridgements including traffic violations in many states. All the things you mentioned in your above post are steps in this direction. In the end when a citizen is fearful of his/her government we have tyranny, when a government is fearful of its people we have liberty. Unfortunately we are slowly being engulfed in tyranny and both political parties are moving us in that direction as fast as they can. A perfect example of this is the new hate crimes legislation being pushed through the U.S. Congress right now, it's the first step to criminalizing free speech:

    http://www.truthtellers.org/alerts/e...svotethur.html

    The only hope I see on the horizon is Ron Paul who is running for president, he's the last chance we've got:

    http://www.ronpaul2008.com/

    http://www.ronpaul2008.com/html/Issues_fx.html





  5. #5
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Yep - which is part of the reason we fled to the Boonies (though I realize that won't do much, if the worst comes to pass).

    I like Paul - and the Libertarians - but I think they have next to nil chance of ever achieving power. Toomany people in this country want Big Government (on the right and the left). I'd say the percentage of Americans who favor a genuinely limited government along the lines espoused by the Libertarian Party is around 5-10 percent and probably much closer to the lower figure.

    Also, I think mass society/dense populations are incompatible with a free/Libertarian system. Jefferson said so first... and I agree with him!

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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Eric,

    The problem is that most people have been brainwashed for many years by the education system and the media that government has all the answers. When some tragedy or other occurrence happens the first thing out of most people's mouths is "what's the government going to do about it". The simple matter is most people have become very soft and if the tough ever got going (which I hope does not happen) most people could not fend for themselves.

    Concerning Ron Paul, he's running as a Republican for President. He has served many years as a Republican U.S. Congressman from Texas. And he's the brightest hope I have seen in years, he was one of the only Congressmen to have the guts to vote against the Patriot Act which has eroded our civil liberties. He has support from many on the right, left, and many in-between. I have seen him do pretty well on some Internet Presidential polls. He's not a true libertarian he's more a strict constitutionalist. He's against North American Union, against illegal immigration, against free trade that sends our jobs overseas, etc. Many on the Internet are now referring to Ron Paul as "founding father material".

    However the Globalists control both political parties, and they will push hard to get another puppet as President to continue their agenda. They will probably swing to a Clinton again in 2008 and then back to another Bush in 2016. But I stopped years ago supporting the better of two evils, since evil is evil. I now support only good candidates like Ron Paul. As a side note I supported Pat Buchanan in 1992, 1996, and 2000 when he ran for President. I remember trying to warn people I knew about the havoc of illegal immigration, the globalists' free trade policies, and how NAFTA was merging us with Mexico back in 1990s and that the only candidate running for office talking about these problems was Pat Buchanan. Those people said I was overreacting and being a 'chicken little'. Well here now in 2007 those same people are complaining to me how bad illegal immigration has gotten; how jobs are flying overseas at an accelerated pace; and how the US, Canada, and Mexico are merging into the North American Union (Lou Dobbs was the first TV news commentator to expose the evils of the North American Union). The North American Union was signed into existence in secrecy by George Bush, Vincente Fox, and Paul Martin back in 2005 via the SPP (for this reason alone George Bush should be impeached). However these same people now have woken up to where I was in back in 1990s, it only took them 10 to 15 years to realize what I was saying was indeed true. Let's hope it won't take them and others another 10 years, to wake up and realize Ron Paul is the best candidate we have for President.

    Anyone wanting more info about the North American Union can check out this link:

    http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=14965

  7. #7
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Hi Pete,

    I agree with all you've written; but I'm cynical and without any hope of turning things around. It's too late for that. Things have been set into motion that cannot be unstopped. Now it's just a matter of "when" - not "if." (I knew Pat, back in the day... I bet he'd agree with me... off the record.)

    The best case scenario, as I see it, would the peaceful fracture of the country into autonomous republics, as happened in the former Soviet Union. The sparsely populated/rural areas may still wish for a strictly limited government; as far as the rest of the country, that's both untenable politically (and very likely, not desired, by the ruled as much as the rulers).

    C'mon out to the Hills, amigo.

    Before it's too late...

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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Eric,

    I see your point, things look fairly grim. And somedays I feel we are doomed. But I like to hold out some hope and keep the "glass is half full" type of attitude.

    You're right the hills are the place to be.


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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    I voted for Buchanan in all primaries and elections where he ran. I was disappointed that he supported Bush 1 in 1992, and enraged when he was shut out of the Republican convention in 1996 after he got more votes than he did in 1992. I felt that he should have gone for an independent bid in 1996, even though Clinton would have still won. By 2000, his failing health and the supposedly vibrant econonmy almost gave Gore the election.

    I have a special bitterness and contempt for all Bush 41 supporters of 1992 and the Dole supporters in 1996. I also saw Rush Limbaugh as a double deal back stabbing buffoon who sold out conservatism to the lowest bidders.

    I think that this year could be prime pickings for an independent candidate. The repubs and teh demonrats will have their nominee decided by March 1, 2008, and voter apathy will be at an all time high because the sheeple are simply incapable of answering a multiple choice test with more than two answers. On the other hand, they may be so sick of Hilary and Guliani that they may go for a Bloomberg or someone similar. Who knows. The candidate probably wouldn't be what I'd like, anything may be better than the morons running now.

  10. #10
    mrblanche
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    That is a good analysis. So...you gonna vote Libertarian?

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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    swamprat,

    Have to agree with Mr. Blanche that was a good analysis. Checkout Ron Paul, I think you will like how he stands on the issues.

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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Quote Originally Posted by Disco Man
    swamprat,

    Have to agree with Mr. Blanche that was a good analysis. Checkout Ron Paul, I think you will like how he stands on the issues.
    Thanks. I am familiar with Ron Paul. If he runs as a libertarian again, I will vote for him. I am not registered in a party at this point, although I am largely libertarian in all issues except for protective trade barriers and immigration enforcement (I think employers ened to be hit hard for hiriing illegals.. more sting operations).

    I may end up voting for him in the republican primary as well, but I don't believe that he has a chance. The best thing he could do is get maybe 5 percent.. that may be enough for some good press coverage..??

    The Republican party is virtually dead, as the democrats were after 1994. It took Bush and every single Neocon to kill it.

  13. #13
    mrblanche
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    I voted for all the Libertarian candidates in our last election here, except for Governor, where I voted for Kinky Friedman.

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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Looks like Ron Paul got a nice approval rating bump from the debates, he's polling pretty high, check out this link:

    http://www.jonesreport.com/articles/...ides_high.html


  15. #15
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    "Looks like Ron Paul got a nice approval rating bump from the debates, he's polling pretty high, check out this link"

    My political optimism slipped away years ago; Ron might have a shot at being elected to office in a small, rural area. National office is an impossibility. Too many on the teat; whether it's welfare breeders in trailer parks or billion-dollar-defense contractors in McClean. At bottom, the question is one of population density. Individualism and self-sufficiency whither as population grows beyond a certain point. And "social problems" that are a function of "the masses" - everything from pollution to scarcity to crime - make more (and more intrusive/controlling) government inevitable. It's no coincidence that the countries with the most freedom for the individual and the least government are those with low population densities. As soon as people start bumping into one another at every turn, they begin to quarrel and dispute over things - and viola, government.

    In my lifetime, the population of this country has almost doubled - from appx. 190 million in the mid-late 1960s to 300 million and growing. The range of an individual's freedm to act - and to be left alone - has declined proportionately.

    I can only imagine - and dread - what will happen as we pass 350 million and then 400 million...





  16. #16
    TC
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric
    In my lifetime, the population of this country has almost doubled - from appx. 190 million in the mid-late 1960s to 300 million and growing. The range of an individual's freedm to act - and to be left alone - has declined proportionately.

    I can only imagine - and dread - what will happen as we pass 350 million and then 400 million...
    Being cynical, that could be the aim of the power groups in this country.
    To increase the population to a point where the individual has no influence.
    Like China and India.

  17. #17
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Quote Originally Posted by TC
    Quote Originally Posted by Eric
    In my lifetime, the population of this country has almost doubled - from appx. 190 million in the mid-late 1960s to 300 million and growing. The range of an individual's freedm to act - and to be left alone - has declined proportionately.

    I can only imagine - and dread - what will happen as we pass 350 million and then 400 million...
    Being cynical, that could be the aim of the power groups in this country.
    To increase the population to a point where the individual has no influence.
    Like China and India.
    I'd say "realistic" more than cynical. The global "free market" and vulture capitalism are part and parcel of the trend...

  18. #18
    ColleenC1
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    America only holds 4% of the World's population -- get over it!

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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Quote Originally Posted by TC
    Quote Originally Posted by Eric
    In my lifetime, the population of this country has almost doubled - from appx. 190 million in the mid-late 1960s to 300 million and growing. The range of an individual's freedm to act - and to be left alone - has declined proportionately.

    I can only imagine - and dread - what will happen as we pass 350 million and then 400 million...
    Being cynical, that could be the aim of the power groups in this country.
    To increase the population to a point where the individual has no influence.
    Like China and India.
    That is an interesting point. Individuals have very little influence on things here. While the population of the US has gone from 200 million in the late 1960's to 300+ million today, I find it interesting that we have the same number of represenetatives in the US house. I think that congressional districts should be redrawn to reduce the size of congressional districts. This system stinks. How did they come with the number 435 anyway? How about 700 instead?

  20. #20
    Vulture of The Western World Eric's Avatar
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    Re: Are you an "aggressive" driver?

    Quote Originally Posted by ColleenC1
    America only holds 4% of the World's population -- get over it!
    So... we should strive to be more like India and China than we already are?


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