Got a story for you guys – a real life example of the thugs-among-us and the casual violence that radiates from their mere presence.
A friend of my wife’s works just down the road – maybe three miles from her house. She owns an old car – the Morris Minor I once wrote about working on, for those who recall. The car is 44 years old; has “Antique Vehicle” plates. She likes to drive this car the three or so miles to her work, both for the fun of it and also to keep the car in good running order – as per my advice to her about not leaving it to just sit for weeks/months on end. Regular use means the gas doesn’t go bad and the carb doesn’t get gunked up. Oil flows – all that good stuff.
But, to get to back my story . . .
This friend tells my wife that a local cop has cruised the parking lot of her place of employment, noted the “Antique Vehicle” tags – and actually went in to the place to issue a “friendly warning” (that is, a not-so-thinly-veiled threat) to the supervisor of my wife’s friend that it is a “ticketable offense” to drive a vehicle with “Antique” tags to work.
Which is true – there is a “law” to that effect. But it takes a real Inspector Javert type to worry about it.
Much less to take action.
I’m actually surprised this cop didn’t simply park his taxpayer-extorted free (for him) squad car, engine idling using gas he didn’t pay for, and wait as long as it took for the “law breaker” to emerge, in order to confiscate some more of other-people’s money.
The truly sick thing is this cop thinks he was being “nice” because all he did – this time – was issue a threat. Like the cop who “gives you a break” by reducing the number on the “speeding” ticket he just gave you. It’s like they expect us to be grateful for only kicking us in the balls once.
Or not too hard.
Think about it – and get mad.
Here’s a guy cruising parking lots looking for an excuse – a legal technicality – to screw with people who’ve done nothing to anyone. Meanwhile, there is no lack of people who’ve done horrible things to others – you know, actual criminals – loose among us. Yet this guy – like so many of his ilk – has time to fuck with middle-aged hausfraus who’ve committed the dastardly offense of driving their old car to work.
(Where they work to earn the money which will be heavily taxed in order to pay for the costumes, armament and so on enjoyed by “heroes” such as the one I’m describing.)
Worse, it does not not occur to this guy that he is fucking with her. From his perspective, he is merely “enforcing the law” – which he in his ethical nihilism equates with “right.”
He does not see himself as a bad guy. Because the law is good. All laws are good. Ipso facto, then, law enforcement is good.
Yet is there anything worse – anything more despicable – than shrugging off responsibility for your actions by claiming “it’s the law” – or put another way, to point guns at people or threaten them with violence for no more reason than you were told to enforce the law – any law, every law – by some higher-up authority?
In other words – just because?
Isn’t that the excuse tendered by Adolf Eichmann? Anyone remember him? I doubt this cop does.
A kind of arrested development is a necessary prerequisite for the widespread implementation of authoritarianism. Government schools are essential. Rote memorization and recitation. Never any connecting of the dots. That A logically follows B.
Oh no.
Instead, inculcation from earliest childhood onward of deference to authority – because it is authority. To never question authority. To extrapolate, writ large, the parental response to the inquisitive why expressed by a child: Because I say so.
And to make it unconscious.
So that this cop can cruise a parking lot – and not feel bad about going out of his way to bare the fangs of state power at a harmless woman who drove her old car three miles to work. To threaten her with violence – lets dispense with all the sickly euphemisms and happy talk – because he espied her “Antique Vehicle” plates.
A normally developed adult human mind would shrink back from such an assault. Would feel disgusted with himself for having anything to do with it in the first place. Would never voluntarily (and knowingly) undertake such work – or would walk away from it, once the true nature of it dawned on him.
But the deformed, crippled, animal-child mind of the typical cop? It feels nothing – because it does not think anything. It merely does as ordered. And will do anything, if ordered.
That is the thing to take away from this incident. We are dealing with two-legged Dobermans, their heads bred to be so narrow and small as to squeeze their brains – or whose brains have been scrambled via other means. They are point and click. Stimulus – and response.
Nothing more.
They don’t care that you’ve harmed no one. And they absolutely don’t care that they are harming you (or threatening to, if you fail to Submit and Obey).
Their totem – their Master’s Voice – is “the law.”
And it is all that matters.
Throw it in the Woods?
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thats a good reason to always BACK INTO a parking space.
cops also cruise motel parking lots at night to run the tags of all the cars in the lot.
Here’s the most troubling aspect of the whole story: just why did the cop assume that the car with antique plates belonged to an employee of that business in the first place? The driver could have been simply a visitor or a customer instead for all the cop knew. Long story short: he wasted time on stupid BS. In the meantime, what real crime was going on during that same time in his locality?
Exactly, EK!
“Law enforcement” spends the bulk of its time enforcing laws – not restraining criminals. The former is virtually risk-free (for them) and profitable while the latter is dangerous – and there’s no money in it.
“Heroes” my ass.
Why does the government require tags/registration of automobiles? Is it because of the claim that we operate them on government owned roadways??
I give up on trying to stay in the nested comments. 8, get my fuckin email addy from Dom. Here’s the link to the Purest Colloids website:
http://www.purestcolloids.com/mesosilver.htm?partner=9&gclid=CKvRwJqo57kCFZFcQgodoxgASQ
Got to remember: Every single thing the Nazis did in WWII was LEGAL. Whatever they wanted to do, they simply passed a law to authorize it. As you pointed out, Adolf Eichmann, (who some of your readers may not be familiar with) used this as his principal defense for organizing the deportation of millions of Jews to the death camps: He was only following orders. Just doing his job. Even if that job was murder. Same with the Gestapo and the SS – just enforcing the law. Doing their jobs. At the Nuremberg Trials, organized by the USA, this was not accepted as a defense. Those who had just been “following orders” and “doing their jobs” and “enforcing the law” were hanged as war criminals. Might be a good idea to apply the same criteria again?
Exactly, Lemuel!
Unlearning the false tautology that “legal” is synonymous with “ethically acceptable” – and its flip, that “illegal” is synonymous with “ethically unacceptable” is one of the essential first steps toward re-creating a sane society.
The scary thing about people such as our Clover is they are exactly like Eichmann. They would countenance – they do countenance – killing people, so long as it’s “legal” and never stop to think whether it’s right.
Eric,
The state forced her to sign an affidavit stating her intended use of the vehicle was parades, etc., even when she planned on using it for work? Forced? Duress? Come on. And you write that with a straight face?
You can claim the state “forces” folks to obtain licenses in order to operate vehicles, based on a state monopoly of the roads, and property in general. But its nonsense to assert the state forced her to obtain an antique car license. Pure nonsense.
Seriously, did the BMV clerk point a gun and say, “No regular license for you, honey. Your getting the antique plate or 120 gains of lead.”
Again, I bet she games private entities (insurance companies, etc.) in the same manner.
” … that to disobey or evade amounts to a moral-ethical wrong. I cannot think of a more Cloveritic point-of-view than that.”
Wow, another variation of Clover. My feelings aren’t hurt, truly. I’m actually smug thinking this is the height of your righteous indignation. The crowd in this sandbox may giggle, but that’s where it ends.
Eights is the man-as-an-island and you are Superman, alway on guard — omnipotent and omnipresent, defending your property even when your are not around. When your car is stolen at the mall, remember to find the phone booth. But not to call the cops, just to change uniforms.
By the way: I have another story for you … it’s about the lifeguard at the public pool who blew his whistle and pointed. Scary stuff.
Stick to big issues — you won’t look so petty.
I’m surprised eric hasn’t said what the circumstances were but I have a feeling the woman didn’t originally have in mind driving that vehicle till eric told her regular driving would keep it alive. Things change and you don’t always end up doing what you intended.
“Eights is the man-as-an-island and you are Superman, alway on guard — omnipotent and omnipresent, defending your property even when your are not around.”
“Eights” doesn’t see himself as Superman in any way however he does see, quite accurately, he is an island, not omnipotent nor omnipresent, just one not afforded the same protection as you evidently assume you have(as well as everyone else). You’d be wrong on my account and most probably on your account too.
Not only do I live in the middle of nowhere, I know if I see anyone representing themselves as the “law” on my property it will NOT be anything positive for me. That’s simply the way it is, not a damned thing I can do about it. No Superman, not bulletproof or anything else proof, just an entity you’d best not mess with since my back’s to the wall. I’ve been ripped off plenty. Being in the construction trade and other trades, I’ve had my share of thefts. 25 years ago I called the law on one of these. What a friggin joke….never again.
Are you seriously claiming Police find the missing property of individuals, A_little_reason? What a laugh. Tell us a tale of your investigative prowess. Come on let’s have it. Every decent sized police department has a website now. I challenge you to find any that mention significant returns of stolen property to its owners. A large cache may find its way to a large business, if your Ipad has a GPS in it they “might” get it back to you.
Almost no stolen property is ever recovered. The infinitesimal amount that is, is rarely returned to its owners.
Fayette AR police say bulk of recovered stolen property never returned to owners
http://www.fayobserver.com/articles/2013/09/15/1275856?sac=fo.home
Reason,
“The state forced her to sign an affidavit stating her intended use of the vehicle was parades, etc., even when she planned on using it for work? Forced? Duress? Come on. And you write that with a straight face?”
Indeed, I do.
Because it’s a fact. Do you really deny that everything the state does involves at least the implied threat of physical coercion – and thus, duress?
Seriously?
Res ipsa loquitur. There’s no need to elaborate. If you actually do believe people are not under duress when dealing with the government – that is, they have the option to say no, to decline to “participate” without risking violent repercussions, then you’re beyond reason – and certainly no Libertarian.
Then you write:
“But its nonsense to assert the state forced her to obtain an antique car license. Pure nonsense.”
Question begging – again. No, the state didn’t force her to get Antique tags. But it does force her to get tags. It’s like giving the condemned man the “choice” between the gallows and the firing squad – and faulting him for trying by whatever means to avoid either fate.
Yes, she can “freely choose” to have no tags – and will become the object of arrest, her vehicle seized by goons.
Or, she can “freely choose” to get standard tags – and pay yet another endless fee for a car that is rarely operated beyond a 5 mile radius of her home and be forced to turn it over to a stranger once a year for “inspections” – and pay another fee.
Or, she can “freely choose” to try to limit the hassle/damage imposed on her by the state and its enforcers via the Antique tags.
But she cannot not choose none of the above – and expect to be left in peace.
That’s duress, “reason.”
Then you regurgitate your smear about “gaming” the system. That is, not being a good little drone and doing as ordered by thugs with guns. Again, your premise is that the system is legitimate, that she freely agreed to a compact – and is being disreputable by not living up to her end of things.
And that is nonsense, “reason.”
Dear Eric,
Mr. little ability to reason sneers at the little old lady for “gaming the system,” as if she was a con artist.
This is similar to sheeple rhetoric about “tax cheats.”
Those who have seen through the CW about tax collectors and their victims, knows that the concept of “tax cheats” is the most successful case of guilt-tripping the victim in human history.
Mr. little ability to reason smugly parrots this same moral inversion.
Larken Rose does a nice demolition job on it in 4 short minutes:
Eric,
Hmmm.
First you assert “[t]he state forced her to sign an affidavit stating her intended use of the vehicle was parades, etc., even when she planned on using it for work.”
Then … hold your breath … you refute yourself but a few confused paragraphs later. And you have the gall to claim question begging on my part, especially when you can’t keep a cogent argument going for a 100 words or so.
The issue is not the tags — I already gave you that. The issue is purchasing antique plates when she intended to use the car for work.
My premise has never been the system is legit. I am simply stating that your focus on trite issues does nothing for the cause of liberty — especially when the “victim” made a fraudulently claims and was called on it. No violence. No real threat.
And, I bet, she made a similar fradulent claim to her insurance company (private entity). Actions such as those are never far apart.
I know, I know. You read threats into everything — like the cop directing traffic at the football game — every direction to you is a threat. Again, scary stuff.
You simply paint yourself as someone with a chip on his shoulder. Not someone making valid arguments.
Nevertheless, thanks for dropping the clover epithet. It grows tiresome.
All that said: you are correct on one thing above (not to state that you do not have other correct statements) when you strive to stay healthy. That, my friend, is the best thing you can do.
The door into chronic care (high blood pressure, so-call high cholesterol, etc.) only opens inward. Once you are convinced that you have one of these “illnesses,” you are hooked for life.
And everyone in the healthcare system is pushing you in and blocking your exit.
It seems to me that she wasn’t, “planning on using it for work” she was simply using it to keep it operational without going out of her way. What’s so hard to understand about that?
Do you think she drove it to work in the WInter?
I wonder, are you the type of person who thought it was, “a trite issue” to get shoved by a bully? It just seems that way. As if, unless things are getting wayyy out of hand, *then* you’ll act, but not until then. Until then, nothing is *ever* a threat. Right?
I think there’s a word for that, starts with a P. What is that word?
“No violence. No real threat.”
Yeah, uh-huh. Land of the blind, I say.
@reason – You are making a pretty big step over that Grand Canyon by knowing what her intent was and is with the state and her insurance. Maybe you should backup a bit and stay with the facts.
You can appreciate that it’s hard to stay cogent with someone who types “Hmmm.”
“Hold your breath. I already gave you that. Hmmm.”
“The door only opens inward. Hmmm.”
“Pushing you in and blocking your exit. Hmmm.”
Herbert the Pervert – “Hmmm.” at 0:24
Herbert the pervert prank calls a newspaper
“Reason,” –
Her intentions are, in the first place, unknown to you and in the second, beside the point.
The point is whether it’s right – ethically legitimate as opposed to “legal” – to hassle someone over crap like this. You say yes. Because, as you see it, this woman violated her “contract” with the state and the enforcer of said contract was merely exercising his legitimate (i.e., “legal”) authority.
I say no – both the law itself and its enforcer are illegitimate. Exactly the same as a mafia that sends a Luca Brasi to “remind” you about the monthly payment you “owe” them. It is legitimate to do anything you can to avoid paying what you “owe.” To lie to Luca Brasi. To trick him. To end-run him in any way you can. To kill him, even. Because Luca Brasi is illegitimate.
The issue between us is that you either do not understand or do not accept the NAP and self ownership. You seem to believe that some people have a right – ethically/legally – to impose their will on others using violence or the threat thereof (which is the same thing).
I do not.
You write:
“My premise has never been the system is legit. I am simply stating that your focus on trite issues does nothing for the cause of liberty — especially when the “victim” made a fraudulently claims and was called on it. No violence. No real threat.”
No violation of the NAP – that is, no instance of aggressive violence – is ever “trite.” Because the principle at issue is everything. Do you consider objecting to petty theft “trite,” also?
Or do you merely object to grand theft auto?
Should a woman ignore or just accept having some random guy grab her ass? Or is it only when the random guy rips off her pants and rapes her that it’s no longer merely “trite”?
Look: Tyranny begins with “trite” and “petty” affronts. Tolerate them, and they will mushroom into not-so-trite and petty affronts. Think, for instance, of those “sobriety checkpoints” most people accepted back in the ’80s. They established the precedent that has given us probable-cause-free “checks” of our genitals at airports.
Either you believe in liberty – and object to every and all violations thereof. Or you do not.
A “fraud” – for evading the state’s ukase? For trying to avoid having to abide by the “terms” of a “contract” one was forced into?
I stand in awe. Such epic double-think is quite something to behold.
“No violence”?
Really?
So, for you, it is only violence when actually raining down on you rather than merely assuredly threatened if you fail to do as ordered?
Then, surely, you believe that there was no violence suffusing the Soviet Union or Nazi Germany, either – since one could avoid the gas chambers and camps by complying.
There is no way (cue Jackie Gleason) you could possibly be even a half-Libertarian. I suspect you’re either on the payroll as a shill for the DC puppeteers. Or you’re simply here to try – poorly, I might add – to discredit Libertarian ideas.
The problem is, it’s hard to undermine the arguments of people who deal in principles and concept. Who don’t make exceptions to rules. Who don’t vomit euphemisms and double-talk.
Keep ’em coming, “reason.”
It’s really all too easy.
Just a few things. I hung up my badge many moons ago when “To protect and serve” became law enforcement. I couldn’t agree with the enforcement of victimless crimes, seatbelt laws, inspection stickers etc. These are just tools used by LEOs to get their foot in the door.
Some of these comments show how well the school system in this country really works, the indoctrination of children to believe that the laws are there to protect them. I am amazed that adults can’t see through the BS.
I can’t see how a police officer doesn’t understand that warning someone that there is a potential problem isn’t seen as a threat. When I was in uniform, if I was to warn you that you may have been in violation, you can damn well accept that as a threat. I had the full force and confidence of the state behind me, the uniform and badge.
Exactly, Curtis.
It’s amazing to me that so many people cannot seem to understand this simple – and obvious – thing.
eric, curtis, when I read clover’s assertions I’m reminded of what my ancestors who came to this country would have said to them “So, why did you leave the old country?” People left other places for the same persecutions that would have them leaving this country now.
Eric,
“Reason” is anything BUT! Only a fully indoctrinated, Kool-Aid drinking libtard could engage in such epic doublethink…
The whole concept of license plates is a form of slavery. It’s no surprise such stories as Eric posts here happen. That’s what happens to slaves.
http://strike-the-root.com/badges-of-our-slavery
This is an example of how cops see themselves as “law enforcers” rather than “peacekeepers.” This cop noted a very minor infraction, and with his “law enforcement” mindset, thought he was being a good guy by just warning her rather than writing a ticket. I doubt it would be possible to communicate to him what his duties really should be, and that he should have just passed by on this one.
Since the law seems to have a limit on “Antique Vehicle” plates, it probably would be in her best interest to pay a few bucks more, and get a regular tag so that the costumed thug has no reason to interact with her.
no reason says he was merely warning her. Warning her? of a state administrator with the power of god who’s been cruising parking lots looking for technical infractions? Other cops who are setting her up for a big bust? Shit man, what turnip truck do you think I just fell off? Just another threatening prick. no reason claims we here at this site would “threaten” in his words, a bouncer at a bar(or anyone for that matter) as if that’s the kind of people who hang here. In my part of the world, if you issue a threat, you’d best be ready to defend life and limb just as soon as it’s out of your mouth. Yes, I might retaliate against someone who’s gone out of their way to harm me or mine, but threaten them? That’s stupid. Then I’d have to worry about them worrying about me so much they’d come after me. So you have to ask yourself, what sort of clover(oh, I know that’s so sophomoric)world does he live in? Threaten indeed. KMOA
” Yes, I might retaliate against someone who’s gone out of their way to harm me or mine, but threaten them? That’s stupid.”
Yep, why give a jughead any warning at all? That’s just like telegraphing a punch in a fight.
Indeed, Cogitator!
The downside is she – like many people who own fragile old cars that have difficult to find/expensive to replace parts – doesn’t want to turn her car over to some guido for a “safety” inspection (mandatory to get the conventional tags).
I put a small fortune into my ’64 Corvair – including an all-new (NOS) parchment white interior. The last thing I needed was some guy in greasy overalls sliding across my seats. Nor do I want him applying an air gun to the NOS chrome lug nuts to my ’76 Trans-Am’s wheels, then manhandling my restored Honeycomb wheels and trim rings. Nor do I want a dude manhandling the clutch (old cars don’t have hydraulic assist)… or touching the car at all. They break something or mess something up, it’s not their problem. It’s yours.
With Antique tags, I’m spared all that. No doubt the owner of the Morris feels the same way.
I’m originally from Virginia, but now live in Florida. I forgot about the vehicle inspections, which we no longer have in Florida. Since the “Antique Vehicle” plates allow her to opt out of that nonsense, my suggestion really wasn’t a good one. Still avoiding those bastards makes sense.
This is just another example of how they pretend to protect us, but they really just make our lives miserable.
Also it should be pointed out that there is a death sentence associated with every law. If they want to take you into custody, no matter how trivial the “offense,” and you have other things to do, they will escalate the violence up to and including killing you.
The enemy is the state, and the police are agents of the state, therefor they are our enemies, not our friends. The cop in this stories provides evidence of that.
Cogitator, once they get their hands on you death is minutes, seconds away. I was once stuck in a place where the heat and lack of air circulation was so great it would have killed me(that was the whole point of it) without hydration a trustee provided me at his great expense(he caught some serious shit). I owe him my life. I don’t appreciate anyone telling me of the hurt to the state since that’s a foolish notion on the face of it. Even had I been guilty of depriving anyone of anything there was no justification for what they did.
Eric, you don’t have to turn your car over to the inspector. Virginia law allows an inspection with the owner at the wheel. Just keep going from station to station until you find one that will allow you to drive your car into the bay and operate the lights and horns.
That’s what I’ve done. Now that I have the shop I like, I give him all my major wrenching business, as well as inspections. I was lucky enough to find a shop near me where the owner and all his inspection certified guys are on the shop’s racing team and they are all classic car buffs as well.
This article, the clover comments, and the cop comments, all confirm the hero mindset. It is a mindset that life is pain. That order is achieved by rigorous formal organization and scientific distribution of pain.
Law and order is pain inflicted to maintain the health of the state, and for your own good as well, since you are a member of the state. In a Sovietized society, the general welfare is the only consideration. Undue mercy shown by an official is a dereliction of duty. It is treason not to interdict, to fail to apply the proscribed pain, when an infraction is observed .
Inspector Javert Quotes:
“I never temper justice with mercy, I administer the law – good, bad, or indifferent – it’s no business of mine, but the law to the letter!”
“Right or wrong, the law is the law. The law allows you nothing.”
“There is no God. There is only the law. Good and evil do not exist outside the law.”
“I’ve tried to live my life without breaking a single rule”
“You know what is going to happen, don’t you? I will take you in the end!”
“A serious grave violation of the public trust is committed whenever an inferior shows a lack of respect for the law. The violator must be exposed and punished.”
“Modern science tells us that people are by nature, either law breakers or law abiders. A wolf could wear sheep’s clothing but he’s still a wolf.”
The Soviet American sees his authority as deriving from his place in the pain hierarchy. How much pain to how many people can he administer.
He measures his self-worth in his ability to tolerate pain. Self-denial is the highest virtue. His job, his family, everything must be under constant threat. His motivator is the pain of loss. The pain of disapproval. He has no self-esteem. Only aversion to pain.
A free man seeks his own pleasure. He evaluates himself according to his contributions. His success in achieving goals. He does what he does because he enjoys it. He enjoys his possessions and interactions with others. This notion of pain is alien to him. It is so irrational, it is outside his ability to understand and relate to.
The free pleasure seekers know that things are getting bad. That the pain and compliance psychopaths are taking over. He is a little like the Native American, who witnessed the subjugation and usurpation of the only land he had ever known.
Unlike the Native Americans, I hope we can get over the shock of the new reality, and take the steps and gain the knowledge to survive this onslaught of pain worshipping Necromongers.
I think we’re making a lot of headway. All that is required is to preserve a place of freedom, maintain access to resources, and preserve abilities of association and trade. We don’t have to worry about winning a war on their terms. Or of keeping things the way they used to be. That’s not even possible.
All we have to do is remain realistic and guided by reason. Their irrationality leads to their own destruction and downfall. We just need to have a place and a community to enable us to survive their inevitable cycles of implosions and breakdowns that have always plagued the People of pain and misery.
– – – – – –
Taiwan Amis – Difang & Igay Duana – Jubilant Drinking Song Sung After Weeding or Harvest
To me this chant sounds identical to anyone here describing their life’s work. Whether in English about trucking, engineering, or programming, or in Ami chant about weeding and harvesting the rice paddy , they each sound gloriously and joyously the same.
Return to Innocence – Enigma – With sample of Ami Chant
The Soviet American system can’t tolerate any natural way of life. There is only pain. Great councils declare who can do what and when. Who must experience the full bureaucratic and administrative pain of the all power no pleasure pain based state.
The return to innocence. If you want, then start to laugh
If you must, then start to cry. Be yourself don’t hide
Just believe in deistiny. Don’t care what people say
Just follow your own way. Don’t give up and use the chance
To return to innocence. That’s not the beginning of the end
That’s the return to yourself. Don’t care what people say
Follow just your own way. Don’t give up, don’t give up
To return, to return to innocence.
Ami Farmer’s Chant – Return to Innocence – Enigma – Music Video
Deist – One who believes, based solely on reason, in a God who created the universe and then abandoned it, who assumes no control over life, who exerts no influence on natural phenomena, and who gives no supernatural revelation.
Destiny – The inevitable or necessary fate to which a particular person or thing is destined; one’s lot.
2. A predetermined course of events considered as something beyond human power or control:
3. The power or agency thought to predetermine events.
The made up word deist-iny to me means to return things or maintain things as they were originally created. To restore creation to one governed only by natural laws. To achieve a state of being unbound by any and all arbitrary laws of those who seek to rule over or to live off of others by means of artificial laws and order.
One night I was pulled over and the asshole insisted my car(which was my mothers bone stock Hyundia Tiburon) had a modified exhaust.He was such an idiot he was visibly angry about it.At first I tried to be nice and reason with him but that was out of the question.He was just not interested in hearing logic ,like why a 65 year old woman would have a modified exhaust.I even asked if it was to loud which he said it wasnt,so how is modified then?All he said was that he knew it was modified.I started to get really mad at this point but calmed down enough to tell him I am done arguing and to write me the ticket then.Of course he came back and told me he was giving me a big break and would give me a warning.Thanks Douchebag………………I HATE them all.
Ha! Funny (sad/those jerks) story, getch36.
Please, don’t hate them
Pity those assholes.
Like you would a retard, only they don’t have an excuse like a retard does.
…That’s just my take.
… Or maybe not? After all, The Moon is Down.
Hi Getcha,
Yup – been there/done that.
Had a restored ’64 Corvair (sold it a few years ago). No seat belts. Because they were not mandatory back in 1964. Just available.
Had a cop harass me about not wearing a a seat belt. I explained to him (hilarious, having to explain “the law” to a “law enforcement” officer) that the law is a vehicle is only required to have the mandatory “safety” equipment it came with from the factory. If a car did not originally come from the factory with seat belts (or high-back seats or air bags or a catalytic converter, – etc.) it is not required to have them. Period.
The low-IQ costumed flunkie issued me his owner’s demand I stand and deliver (that is, he handed me a “ticket”) and I had to waste several hours of my day in court beating it. If you exclude the hassle/time wasted – which of course I paid regardless.
@Eric. 64 1/2 Mustang or Corviar on Craigslist sold!. Even I wasn’t sure about that one.
Hey Eric here’s another one for you:
“Couple say seatbelt police handed out penalty to man who was checking wife’s bleeding wound”
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/local/dundee/couple-say-seatbelt-police-handed-out-penalty-to-man-who-was-checking-wife-s-bleeding-wound-1.134726?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed
Notice how they always go after the easy targets. What saddens me is the comments- typical clovers as you say.
Hi Charles,
Yup.
It takes a real “hero” to hassle other adults about wearing a seatbelt.
Where is a merely modified exhaust illegal?
What is a modified exhaust? One that’s made louder or one that has so much as a hanger that’s not OEM?
IIRC some localities do have “noise pollution” ordinances but (as in my area, which I can speak to) they’re not enforced because unless the cop has a decibel meter or some other way to gauge the noise, it’s not something that’ll stand up in court.
That said, they can bust you if you’ve cut off the catalytic converter (on a car that is emissions controlled) or the exhaust pipe doesn’t exit behind the rear axle, or the muffler (or tailpipe, etc.) is obviously falling off – or has fallen off…
Eric,
“I do have a chip on my shoulder – as you style it – for bullies and for arbitrary authority. For obnoxious laws that confect “offenses” out of thin air – “offenses” that have no victim… other than the poor soul being harassed, mulcted (or much worse).”
So stick to example of true bullies, not some cop who simply noted the law. You lose the argument when you cite such insignificant and trivial cases. And then your bullpen jumps in to loudly defend. It really sounds bad. (Though you are playing to the crowd, which may be your intended goal.)
Here is a truth: your battle is with the state.
Lenin couldn’t have been more correct when he termed the state a parasitic excrescence on a nation.
The cops you call bullies use the tools the state provides to them. And the state protects their actions, no matter how vile. The state is the real issue, not some beat cop giving advice.
That said, hears another little truth: even in a free society, some one has to take out the garbage (er, be a security officer). And trivial rules will exist when you step on the property of others.
A Youtuber I follow likes to state that no one can stop him from bearing arms — this he call a right. And he believes that his right to carry trumps the rights of a property owner. Talk about a bully.
I sense you hold similar views.
a little reason is correct. YOu’re all over the place. Just go back and reread what you wrote. You contradict yourself and then make judgements. In a free society, someone DOES have to be the security officer or at least the security person….and that’s everyone. Anyone with god like powers over others tends to be a god like power over them. It’s unavoidable. I have never called the cops. Think I have never had a problem? Believe me, I can take care of it…..and the cops too if they want to bully me. Everybody can do this….or should be able to do this. Man up, be your own boss and your own keeper. Oh yeah, you don’t have to call a cop, help your neighbor, don’t just be an observer. Think about it.
Eights,
You fancy yourself as the mythical man-as-an-island. Plays good here, I suppose. But you are wrong.
For example: Got money in the bank? You aren’t protecting it. You are dependent on an outside security force, which is currently the state-run police force.
Got hit by another driver? You didn’t demand they have insurance. And you probably used the police report to your favor.
And the “man-up” nonsense is overstated — over-the-top, so to speak.
Nonetheless, note a contradiction in my previous post. Stating one exists is much different than proving so.
Man, it seems like you’re on a high little horse, A_little_reason .
Sounds more like he’s high on a little horse.
Dear little reason,
You wrote:
“You are dependent on an outside security force, which is currently the state-run police force.”
I see that you’re attempting to hold that over Eight. But I believe he made abundantly clear that he never wanted it, never asked for it, and has done his level best to not avail himself of it.
As you yourself underscored:
“You are dependent on an outside security force, which is currently the state-run police force.”
And whose fault is that? The Leviathan State resorts to brute force coercion to unilaterally demand obedience to its “authority” and the payment protection money for its “services.”
If you don’t see that it is the Leviathan State that is “making offers others can’t refuse,” it is because you are choosing not to look at the ugly reality.
Was that “a little reason?” Or “little reason?”
I suggest a hard look at the glaring internal contradictions in your “logic” and trying again.
Mang, Bevin. You and Garysco articulated exactly what I was thinking.
Dear DS,
I was pretty sure nobody here subscribed the strawman positions that “little ability to reason” foisted on others.
a_little_reason….
“i post, therefore i exist.”
does virile knowmonia stalk these corridors? yes. yes it does. but that’s not an argument against manning up, per se. if bluster, or a pretended ability to foresee the future, the outcome of violent altercation in this case (odds of an outcome matching an “i will prevail” forecast are at least possible in the type 1 scenario, but vanishingly small in the type 2 scenario – except in screenplays), are part of the fuel-air ratio necessary for appropriate combustion to take place, its less than perfect, but so be it. i do think, however, it is important to recognize that is what is occurring…maybe let it be a situation specific heuristic/recipe that is purposely used/invoked, rather than a hoary occlusion that everything lenses through, all the time, thereby supplanting the user/invoker…& defaulting him into a circular cataract wagging the visual acuity…which is to say someone elses, or some others, “vision”…& right into the type 2 error. optimism, no matter etiology, or whether real or feigned or induced, can’t calculate any better than socialism.
division of labor, specialization, delegation – the modern economy (or any other kind of economy) – in no way displaces the fact that every man (person) is an island. thomas wolfe said it (“every man is an island”) – & its a plain fact: we’re born alone, we live alone, & we die alone. terror of that existential reality motivates all the pretzeling contortions people engage in to deny, & to “get through”. this is the intersection where a lot more manning up would do the species – & all the individuals grappling with it – good. but it hasn’t happened yet, & continuation of “men without chests”, (women, too) is the way to bet. “no man is an island”, john donne’s perspective*, is collectivist, as far from anarcho-cap as can be gotten. again, the way to bet: the dreary bell will keep on tolling. or, as i prefer, “more cowbell” (has it all: the bovine aspect, “don’t fear the reaper” – which everybody does, & thus & so, “immortality projects” {ernest becker} the world over, & last but far from least, laughs, huge ones…). if you deny this, then “you are wrong” – about you being a libertarian (which is someone who has not taken the logic of libertarianism to its ultimate conclusion, shed the chrysalis & emerged an anarchic butterfly. or gadfly. as the case may be…).
http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/730079/
as for “carrying”, a person does not become property, as in your apparent conception, when s/he occupies space on/in someone else’s property (this includes fetuses…), & so inalienable right to defense of one’s most important property, self, remains unimpaired. there are no rules, or laws, that trump this, ideally/correctly/truthfully; human/social “reality” is far from ideal or correct or truthful, always has been (despite bits of confirmation bias like, say a frozen patch of iceland’s history…)”, & “always will be” is, again, the way to bet. pushing it: the absurdity of procrustean “rules & laws” prohibiting lethal appendages (martial artists, leave your hands & feet at the border, please – or else) in designated places makes the prohibition of inanimate extensions of hands & feet, particularly weaker &/or less skilled ones, even more absurd. in real life, there are no marquess of queensberry rules of comportment when it comes to inalienable, inherent, inseparable, indivisible aspects of being a person (or even any other creature, none of which, smallest to largest, are in any doubt about the inherency of self-defense) …reversed engineered it could therefore accurately be said that people who supplant, or allow the supplanting, of the inherent with the diktats drooling from arbiters mouths are not people, or even just lesser animals, at all…which is where the duracell battery scene in “the matrix” fits.
*No man is an island,
Entire of itself,
Every man is a piece of the continent,
A part of the main.
If a clod be washed away by the sea,
Europe is the less.
As well as if a promontory were.
As well as if a manor of thy friend’s
Or of thine own were:
Any man’s death diminishes me,
Because I am involved in mankind,
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls;
It tolls for thee.
~ John Donne
in other words, f**k europe. and any other map pretending to displace the global territory, too.
Ozy, you had me at “fuck”.
The artful juxtaposition of John Donne and the vulgarity of fuck Europe; an epic conclusion to an epic rant…full of truthiness.
Thank you; a fine start to an evening’s reading, sir.
the x-rated dialog from “jerry maguire”…lol…thx, meth.
@little_reason – Try that again, I am as confused as 8 on what you are trying to say. You want the Lenin State held accountable for violating the individual, but not the beat cop or enforcer that does the violating? Why? Because he does not have an office in DC or make the law? Help me out here.
Dear “little reason”
“A Youtuber I follow likes to state that no one can stop him from bearing arms — this he call a right. And he believes that his right to carry trumps the rights of a property owner. Talk about a bully.
I sense you hold similar views.”
Well I guess if you “sense that someone holds similar views,” then they must hold those views, and are guilty as charged.
Do you even think about what you’re writing?
For the record, I’ve been hanging out here for a year or two. Nobody I know of here holds that view. I suggest your ask people what they believe in, instead of telling them what they believe in.
To the best of my knowledge, most people here hold the view that the private property owner establishes the rules on his property, based on Natural Rights Theory.
Example: I am a “person of color.” But being a free market anarchist, I uphold the right of private business owners to refuse to serve me in the event they are racially prejudiced. Their property rights trump my feelings.
The same principle holds true for Starbucks. If the proprietors wish to exclude open or concealed carry customers, it is their right. Of course it is also gun owners’ right to boycott them and exact a financial cost on them for doing so.
Life, liberty, and property are sacrosanct. They are natural rights that trump social engineers’ desire to impose their own values on others.
@Bevin – I see it the same way. If Starbucks wants to openly declare a “free fire zone” with a cash register and minimum wage employees inside that is their privilege, and I will never dispute their decision. But I am not forced by any official agency to go and spend my money there.
Dear Gary,
If Starbucks wants to openly declare a “free fire zone” with a cash register and minimum wage employees inside that is their privilege…
LOL!
@Bevin – I can’t help it. Ayn Rand really messed me up.
Dear Gary, DS,
Mention of shooting galleries brings back memories of the ones they used to have at carnivals, equipped with Winchester 1890 pump .22s chambered for .22 gallery shorts. Do they even have those anymore in the USSA?
Never mind, I forgot. They transformed public schools into shooting galleries. And now, Starbucks.
@Bevin – No no, Bass Pro Shops (where they sell guns, bullets, bows & arrows, fishing gear and other such man toys) still has them in their stores. Nirvana. Every time I go there I usually see a dad and his pre-teen there using them. Makes my day.
Bevin wrote, “at carnivals, equipped with Winchester 1890 pump .22s chambered for .22 gallery shorts. Do they even have those anymore in the USSA?”
You know, I’ve seen such on TV, but now that I think about it, I’ve Never seen one of those at Any carnival I’ve been to.
I feel robbed.
Dear DS,
“I feel robbed.”
You should. You have been! We all have.
The America we once loved is no more.
Dear Gary,
Oh, you mean the rifles?
If they still have them, that’s good.
I’ve bought outdoor clothing from Cabelas. Good store.
I was thinking more of the galleries.
@Bevin – galleries. No not in the sense of mainstream America on the pier at Santa Monica or Atlantic City. I If fear if someone tried they would be hounded down by the “peace Nazi’s” or the “women’s libbers” or.. well, pick your psych-out,-unicorn-candyland,- we should-understand-the-bad-guys group of suspend-your-child-for-pointing-a-pencil Ritalin-Prozac dispensers.
All of which are well funded by hundreds of NGO, media ….ah, I better stop now. Bevin, No I have not seen any.
I don’t know, Bevin, but the way Garysco described Bass Pro Shops, combine that with the high prices I saw when I went, it’s more like Bass Pro Shops is getting to be like a museum.
The stuff inside is getting to be out of reach for many.
…Anyway, what you wrote about carnival .22’s is ringing in my ears. All I can say is, That sucks.
Combine that with these other quotes I’ve been pondering, and … well, you know:
“But for all the churn and apparent prosperity, somebody has a big ass loan and nothing was really added to the economy.” – Ben Jones of TheHousingBubbleblog
“As a foreign friend who moved to the USA once pointed out, in the USA you make money by “taking a cut” and not by doing anything of real value.” – In Colorado @ TheHousingBubbleBlog
“as history has shown, todays sale at an inflated price is tomorrows default.” Housing Analyst @ TheHousingBubbleBlog
“Are you really that foolish to believe wages are going to double to meet grossly inflated housing prices. Of course not….. housing prices will crater 65% to meet wages….. interest rates will make it happen…… every.single.time.” Housing Analyst @ TheHousingBubbleBlog
Ha. Garysco wrote, “….ah, I better stop now.”
Que: First Shift.
…I’m outta here too.
And on my way out I’m thinking of the thread about the gooberment influencing the Net,… I wonder how many bloggers are in that camp? Lately I’ve read some stuff from some bloggers that i thought were in the Freedomista camp, and what they’ve been writing is straight up NWO full-time support. ..It’s like they have suddenly developed The Mindset of a Hero. A NWO phero.
Strange carnival games, that.
@Downshift – You, Beven and I are living in the time of the “Fourth Turning” http://www.fourthturning.com/.
Where the bankers usually start World Wars to clean up on the assets. We serfs are relegated to survival mode. It sucks having lived long enough to be aware of the matrix. Damn, I misplaced that bottle again.
Hey Gary,
I think you’re right about the “Fourth Turning.” Those who are currently in their 40s, give or take a few years, are in a particularly funky position. We’re old enough to be invested in the system as it is; but also young enough that we’re probably going to have deal with what’s coming – if we wish to live through it.
Among my personal choices for preparing has been to get in really good condition, physically. I’ve never been much out of shape – been lifting weights and running consistently/without serious pause since my teens. But until about six months ago, I focused mostly on power lifting, and got strong – working out with 225 lbs. on bench; maxing out somewhere around 305 – but also got heavy. It’s almost unavoidable. I hit 223 – which for me is pretty heavy. Had a gut.
I’m now refocused on fitness. Still lift, but not the heavy weights (I can’t anymore!) and am down to 194 lbs., almost my high school/college weight. I can run 6 miles without breathing hard. I’m doing hundreds of crunches – and my gut is gone. I have a four pack again!
If the SHTF, I’ll be better able to deal – and (hopefully) won’t be dependent on any of Big Pharma’s products for decades to come.
@Eric IMHO you are on the right path. Sharpen the mind too, it is your best friend. Use the system against itself (the law). Fortunately or unfortunately you are are aware more than most. The good news is it will end in its own time, unless the “powers” really do get their world-wide serfdom in place. Then all bets are off. molṑn labé baby.
Dear Gary,
So that’s a “No” right?
Dear DS,
I remember when surplus stores had Lee Enfields in .303 British on sale for, what was it, twenty bucks or so? Those days are long gone too.
Although I guess you can still get a Mosin Nagant 91-30 for just over a hundred smackeroos.
Dear Gary,
That info on the Fourth Turning was good!
Thanks for sharing.
@DS – See that is the problem. Ten years ago the plan was great until the dollar-fixed income thing hit. Not that I am whining, lots have it worse than me. Now they are making me feel like “OK officer, what did I do wrong, and what’s for lunch at the jail house?” Or play the Falling Down movie, which doesn’t sound good at all. At least the CIA isn’t out to remove their old trash. Came close, but never played that game.
“See that is the problem. Ten years ago the plan was…”
Ya, I know lots of guys who had ‘The Plan’ in mind.
Ha, now WFD.
(Not funny – Ha-Ha. The other kind.)
Now, for many of them, ‘The Plan’ is, work until they drop.
Sum fun that is.
RE: the Falling Down movie.
Interesting film that was.
Only, every time I see a reference to it I think of the song, London Bridge is Falling Down.
“OK officer, what did I do wrong, and what’s for lunch at the jail house?” – That’s one that might sick with me for awhile.
On the bright side, you/we’re not trying hard to get in to get medical coverage. … Hey! Is THAT why they came up with Obamacare? Well, I’ll be. I bet it is,… partly.
@DS – We will all be on the Affordable Death Wish medication plan before this one is over. That was the only reason the “big boys” put him in office. And you can have my best car if the Repubs do a damn thing about it. It eventually takes over the whole country just like the you-are-dead-in-the-water U.K. system. Hillary tried in the 90’s, flubbed it, and they had other plans until (2016) for her.
Godalmighty, Ed, meth, the first Reply button I found was over 3 days ago, a totally different thread. Thanks to both of you, esp. giving me a retailer Ed. I am sick and sick of it. When it first got me I had fever for over 2 weeks, and would cough to the point my tongue would come out and I’d do the old man gag. I freaked out. My wife would look at me sideways. I said after a couple days “My life is over, I am an OLD man”. I meant it at the time. Ed, I use a neti pot, have been for years but it hasn’t done crap for this. BTW, years ago Bill Sardi told me big Pharm and the govt. intended to off all us oldies as well as those who didn’t respond to cheap drugs. I had a script for erythromiacin since I can’t take penicillin. It had gone from $20/script to $132. I told ’em I wasn’t worth $132. I refuse to reward these a-holes. I ended up with cipro. Once again, thanks to you both.
Sitting Duck Zone, I call it.
They can have it. Stupid fuckers.
About those Mosin Nagants, Bevin.
I stopped at a store yesterday that always has plenty, and they always were about 100 bucks. Now they’re priced at two hundred Dollars.
Dear DS,
Re: Mosin Nagants.
200 bucks?
Yikes. Chalk it up to ongoing “QE” I guess.
“QE”, maybe?
And/or, whatever drives people to empty the ammo shelves.
I went to another store today, the Mosin’s there were $179.00
I thought this was interesting:
I listened briefly to the store manager explain to a middle aged man in a business suit (with his two antsy teenaged girls in tow) why the ammo shelves were just about empty, and why they had empty ammo cans where stacks of ammo used to be.
The middle aged man was listening very intently, he seemed genuinely surprised that he could not buy the ammo he wanted, it was clear that he was trying to understand.
“QE”, maybe?
And/or, whatever drives people to empty the ammo shelves.
I went to another store today, the Mosin’s there were $179.00
I thought this was interesting:
I listened briefly to the store manager explain to a middle aged man in a business suit (with his two antsy teenaged girls in tow) why the ammo shelves were just about empty, and why they had empty ammo cans where stacks of ammo used to be.
The middle aged man was listening very intently, he seemed genuinely surprised that he could not buy the ammo he wanted, it was clear that he was trying to understand.
Dear DS,
Hey, don’t stop there!
I want to hear the rest of it.
This sounds really interesting.
It was.
But I only caught bits and pieces of it and it’s kind of jumbled too much to make a good paragraph. I can’t do the scene justice.
The “sense” I felt from the conversation seems impossible for me to describe.
I just had this hunch at the time that this was happening in the unitedstate many times over, individual by individual.
That whole bit of, ‘men go insane in groups and regain their sanity one by one.’ …Or grasp a realization?
It was playing out before me.
At one point the middle aged man was talking on his cell phone asking about what ammo to try and (order? Look for?) in a kind of shocked manner. He was in the rifle ammo isle and acting surprised at what he found.
He asked his cellphone friend if the Red Army 7.62×39 in the $175 range pack was a good deal.
One of his girls was pushing an empty shopping cart, as if they expected to fill it up, but couldn’t. The middle aged man was oblivious to the girls as they walked here and there (and wanted to leave?) and got in my way.
I wandered over to the next isle, the pistol ammo isle, and another middle aged guy was looking at ammo while talking on his cellphone to someone in a manner that was quite a bit like the fellow in the rifle ammo isle.
I was like, “wow. These guys are having an ‘Ah-Ha!’ moment.” Or something like that.
They didn’t seem to be together.
I’m not a busy body, I was just looking, and being observant.
The manager told the first middle aged guy that the manager would buy as much as he could, if he could, but often he couldn’t. The manager said he would buy (I think he said) 30,000 rounds, and it all would be gone the next day.
The middle aged guy was listening Very intently. A sort of shocked disbelief…. he gestured and mentioned something about how these isles are “always” filled with ammo. What’s going on!?
The manager explained how manufacturers couldn’t keep pace with demand.
They just kept talking.
From what I gathered, asking all the right questions.
His daughters had nice tans (were wayy too young) and were wearing short-shorts, this affected my thinking so I averted my eyes and went to the clothing section and looked at leaf cammo.
I’m always taken aback whenever I go into the gun section anymore these days. All kinds of oddities occur.
It really bothers (kind of irritates?) me that many guys bring their women into that area. [It Never used to be that way. Not once.] Especially when the women are hot. I’ve read how their presence affects men’s concentration and stuff. …That’s certainly true.
It’s bad enough with all the options and prices before you, but to throw that it too?
…Anyway, I digress.
DS- OMG! A guy on a cell phone asking if 7.62 is OK?And something he needs? Shades of the Clueless movie, only with a tool that could hurt someone.
As to the girls. They probably won’t like the kick hurting their shoulder. But they may stick around for the calendar photo shoot.
Something I noticed in WalMart (cause I know you guys stopped going there) because the ammo case was completely empty for so long, WalMart started putting Air-Soft guns in the ammo case.
Even now, even though they have ‘some’ ammo, they still have the Air-Soft guns in the ammo case.
I wonder if that helps to freak out people that Air-Soft guns are dangerous and criminal?
A soccer mom sees that and says to herself, ‘Air-Soft guns, bad/dangerous/criminal.”? Followed by, “Brains! I need brains!”
Note: I hardly ever go there. I think the last time was, The Last Time.
DS – Wall Mart? I go there for cheap entertainment, grab a Micky D’s and to say hi to what used to be the greeter, but is now a security guard. Ah, the good old days.
But I am thinking the guy at the other end of the cell phone can’t be much smarter then the shopper.
Go to Wal Mart in my area and you will see nary one healthy-looking human being. Virtually everyone there is significantly overweight (30-plus pounds) and it is routine to see the morbidly obese (300-plus), often in those little carts, with their legs being larger diameter than I am. Slouchy, tired and bleak-looking.
It’s not a coincidence.
And I am not making fun of them. I feel for them. It depresses me immensely. I can remember when people who looked like this were the exception – not the rule.
Americans have become ugly. Like Soviet proles.
No coincidence there, either.
Huh. Now that you mention it, my Walmart no longer has ‘Greeters’.
I think it’s been, a year or so since I’ve seen one.
…Some after-retirement work plans have just been seriously blown to hell, I think.
DS – On the “grass is greener” side I just read that some un-gawdly number of the unemployed are now getting disability checks. Maybe the old boy got a pay raise. Sheee..t win’t be long now, will it?
Security guards at the WalMarts here don’t appear until well after Sundown.
Yeah, “Ah, the good old days.”
The times, they are a changing.
But you know, I never looked at a WalMart security guard and saw, The Mindset of a Hero.
They certainly aren’t WalMart Greeter caliber either.
DS- Just a wild guess here. But that 22 year old security guard is trying to keep his nose clean until he gets the real badge and gun job. Then the attitude training will begin…..
RE: disability checks. I read somewhere, being in that category, ‘they’ will use that to deny individuals their 2nd Amendment Rights.
Eventually.
As if it’s a game plan?
Wouldn’t surprise me.
Hit up every category of people from every angle, starting here and working backwards, or is that upwards?:
http://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2013/09/22/psychiatry-targets-college-students-for-destruction/
DS – They are targeting anyone on depression meds. Here in California they now have teams of Fed/locals that SWAT around to legal gun owners homes and take their stuff. Sometimes they even tell them why.
Totally off topic, but I am reading the (my) Kaiser Health Insurance flyer that came in the mail today. They want me to get one of their online paperless accounts so I can browse the site on all the ObamaCare changes, and so they won’t have to mail me the “nearly 300 page annual plan information…is about two pounds of paper that I won’t have to file away”. And, oh, by the way, they now have great benefits for their “trasgender individuals”. Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuk. The deserts of New Mexico are sounding really good lately.
Those SWAT teams sound exactly like what I was taught the Gestapo was.
Black cars and All.
Even now, it’s hard to believe that happens.
I’ve lived in Cali. I loved it there. The land, the climate, and some of the people.
There’s no way in Hell I’d go back.
RE: New Mexico. Reminds me of a scene from Easy Rider, where they’re sitting around a dinner table on a small homestead. The biker tells the landowner something like, “You’ve got it all.”
@DS – Us spoiled Californians have it all within a 4 hour drive, that’s for sure. But we are spoiled frogs in the pot these days. Kinda like the Jews in 1937 Germany.
I have been across the most damn beautiful desert between Flagstaff and Albuquerque. Painted colors on the mesas and so forth. But the area near Chama also impressed me on the way up to Colorado. I know nothing about the state, but I am going to start looking at it.
What are you waiting for?
A push?
Or a knock on the door?
Easier said, than done. I know.
Pardon me. I shouldn’t have said that out loud.
@DS – Honestly? Because I finally escaped the gravitational pull of So. Cal 4 years ago to my hi-die-hole in the Sierras near Yosemite. I can hear my neighbors dog bark 1/2 mile away in the winter, and Bambi and her kids bug me for apples.
You’re not some city slicker, then.
You’ve got something worth having.
Just like that guy with the spread and the family in Easy Rider.
Just like what eric has. …Only way worse laws.
Mang, that sucks.
It – Did – Not – Have – To – Be – Like – This.
And that’s the shame.
The theme song from COPS is playing in the background:
“Bad boys. Bad boys. Whatchya gonna do when they come for you?”
Dear DS,
Nice account of a mundane, everyday event that has remarkable and far reaching implications.
Had a sort of Tom Wolfe “Radical Chic” New Journalism tone to it.
Thanks, Bevin. I had to look up, Tom Wolfe “Radical Chic” New Journalism.
I didn’t know it was a technique.
I was just a guy in a gun store.
…One that sold items with pink on it to attract the fairer sex.
DS, what’s not to get? Guns, ammo, reloading supplies have been in extremely short supply since (let’s all say it in unison “Sandy Hooooook”). Supply and demand with ammo company start-ups every day. I see countless new companies I’d never heard of before at places like Cheaper Than Dirt, Brownell’s, etc. and more keep coming and will continue to do so due to high prices. WM is WM is WM has never actually been true. Go to one in Co. and then one on the Mexico border, not much cross-over products. I noticed many months ago WM’s in some states had virtually nothing gun and ammo-wise while my locals have rows of AR’s but still not a good selection of ammo since they really never did. Places like Academy have been doling out what ammo they get early every day of shipments and letting only so much per person. This keeps prices high and lots of customers have complained. Cabela’s has been a big gouger and treated their gun buying public badly. Screw ’em and BPro too, both too expensive.
eric, I’ve been fighting a bronchial/sinus infection for 6 weeks, had more than one antibiotic after going over a decade with NO ab’s of any sorts. I got pretty fat lying there drinking beer and whiskey for a broken leg the dog wouldn’t give me pain pills for because, in his words “the DEA doesn’t like for me to prescribe pain pills”. Yeah, doc, better get out of your field since you’re a specialist….asshole. Meanwhile another doc makes sure his patients(same field, same town, both orthopedic surgeons)don’t suffer since according to him(and conventional wisdom)you can’t heal without rest and you can’t rest if you hurt. Anyway, I’ve made several pharmacy trips and began to feel svelte already having lost some weight and seeing the people at Wally. I feel the same way you do, sorry for them. I want to scream at the ones in the electric carts “Get up and walk, you won’t get any better riding”. My wife has been crippled for years although she works and has just recently had knee replacement. She has never used one of those carts and even when she’s been in misery, only gives me a dirty look if I suggest she use one briefly. My renter, a guy 33 years old who has a construction company, brought some hands out, all guys in their thirties yesterday to transfer some bulk wheat to drills and they were gobby fat, made me feel like the thin man. I’m limping around busting ass and they’re standing there, gee.
@eightsouthman, re: persistent infection.
Guys, it is critical that we all take charge of our own health again.
Obamacare is designed to bankrupt you while it kills you, and ideally do so in a way that the two events coincide. Bleed you dry and dump the body.
8south–have you tried colloidal silver? It’s an absolute miracle–but Big Pharma is terrified of it because it can’t be patented. It’s more toxic to lower organisms than arsenic is to us, but it’s almost completely non-toxic to us. My wife had some intestinal amoeba for two weeks, tried two different antibiotics. I finally talked her into trying the silver–and she was fixed in two days.
We need to re-learn herbal medicine and naturopathy, FAST, to survive what’s coming.
8 & meth,
I had similar success w/ colloidal silver. I had a persistant(4 years) sinus infection that seemed impervious to antibiotics. I tried sinus irrigation with colloidal silver, flooding my sinuses with it while lying on my back and leaving it in for 10 minutes at a time. Within a week of doing this one or twice a day, the infection was gone and has never returned after 9 years.
It turns out that many chronic sinus infections are a combination of fungus and bacteria, which is why the antibiotics didn’t work. I got my colloidal silver from Purest Colloids.
BTW, I really hate this siteware. To respond to meth’s post, I had to scroll up to the last reply button. Fuckin’ WP sucks out loud for a fat man’s ass.
I am of course disappointed with Starbucks for reversing itself on the issue of open carry (my understanding is they have not forbidden open carry, much less CC, just no longer openly welcome either). This is, however, just one example of the New American Way of kowtowing to the fear-whine of a minority – often just a small handful of neurotics – who throw a hissy fit over something they’re not “comfortable” with, and management caves to their every demand.
Fuck ’em – and feed ’em fish heads.
Businesses need to man up. In the case of Starbucks, it’s pretty clear most of their their customers aren’t demanding that the stores be made “gun free” zones. There have been no problems I’m aware of with either open or CC – other than the fear-whine of the small chorus of neurotics who aren’t “comfortable.”
And the best way to make our feelings known is not to stop patronizing Starbucks. Not before we tell them why we’re going to be buying our coffee elsewhere. Not by letter. In person. If you are a regular (I am) next time you’re there, tell the manager – nicely:
Hey, you know me. I’ve been coming here for a long time; I enjoy the coffee, the service. But I believe strongly I have a right to be in a position to defend my life and the lives of my family in the event some maniac storms in here with a gun. Which is why I carry a gun. If Starbucks has a problem with my being able to defend myself with a legally possessed gun, then I have a problem with Starbucks. I hope you’ll convey that up the management chain…
@Agreed Eric. I think they did their market research after the last go around and economically determined where their bread is buttered, and acted accordingly. This is business bro.
eric, I have never quite understood the Starbucks thing except for a meeting place. I love gourmet coffee and that keeps me from buying over-priced, not that good tasting coffee in a paper cup. I fear I’d never drink coffee again if that’s the only way I could do so. Speaking of which, I think I’ll fix a cup right now….but I won’t be drinking from anything except my mug.
I know… I know!
Here’s the deal: Every Sunday morning, the wife and I go to the gym together. On the way home, back up the mountain, we pass a Starbucks. We stop for coffee and (for me) a sausage & egg biscuit. It’s a little ritual we have.
I plan to say something about the gun thing today.
@Eric – gently sympathize with them on being hung-out-to dry by the corporation for profit reasons. Bring a camera, because I want to see the deer-in-the-headlights look.
None of the Starbucks I go to have changed the way they view customers, armed or not. Their corporate policy seems to be only for mainstream media consumption.
My favorite Starbucks in my area has the little “smoke free environment” stickers on the outside tables, and I sit there, reading a book, having a latte` and smoking a 7×60 cigar, sometimes armed, sometimes not. Never once has any Starbucks employee confronted me over the smoking policy or mentioned my sidearm of lack of one. Maybe they like the way I tip.
BTW, to whomever it was that mentioned “minimum wage employees”, the manager at the Starbucks we frequent told my daughter the starting pay was $8/hr. and the average pay with tips (split from the pool of tip jars) was a little over $12/hr.
I like Starbucks.
Reason,
The definition of a bully is one who threatens others with implied violence. He does not necessarily have to beat you up. Just so you know that he can. And will – if you cross him.
“Simply noting the law” is exactly that. As I explained.
These pricks just love letting you know what “the law” is. Ever stop to think that if “the law” is absurd – or vicious – that anyone who chooses to go out of his way to make people “aware” of it (with the obvious implication that you’d better obey it) is a bully? What if the person inside the business the cop “noted the law” to told him to piss off and go away? What if the woman drove her car to work the next day?
You know good and well what would happen.
Yes, the state is a problem. But what is the state without willing minions who act as its enforcers?
It is nothing.
You then venture off into a preposterous straw man argument to impugn my ethics – a preposterous argument because there is no substance to it. Search these boards; peruse the thousands of articles I’ve written over the years. I challenge you to find an example of my asserting a right to violate another person’s property rights. I do not believe that I have a right to carry my firearm onto your property (or anyone else’s) or even to be on your property at all, if you do not wish to allow me on it.
So, please, stop it with the Cloveritic straw men. Stick with the things I’ve actually advocated or written.
Eric,
“The definition of a bully is one who threatens others with implied violence. He does not necessarily have to beat you up. Just so you know that he can. And will – if you cross him.”
Wouldn’t that be your neighbor on his property or the owner of some business you frequent? Seriously, do you throw such a fit when you witness the bouncer of a bar place his hand on someone’s shoulder while noting policies of the establishment?
I really don’t know how you and your crew function on a day-to-day basis given those glaring chips. But I would venture to claim (based on the attitude hear) that most would threaten the bouncer if his hand touched their shoulder while they were in the bar (property of someone else).
Even in a free society, someone holds a monopoly on violence in any given area.
The state is your neighbors who support this nonsense. It is also those who use its power to their advantage — cops, politicians, bureaucrats, some corporations, etc. It is not someone who simply provides advice, so to speak, and then leaves. Yet you impugn him and the boys here cheer.
Once again, stick to the real issues.
BTW: “Clover” may sound real neat in this sandbox, but resorting to such an empty, trite name in an argument doesn’t even rise to the level of sophmoric.
I see a little Silhouetto of a man…a little horse – Scaramouche – a little reason Fandango…
Most Annoying Singers Do Bohemian Rhapsody
Police Officer Dancing At 7-Eleven to Billy Jean by MJ
Farrokh Bulsara / Freddie Mercury / ફરોખ બલ્સારા, (1946 – 1991) was a British musician and lead singer of Queen from Zanzibar, Tanzania, Africa.
Vocal Improv Fred Merc
Freddie was a genius . . . I didn’t appreciate him as much, back in the day. But today, when I listen to his music, I’m just floored by the talent that dude had.
Excuse me?
How in the world do you pretzelize logic so?
In no way is a person acting in a bullying manner by expecting others to respect his rules on his property. You are free to not come onto his property – or leave – if you do not like his rules. But his rules only extend as far as the boundaries of his property. He is not aggressing against you; i.e., he is not pushing himself or his notions onto you. You are free to go your way, he his.
On your property, your rules.
Savvy?
So, if the owner of a restaurant or bar (or whatever) asks me to leave – for any reason at all – I am ethically bound to do so. He is free to set whatever “terms and conditions” he likes, to serve me – or not – for any reason at all.
It’s his place – not mine.
I respect that. But by the same token, I expect my “rules” to be respected equally when it comes to my property. The concept is called free association.
What any of this has to do with a bully cop, though, escapes me.
You’ve crossed the Rubicon into Cloverland.
Eric,
Come on now, Clover — and its variations — sounds like a Kindergarten taunt. At least go with philistine or renegade. No revolution was ever won with Clover as the epithet.
Let’s revisit the issue at hand: a woman recognizes the state and signs an affidavit stating she will only use her car in parades, etc. But that was a lie — a fraud. She intended to “beat the system,” so to speak. Then when advised that her use of the vehicle was outside the agreement she signed, the folks on the site go ballistic.
Look, if she — and the rest of you — wanted to man-up, you would simply drive without a license. Period.
In a free market, I assume this lady would also attempt to game the system — commit fraud against private entities (private owners of roads, etc.). It makes me wonder what she declared to her insurance company — a private entity — about her intended use of the car.
If this is your signature battle, you have lost sight of the issue.
By the way, it sounds like Eights would not respond so well to a bouncer’s threat. I may have gotten you wrong, but I think — with some certainty — that Eights would see the hand as an act of aggression, regardless the property line.
Once again, the cop at issue never threatened violence on his part. Never. He stated the agreement that the woman fraudulently signed. There are rogue cops. And there are those who support them. That should be your issue — unless you support your site by firing up the boys on nonissues.
I’m certain that both you and Eights would seek the cop in the event of a burglary on your property, just as you would seek an area-wide, monopolistic authority in a free market.
“Clover” is an archetype. See his posts. He is the apotheosis of the subjectivist, irrational, emotion-driven, control-freak mindset. It is a useful descriptive term, but without obscene connotation of, say, “asshole.” One can refer to “Clovers” in polite company. That’s why we use it. And why I will continue to do so.
You write:
“Let’s revisit the issue at hand: a woman recognizes the state and signs an affidavit stating she will only use her car in parades, etc. But that was a lie — a fraud.”
Italics added.
Please.
The state forces you to “sign the affidavit” – much in the same way that Luca Brasi got people to sign contracts. A contract signed or agreed to under duress is not valid as a principle of law – let alone ethics. There is no more sin in lying to or disobeying the state than there is in a POW trying escape prison.
“Man up.”
When the fight is remotely fair, when my opponent is not a costumed/badged thug who has the backing of legions of costumed and badged thugs, none of whom I may legally lay a hand on even in self-defense – then I will adopt more direct tactics.
“Game the system.”
Again, your premise, your straw man, is that the system – and enforcement – are legitimate. They are not.
You seem to believe that when a group of people announce “we’re the government” you must obey the edicts they trot out – and that to disobey or evade amounts to a moral-ethical wrong. I cannot think of a more Cloveritic point-of-view than that.
Finally:
“Once again, the cop at issue never threatened violence on his part. ”
Everything a cop does implies the threat of violence. What happens if you ignore him? Refuse to do as he “suggests”? The cop was issuing a threat. It amounted to: You are not allowed to drive your car to work with Antique tags. It is illegal.
And that he would enforce the law if he sees her driving it to work again. Better take the hint, lady. (And regards himself as “nice” for having merely “warned” – that is, threatened – her).
You know it as well as I.
“I’m certain that both you and Eights would seek the cop in the event of a burglary on your property.”
And you’d be certainly wrong.
I know perfectly well that cops are useless to me as far as doing anything to prevent a robbery of my home or an assault upon my person. We live in a very rural area, 15 miles from the cop shop. The situation would be over by the time the cops arrived. I depend on me – and several choice firearms, that are never more than an arm’s length away.
reason, just to clarify, I abide by the rules of a bar. The only problem I ever had with a bouncer was personal and has nothing to do with abiding by any rule. I sought the sheriff’s dept one time in my life over an attempted burglary to simply cover my own ass and give them a backhand warning since it was a dept. sheriff trying to break in. It was a 50/50 situation I still don’t know for sure how to handle even now. I believe message was received although they’re fairly dense. I suppose I could go without a license and that would last until, oh, about next week. Now if I didn’t have a commercial license, I might go without one….and that might eventually happen. As far as someone holding a monopoly on violence in a free society, I”m not sure how that would work. Come to my house, initiate violence and find out if you have a monopoly. I’d suspect you’d want to rethink that.
Dear Eric,
Like I said Eric, “little ability to reason.”
When someone just doesn’t get it, they really don’t get it.
Mr. little ability to reason appears to actually believe that his position is logically unassailable. But I suspect he is dimly aware of what’s actually going on underneath the veneer of “legitimacy.”
I’d take Mr. little ability to reason by the hand and lead him, step by baby step, through the arguments why conventional monopolistic government is intrinsically coercive and therefore immoral, but not today.
My ass is too tired. Another day, maybe.
Morning, Bevin!
In re: “I’d take Mr. little ability to reason by the hand and lead him, step by baby step, through the arguments why conventional monopolistic government is intrinsically coercive and therefore immoral, but not today. My ass is too tired.”
Triple ditto.
I’m sure y’all have noticed that this turd is a libertardian shill. He doesn’t actually think he’s a libertarian, he thinks that we think he’s a libertarian. There’s no hope for such a ninny.
“I saw you.
I saw you see me
I saw you see me see you
I saw you see me see you see me.”
And on it goes…….
Dear Ed,
I reckon you’re right.
I tend to give people too much benefit of the doubt.
Mr. little ability to reason is probably a stand in for the earlier “clovers” (oops, we’re not allowed to use the term anymore) whose tactics bombed.
The thing that these paid shills don’t get is that enhanced debating skills cannot “turn the tide.”
Short of kidnapping everyone and subjecting them to Monarch Programming, there is simply no getting around REALITY.
The reality is that “government = coercion,” and coercion is wrong and intolerable, period.
Bevin, I tend to give too little benefit of the doubt, I suppose. Still, this guy’s posting style is distinctive and when he starts up with a new name, I either ignore him or hand him a short, nasty flame.
What this asshole is doing, whether or not he means to, is to spoil everyone else’s enjoyment of discussing the topic. I can’t imagine anyone doing that except for pay, unless there are nutjobs who jack off while posting inane comments. Maybe this turd is one of that kind, and that’s all the doubt I’ll allow to his benefit.
There are some real perverts out there, y’know. 😉
Dear Ed,
Naw. You probably made the right call.
My guard was down. The shills have been away for a while, and I forgot to be “eternally vigilant.”
Besides, it’s better to err on the side of caution.
This clown with little ability to reason is in all likelihood a paid Maxarchist shill posing as a “Minarchist who sincerely believes Anarchism is too extreme.” It’s his cover.
His approach, probably strategized in advance in some federal government office conference room, is to discredit uncompromising champions of individual liberty as “nutjob extremists.”
It’s probably intended to dissuade potential converts to hardcore libertarianism from gravitating in our direction.
Dear Eric,
LOL.
Wouldn’t that be your neighbor on his property or the owner of some business you frequent? Seriously, do you throw such a fit when you witness the bouncer of a bar place his hand on someone’s shoulder while noting policies of the establishment?
Seriously? Are you kidding?
Stop and read what you just wrote, carefully. I think you’ll soon be begging Eric to delete it, as it makes you look inexcusably ridiculous.
Dear lib,
Like I said, trollers attempting to sabotage libertarian websites may think they are “putting one over” on us.
But as an old Chinese expression puts it,
Lao tien you yan
“Heaven has eyes”
When enemies of liberty talk up a storm trolling us, they put themselves on record.
When we let them prevaricate to their heart’s content, we supply them with the rope by which they eventully hang themselves in the Court of Public Opinion.
I’m a person who never succumbed to having a “vanity” license plate in California, partly because I felt it was a waste of an extra $50 or whatever it costs to have a plate with some clever combination of letters or perhaps my initials, and partly because I viewed it as asking for “fancier” or “uniquely decorated” manacles attached to my slave-chains.
But this discussion about “historical vehicle” plates and the laws regarding them led me to see what the rules were in California, the state where I live. I used to believe that those plates were for cars that somehow could not be driven on the road normally, due to lack of power or other safety/registration issue, that they were a special exception to the state’s control of what vehicles were allowed on the roads. One could not normally drive a tractor on the Interstate, as an example, or a combine, so I figured “antique” or “historical” vehicles might be in that same category. (I am not attempting to argue the validity or invalidity of limiting what kinds of vehicles can go on the road, which would be a different discussion, but simply attempting to understand what the situation is as it now stands currently in the statist world we are living in.)
Surprisingly, it ends up that in California, at least, excepting out of the mix some unique categories such as cars manufactured in 1922 or earlier, or cars manufactured prior to 1965 with 16 cylinders or more (WERE there such a thing?–Eric, if you haven’t written one already, an article about cars with 16 cylinders manufactured prior to 1965 would be pretty fascinating, I would think), vehicles manufactured after 1922 that are at least 25 years old, and are COLLECTIBLES, can obtain a Historical Vehicle license plate. And a Historical Vehicle license plate is ONLY for use on cars used for exhibitions and car club meetings. So what that says to me is that such a license plate on a car used for something else (such as a daily driver to work), “legally” has no license plate at all, which is probably the point of view of the cop who harassed the woman who had a car with that kind of license plate parked at work in Virginia (if Virginia law is similar to action to California law).
I also see that my own car, based on its age alone (it is 21 years old) is not too far away from “qualifying” for such a license. And, I suppose, if I wanted to, could arguably qualify on “historical value” (it was the last model year Cadillac Sixty Special ever manufactured), although honestly I don’t think it is really all that much of “interest”. My point here is that there are certainly quite a few Cadillacs driving on the road that are way older than mine, and in my view, mine is in great shape so that its (and their) age is no detriment to its safe driving on American highways and byways. In other words, there is absolutely no reason whatsoever for any state authority to limit the use of these cars (as the law now currently stands), but then, they all have normal, every day, typical license plates.
It seems to me that the woman with the Morris Minor doesn’t HAVE to have the historical value plate on her car, but simply wants to–it becomes, really, a variation of the extra-cost vanity plate. She most likely could put on it an ordinary Virginia license plate and drive that car wherever and whenever she pleased. It is terrible that she would HAVE to…and I think here is where you have argued that the cop was a petty tyrant, because he would probably know that there was no reason her car couldn’t be driven the way she was driving it except for statist registration laws.
Personally, I think it is cool that she is driving a car like this and if I saw her on the road, I would lower my window and tell her how much I loved seeing her, which is something I do when I see other cool cars on the road. I genuinely do admire it and am not shy in expressing that admiration. On the other hand, I think there are quite a few people in our society who are envious and want special cars off the road, since in contrast, it makes them feel inferior.
A very much “clover” reaction (if I am applying the concept right), or at least, indoctrinated not by statism but by corporate consumerism, are all those people I have to deal with who can’t stand the fact that I am driving a car that is 21 years old. They can’t BELIEVE that I don’t get a new car every two years. But I like that car, I think it is beautiful and roomy and relatively powerful, and I have no car payment! Sure, I have repair bills from time to time , but still much cheaper than car payments. And I have already had the engine and the transmission rebuilt, so I think I’m good to go for at least another hundred thousand miles. But all the people who decry that, it really amazes me. Such as a co-worker who asked me, “Did you DRIVE to Las Vegas?” “Yes, it’s only four hours a way.” “IN THAT THING?” Or the another co-worker, many years ago, who came up to me all excited in the parking lot, “Did you know that you could sell that car under the ‘Cash For Clunkers’ program?” like that was something I would ever want to do. The car’s practically in mint condition. If she thinks it’s a clunker, then she is as stupid as she is ugly. Actually, she is both stupid and ugly anyway.
@tomoz – My 2 cents-
* Is the Minor owner skirting the law by not paying her “full” tribute to the state? Most likely.
* Should the cop write the lady a ticket for the plate tax violation in her office? Not legally, because the vehicle was on private property and not seen by the officer moving along a state highway. Merely being present in a parking lot is not a citeable violation of the law.
* Could the cop write a ticket because he is a dick? Sure he could, but he would have to list the place of violation on the citation. Unless he lied, and put it on the street, he has a problem documenting the all the elements of the”crime”.
So there is only one conclusion I come to. He decided to scare the owner and let her know she has been caught. And probably pad his daily work log with an entry. All this even though he could not legally cite her for the violation.
So , at least to me, that leaves three words – “official harassment” and “laziness”.
tomoz, a ’92 Caddy? Really? I”m all over it. Although I found a body for my ’93 GM diesel pickup it wasn’t a diesel cab, so no wiring harness, dash lights, steering column wiring etc. so I’m still looking. Like you, I don’t want a newer pickup. In fact, a ’93 is the newest acceptable pickup for me. They had computers after that and Blackie has only a big empty well where the computer would be on later models. the 92-93 GM diesel are known for reliability and the 94 and up are known for “electronic” problems including their lift pumps and computer controlled fuel pumps.
I’m all over a ’92 Caddy, no joke. Presently, I have been looking for a ’92-92 Buick Roadmaster station wagon. I found a ’96 special limited Edition in great shape several years ago and wonder if I was having mental problems or what in not buying it. These cars have an LT-engine as well as every whistle and bell including a factory Bose sound system that are outstanding. I’m familiar with your model Caddy too as a friend had one he used for everything including a farm car. He cruised the turnrows and hauled cottonseed if necessary in it. It would poke a serious hole in the wind too. It got good fuel mileage, was roomy as hell, comfortable, powerful….what more could you want? I’m all over 20 year old GM vehicles. You work with idiots….but I’m sure you know that.
Eightsouthman–I appreciate what you said about the good gas mileage (well, for a big car with a V-8!) which really surprises some people. Traveling 70 mph with the cruise control on I-5 between Southern and Northern California, or on 1-15 to Las Vegas, I honestly get between 25 and 30 miles per gallon. No, gas mileage-wise it’s not a Prius, but then by so many other measurements, a Prius isn’t a Cadillac!
And you are so right–I definitely do work with idiots, and, unfortunately, they continue to demonstrate that day by day.
Every time you guys mention a Prius I think about this woman I know who has one. She ran it out of gas. She had to have it towed to a dealership to have it reset in order to operate it further.
She asked them to show her the button they pushed so the next time she ran out of gas she didn’t have to get it towed.
They wouldn’t.
Tomaz, I love those “Sixty Specials”. You’ve got a great old car there. That would be a blast to drive to Vegas in, at night with the cruise control set and the stereo wailing. I had a ’94 DeVille that I loved. Currently, my spare is a ’92 Deville. She’s a great old gal, indeed.
Ed, I’d try to talk you out of that car is it was a SW car. I love the things. Can you say “long legged”? perfect Tx. car.
Ed–you’ve got me down to a “T”! Cruise control set, stereo wailing. The car acts like a dog I used to own–the dog LOVED to ride in the car, and the car simply LOVES to ride!
Hi Tomoz,
In Virginia, the benefit of having an “Antique” tag is you no longer have to allow some dick with an airgun and greasy overalls to paw a car you’ve spent perhaps years and many thousands of dollars restoring. No more annual state “safety” inspection. Exempt from emissions testing. Not to mention, you no longer have to pay the obnoxious annual $60 “renewal.”
It’s a way to end-run all the above – which some people take issue with. But me? I see it as a magnificent thing – because I oppose such things as having to hand over my car to a dick with an airgun and greasy overalls. I take excellent care of my vehicles and have no need for some guy to tell me my brakes and tires and so on are ok. I know they are ok. Do some other people not take care of their vehicles? Certainly. Just as some other people use firearms irresponsibly and even criminally. Hold them accountable for any harm they cause – but leave me the hell out of it!
Particulars: This woman (I know her) lives literally three miles down the road (a country road, virtually no traffic) from the place where she works. The cop knows this (he knew her address when he checked the plate). He knew she wasn’t driving from here to New York or some such (even though that would be ok with me). He was simply conjuring his inner Inspector Javert – making sure she knew “the law” – and that he was prepared to enforce it.
eric, I have my inspection done by a guy who doesn’t drive my truck. He knows the only thing he could accomplish would be to piss me off. He doesn’t even get in it. I do all the light crap while he observes. He KNOWS my truck is perfect. The last time somebody drove it, it had shop crap on the floor mat, dirty hands on the steering wheel, something nasty on the seat, some little piece of something broken because the guy stabbed the brakes and being the diesel it is, it stopped instantly, way faster than he could anticipate, and the interior smelled like old cigarette smoke and parts washer. I guess the people who dream up this shit are accustomed to driving state supplied cars and are discerning as CJ was last evening after he’s rolled in something dead and then delighted everybody in the house with his presence. I must be the only diesel guy on the forum. Nobody else ever complains about car and gas pickup drivers stabbing their brakes like there’s no tomorrow. I hope my car inspector lives longer than I do.
@8 – LMAO
Garysco, a friend and I go fishing. It’s rough when loading the boat so I have him drive my pickup while I stand in the center of the boat to make sure it loads evenly. I’m holding on to the top of the windshield and my friend, who drives a gas pickup with their poor brakes, hits my brakes hard stopping instantly and the top of the drivers side windshield snaps off in my hand…..thanks. So he goes to pull out a little more. I have hold of the other windshield. He stabs the brakes, the other windshield snaps in my hand, thanks again. Now the first time I could maybe see it but he knows diesels stop Right Now and the second time is simply disgusting. Then he gets out at the top of the ramp and say Damn, old Blackie sure stops fast. No shit, both times. Then he says I never had to touch the throttle and I said And you didn’t have to do more than touch the brake either.
Thank goodness they stopped doing that inspection madness in my state in the 1980’s.
It’s creepy, and I don’t think I could put up with it now like I did when I was a teenager.
I used to want to leave the state I’m in, but the more and more I read about other places, it appears that I may just be in the free’est state in the unitedstate.
Eric–Ah ha, this basically takes it out of the purview of those “officials” who know very little about something but feel that they should have total control over it. It allows for the establishment of something “exempt” from their normal plebian rules, so I can see how that is a good thing.
It kind of reminds me of how my father, who actually really was a “rocket scientist”, was always getting into battles with building inspectors over things like what was “code” whenever he would build stuff for their house. Throughout his working life, Dad always maintained four different professional engineering licenses–industrial, structural, mechanical, and nuclear (he had a masters degree in nuclear engineering from M.I.T.). He also held patents on things as diverse as satellite solar cell power arrays and off-shore oil-drilling platforms. All this means that he knew how to design and build factories, structures like towers and bridges, engines, rockets, and power systems. So it was funny to have a building inspector not “approve” common day-to-day things that Dad would do at home, such as various plumbing or electrical work, or the use of unusual materials.
I remember my father always stressing the strength of diagonal forces, and he provided a good example of that when he was adding on a new section of the house (when I say “he”, I mean “he”, not people that he hired–he dug the foundations and poured the concrete and did the plumbing and electrical work, and the carpentry, and the flooring, and was the glazier and the roofer, etc.). The walls were redwood (like the rest of the house) and he made them three layers thick. For the interior layer, all the planks were vertical, and for the exterior layer, they were horizontal. In the middle he put the planks in at a 45-degree angle.
The approved blueprints showed the wood horizontal, which was the exterior side. There was a book of permits that needed to be signed after each step of the process, so the building inspector trundled on by to do an inspection and what he saw were vertical boards. “Why are these vertical, when the plan shows them to horizontal?”
“Oh,” explained Dad, “the horizontal is just the external facing…see, matches the rest of the house. That will come later.” The inspector shrugged and signed off on that phase of the structure.
After a while, Dad then set to work on nailing up the “diagonal wall”. The inspector came back around, expecting to see by now the horizontal boards going up. But instead, he sees Dad nailing them in a diagonal. “What the hell are you doing?”
Dad patiently explained the amazing strength of cross-bracing and said, “You WILL see this covered up by the horizontal boards at the end.” But this was all just too much for the building inspector. He had never seen anyone build the walls of a house this way, but, fortunately, had realization enough to realize that HE was out of his league. Right then and there, he simply signed off on every single permit in the book, saying, “Hell, you know more about what you are doing than I will ever know, so here you go, and good luck!” Now that’s a county official like they ought to be!
“Now that’s a county official like they ought to be!”
My first reaction was, “No, shit.”
On second thought, no way! He’s just like the inspector I saw in a documentary about life in China.
A business owner had a tree outside his front door that needed water.
The inspector said, “You’ll be in lots of trouble for this!”
I could imagine that same Chinese inspector saying, “Why are these vertical, when the plan shows them to horizontal?”
Interesting story though.
“four different professional engineering licenses” – That’s impressive. The knowledge part, not the license part.
@tomoz – Your dad could actually think, and that scared the lad.
Reminds me of an article Ayn Rand wrote. She said that “building codes” guaranteed the building industry would stagnate, without innovations, because the contractors would always “build to code” and no more that that. No matter how stupid the rule.
“because the contractors would always “build to code” and no more that that. No matter how stupid the rule.”
You got That right!
I’ve seen children argue about the rules to Yugio.
I’ve seen adults argue about ‘code’.
I couldn’t tell which was which.
Morning, Tomoz!
This statement:
““Hell, you know more about what you are doing than I will ever know, so here you go, and good luck!” Now that’s a county official like they ought to be!”
Reminds me of the America I grew up in. It’s gone now.
As is the saying, “It’s a free country.”
The idea that one must obtain permission from a government official to build/modify one’s own property is so ferociously tyrannical yet people – most of them – not only accept the idea, they actively support it.
Dear Eric,
“The idea that one must obtain permission from a government official to build/modify one’s own property is so ferociously tyrannical yet people – most of them – not only accept the idea, they actively support it.”
This is among the key reasons I finally quit architecture in disgust — the concept of “building permits.” The constant need to kowtow to utterly irrational requirements at gunpoint.
Many sheeple have noticed their own steadily eroded individual liberty in these areas, especially left liberal Naderite Nanny State “civil libertarians.” They never seem capable of connecting the dots with their own demands for “safety,” “public safety,” and “consumer safety.”
Right conservative Big Government Warfare State advocates are of course equally responsible for the net erosion of freedom, but in different areas of our lives, e.g., the “War on Some Drugs.”
A free society would not be chaotic and dangerous. Private means of safety certification would fulfill the alleged goals of “safety” far better without the loss of our liberty.
Bevin, look at this:
http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com/2011/01/alternative-economics.html
You may have seen it already, but anyway…….
My father & his were both master carpenters. My dad worked forty odd years in the trade; His work was well known & respected. My folks moved a house in 1961 and tripled its size. It took a long time and the permit lapsed.
Years later, after my dad died, my mom found she needed a certificate of occupancy to get an improvement loan.. She went to the inspection office and was shuffled from pillar to post, with no one having the authority or the courage to sign off on it.
Finally, she ended up in the chief inspector’s office. He recognized the name on the form and had a few questions.
“Are you related to Harold Frain?”
“Yes, sir, he was my husband.”
“Did Harold Frain do the work on the house?”
“Yes, sir. He did.”
Hearing that, he signed off on the certificate and she was good to go.
Like your dad, he had a lot of knowledge and skill, and was respected for it. Quality speaks for itself.
Those who think Eric is belligerent unnecessarily or exaggerating, may I politely suggest you simply “cool your jets” and do some research. The situation with police has escalated. I will agree some simply want an easy job and therefore concern them self unduly with ever so minor situations. Over the last couple of decades a different type of police has evolved and they are not here for peace keeping. There are many now who have a thug mentality and unnecessarily escalate any situation they can. Thanks to Eric and others for their early warnings of this growing problem.
Thanks for the back-up, Lynn!
Welcome to the site, too – it’s good to have you with us!
The wife and I were returning home from dinner at Outback. It was about 7 pm, already dark. I was driving. I came to a rolling-stop at a stop sign on a T intersection. I could see a quarter-mile in either direction. I turned right.
On a road angled into the main road that I turned onto was a police car hidden in the shadows. As soon as I passed the cop car got behind me, turned on the lights and I pulled over to the curb. Two officers with guns on their hips got out. One walked to my wife’s side of the car, hand on his gun and the other, also hand on his gun, to my side of the car.
In a surly manner they asked why I ran the stop sign. I responded that we often came this way and that I had looked both ways before entering the road I just hadn’t come to a complete stop. My wife, terrified, clutched my arm. “So,” Cop #1 said, “you run this stop sign every time you come this way?”
I’m thinking, why aren’t these cops doing something real like chasing rapists or burglars or murderers instead of harassing me? How long had they been waiting, burning gas, for some innocent person to come along so that they could ‘make the cop’s day’ by getting to harass them?
I and my wife were at their mercy. They could’ve robbed or murdered us and no one would be the wiser. It was a lonely road, not another car came along during this encounter.
They’re main job wasn’t to protect me or anyone else. Their main job was to collect a tax for what they considered my mis-behavior, common sense be damned. With hands on their guns they were daring me or my wife to make what they might consider a false move.
Jeeeeeze….I gotta quit coming here. These comments are perhaps some of the best reading going and I try and read as many as possible. But all this…..political entertainment that I wholeheartedly agree with from (some) people that are oodles of times more intelligent than myself. The time keeps a marching and there seems to be more & more comments all worthy of reading & thought every time Eric posts more interesting items that contain that….4 wheeled (or maybe more or even less) take on things. This is a GREAT website because I love cars too and these comments are the proverbial icing on the cake, at least for me. Keep em coming!!
Thanks, Silverado – and, good to have you with us!
This just has to be said, y’all. When I moved to Virginia, my old hobby car was a ’62 Plymouth hardtop. I checked into getting antique plates purely because I had seen a few that had the year of manufacture on them, and thought that would be cool.
The restrictions made me change my mind, though the DMV clerk said something like “well, you’ll save this much money per year on registration”. I thought, well shit. If I was broke enough for that to seem like a good deal, I’d sell the fucking ’62. About 12 years later when I did sell the ’62, it had regular Virginia plates on it.
Eric,
I don’t understand the origin of the chip on your shoulder — but you should recognize that you have one.
If I read your post correctly, the cop only stated the law, and wrote no official warning. That is not a threat of any kind — in fact, it sounds like kindly advice.
County cops in my area will knock on the door of a house when they see the garage door left open at night. They advise the owner of recent thefts and go on their way. That is also not a threat — it’s simply kindly advice.
Think of it this way: The cop in the parking lot was warning the driver that a rogue cop will pull her over and issue a ticket, maybe even looking for some action to escalate the situation. If that particular cop was rogue, he would have made an issue there and then. The cops in my county are also warning about the potential results from rogue neighbors, etc, seeing a garage door open.
There are real instances — growing numbers, in fact — of police stepping over the lines, with their illegal actions fully protected by the state. Report on those.
Letting a chip on your shoulder guide you does nothing for the liberty movement.
The last warning I got from a cop is the reason I run a video camera when driving now. This guy was so angry that I “made a face” when he turned left in front of me and forced me to stop when I had the green signal that I didn’t know if I would get out of that traffic stop in one piece. He wrote the warning for ‘failure to yield’. Of course I had yielded and didn’t have to. Cop was on his cell phone and not paying attention to the task at hand and failed to yield to me. Now what does this have to do with anything…. it’s the worst of the warnings I’ve gotten from cops. Implicit in these warnings was that I had to defer to these cops or else. One became a warning instead of a ticket because I told the cop I was trying to ‘get out of his way’.
I’ve had cops warn me that my lack of submissiveness on a bicycle might result in a random driver killing me. Never once did I have a cop warn me that getting pulled over by some other cop might do the same. Nor was I ever warned some other cop may not be so generous.
Thus IME, there really isn’t a friendly warning. Each one has had adversarial overtones. So long as I became submissive they’d let it go.
As to the topic at hand, the car was parked so there was no way the cop could prove any violation of the antique plate limitations. He could assume it was there for general everyday driving but he doesn’t know. Like I wrote earlier all she has to say is she drove it there to have someone she works with to look at a problem or look at the car to perhaps buy it or any number of other outs there are that make that one trip to work legitimate under the law.
The cop assumed she was just a law breaker rather than giving the car some needed exercise. Which is permissible under the law as well. It doesn’t say you can’t go somewhere in the process. You just can’t do it everyday. Basically the cop would need to watch for a week and see if she drove that car every day or at least frequently. Once a month probably won’t get a conviction with any reasonable people.
On another note, the state of VA are real assholes about antique plates:
“Violations of the antique vehicle rules are Class 4 misdemeanors under Virginia Code Section 46.2-730 and will result in the revocation of your antique or permanent vintage license plates for a period of five years from the date DMV is notified of your conviction.”
“There are real instances — growing numbers, in fact — of police stepping over the lines, with their illegal actions fully protected by the state. Report on those.”
He does, all the time. Maybe YOU need to recognize that you have a stick up your ass, when you come on somebody’s website and judge their writing based on one article. You may also need to recognize that you have a huge mancrush on cops.
Letting your desire to slob a cop’s knob guide you does nothing for the liberty movement.
Hi Reason,
I do have a chip on my shoulder – as you style it – for bullies and for arbitrary authority. For obnoxious laws that confect “offenses” out of thin air – “offenses” that have no victim… other than the poor soul being harassed, mulcted (or much worse).
On the rest: Others have already observed that when a cop makes a “suggestion,” it is always suffused with the threat of implied violence. Like a mafiosi advising a store owner to be careful because his windows might get broken.
No one here – not me, certainly – has even a feather on his shoulder when it comes to apprehending and bringing to account people who harm others, take (or damage) their property – and so on. But that is not what we’re talking about, right?
” Like a mafiosi advising a store owner to be careful because his windows might get broken.”
Ahaha, that reminded me of the dimbulb extortionist in “The Gang That Couldn’t Shoot Straight” who thought he was being smooth when he told the store owner “You could be dead in a bomb accident”.
Kindly advice….someone protect me from “kindly advice”. I’ve had about all I can stand. Hey Pot Liquor, the war on drugs and dWI are the big money makers everywhere. Why would search and seizure laws have become so draconian? They can make millions on one bust……duh.
When I read this: “County cops in my area will knock on the door of a house when they see the garage door left open at night. They advise the owner of recent thefts and go on their way. ” I thought of the thieving no-good jerks I know that became cops. If you ask me, odds are those cops knocking on that door didn’t want anyone to be home so they could take what they wanted.
Or, they were taking the opportunity to look for things like underaged parties, or adults doing things the state finds objectionable.
I’d bet the odds are great that the cops in that instance were simply using the open garage door as an excuse to troll.
Ditto that.
If they’re not invited, they’re not wanted.
Private property. It’s a concept all-too-many neither comprehend nor respect.
This story brings to mind a story I remember when living in Vermont.
There is a mountainous town , in that state,named Bridgewater -located on Rte 4 – am major East to West artery. At least 20 hrs a day there is Windsor County Sherriff car sitting right where the spped changes from 40 to 25 – waiting to hand you a ticket for even so much as 5 miles an hour over the limit. The economically depressed town has made so much money, over the years, from the tickets handed out that they now unashamedly rely on the ticket revenue for their annual operating budget.
Simultaneously, a few years ago there was a creepy homeless vagrant running around that town causing mischief and mayhem. Every resident in town knew about him – his presence had been felt for over a year. The fat lard asses sitting in their cruisers on Rte 4 were no exception – they also knew. Was any effort made to go after this creepy POS – no!. Needless to say the story ends badly. Finally one day in broad daylight the vagrant creep broke into the home of a 90 year old woman – a mere quarter of a mile from where the costumed cretins sit – and killed her while ransacking her home. So much for “protect and serve” . Outside of this poor women’s loss of life the biggest tragedy is that not one person in that town was outraged that the fuckin useless sherriffs dept never once arrested the creepy killer for past breaking/entering/lurking activities. Nope ” We have more important things to do – like ticket out of staters for going 30 in a 25 “
Amen, Mike.
Unfortunately, that sort of story is far from unusual these days….
Dear Mike,
“People constantly speak of ‘the government’ doing this or that, as they might speak of God doing it. But the government is really nothing but a group of men, and usually they are very inferior men. They may have some better man working for them, but they themselves are seldom worthy of any respect.”
–H.L. Mencken
Very inferior men indeed.
Good article but stop fucking with my Dobermans. I live with 3 of them them and they are the best dogs in the world. You should have said junk yard dogs-dimwit!
Fair enough, WW – point taken!
WWR, I have raised a few Dobs, known some others who have too. Been around lots of Dobs, had some good times with them. The one that stands out in my mind however belonged to the grandfather on Soap. He was always front and center….if a bit stiff at times.
Hey what’s this demeaning of yard dogs? 🙂
At one of my summer jobs there was a Doberman that was the yard dog. To keep people out of the maintenance stuff when nobody was there. (not a junk yard, but it looked like one 😉 ) That dog was so lonely most of the time, with only the cat for company, it would have been overjoyed with anyone who broke in and probably would have licked them had it gotten the chance.
“the whole population (children included) could be on probation / parole in 139 years. ”
Whew, that’s a terrible, but profoundly true thought.
@Downshift – Here is a thought. At something north of $20,000 per year to incarcerate someone, and this info from a 2009 research report, it will be much much shorter than 139 years. More like 20 -25 years. I like the orange colored jump suits myself.
*In the past two decades, state general fund spending on corrections increased by more than 300 percent, outpacing other essential government services from education, to transportation and public assistance.
* One in 31 adults in America is in prison or jail, or on probation or parole.
*Twenty-five years ago, the rate was 1 in 77.
*Overall, two-thirds of offenders are in the community, not behind bars. 1 in 45 adults is on probation or parole and 1 in 100 is in prison or jail.
*The proportion of offenders behind bars versus in the community has changed very little over the past 25 years, despite the addition of 1.1 million prison beds.
*Correctional control rates are highly concentrated by race and geography: 1 in 11 black adults (9.2 percent) versus 1 in 27 Hispanic adults (3.7 percent) and 1 in 45 white adults (2.2 percent); 1 in 18 men (5.5 percent) versus 1 in 89 women (1.1 percent).
*The rates can be extremely high in certain neighborhoods. In one block-group of Detroit’s East Side, for example, 1 in 7 adult men (14.3 percent) is under correctional control.
*Georgia, where 1 in 13 adults is behind bars or under community supervision, leads the top five states that also include Idaho, Texas, Massachusetts, Ohio and the District of Columbia.
The War on Drugs & the War on DWI seem to be a big money maker for several counties in the Mid-Georgia area. The arrests are usually made on Friday after most people have cashed their pay cheques so the papper money can disappear during the shake-down. The people who end up being prosecuted usually get probation to keep the probation fees flowing into county coffers. It’s a wonder that land owners even have to pay taxes for anything.
I thought a two-legged Doberman was one of Sergeant Bilko’s dumber underlings.
The author is 1000% correct. I don’t need these clowns to “feel” safe When seconds count, cops are only minutes away Operation Mockingbird Operation Gladio Mk Ultra This is how our tax dollars are spent “protecting”us. Wake the hell up
Not too long ago, I watched a special on the Migram Experiment (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment) – I know, using Wikipedia as a source feels as wrong as saying King Barry I was a Constitution lecturer, but it serves a purpose now and then – and to know that the vast majority of people were willing to not only submit to the will of authority, but inflict pain on others at the will of that authority, I feel, is a direct result of this grooming from a young age that government and police are inherently good. It’s why there is such shock when a JBT assaults or murders someone or destroys property: We’ve all been taught that this isn’t what they are. It’s only those who’ve realized that humans are human and there are good and evil people in all walks of life.
There are police and soldiers who commit savage acts of destruction and we’re told “The vast majority are good, honest people.” The vast majority of SOCIETY isn’t good and honest (at least not anymore) and being these institutions are just microcosms of society, why would they be any different?
milgram’s lab experiments corroborate something deeper & further back (as in, all the way back), than grooming. social animal hierarchies are very antisocial things, both within & without. but “social” sounds better than “herd”, & deemphasizes “animal”.
the vast majority of “society”, all times/places, conforms. to the social animal animus: anti-individuality, pro pecking order & dominance/submission. that’s the ocean. “organized individuality” is the dutchboy’s finger (which, not too surprisingly, came out of new york city, not holland…).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_I0DjpJ3a0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNGPxA3H7FA
I’m going to go out on a limb here, but…
I presume that Osciffer Friendly (whilst behind the steering wheel of his taxpayer funded conveyance) has never:
Rolled through a stop sign,
Made a turn without using a turn signal,
Caused a tire to squeal during acceleration on sand or gravel,
Exceeded the speed limit without blue lights displayed & siren sounding, et cetera…
Something tells me that I would be incorrect.
It’s time to shun the privileged class.
Eric Hart – Washington Twp, OH – Hero At Work
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/watch-ohio-paid-leave-video-shows-heated-traffic-stop-article-1.1460953
Feeding Bear
One porky would have filled that bear’s stomach for 6 weeks.
The fact is Americans are forced to pay huge $$ to governments for protection. Protection poorly provided, $$ cynically wasted on gadgetry and propaganda to harass ordinary citizens for even more $$. It is widely considered one of the worst and most oppressive justice systems in the world.
Total Number of 2012 VA Major Crimes and crimes per 100,000 people
418,351 Incidents Were Reported – One every 1 Min. 16 Sec.
Murder/Nonnegligent Manslaughter 316 3.86
Kidnaping/Abduction 1,487 18.17
Forcible Sex Offenses 5,093 62.22
Robbery 4,729 57.77
Aggravated Assault 9,148 111.75
Simple Assault/Intimidation 96,976 1184.68
Arson 1,249 15.26
Extortion/Blackmail 124 1.51
Burglary 28,759 351.33
Larceny 140,786 1719.87
Motor Vehicle Theft 8,846 108.06
Counterfeiting/Forgery 6,794 83.00
Fraud 27,998 342.03
Embezzlement 2,650 32.37
Stolen Property 1,342 16.39
Damage/Vandalism 70,087 856.20
Drug/Narcotic Offenses 55,410 676.90
Nonforcible Sex Offenses 196 2.39
Pornography 714 8.72
Gambling 64 0.78
Prostitution 993 12.13
Bribery 26 0.32
Weapon Law Violations 9,049 110.54
The average number of Virginia offenders incarcerated in DOC
institutions in June 2013 was 29,803.
The end of month Probation & Parole caseload for June 2013 was 57,165.
Virginia Jail Father Daughter Dance Behind Bars
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2013/06/virginia-jail-holds-father-daughter-dance-for-prisoners/
Tor – At the current rate the whole population (children included) could be on probation / parole in 139 years. 🙂
Eric, I think that the reason a cop is willing to jump out on ordinary decent people over nothing is that he’s scared shitless to confront real criminals. Cops seem to want their jobs to consist of days spent hassling ordinary people over things that shouldn’t even be covered by any area of law. They seem to want boring, do nothing jobs for which they are grossly overpaid.
Consider that cops need a SWAT team to deal with a centenarian who may have had a gun (but probably didn’t) and that most violent crimes are never solved, it’s easy to see why the donut addicts content themselves with looking for minor violations of obscure stautes rather than looking for the serial rapist or stickup crew in their AO.
It’s because they’re cowards, as all bullies are. Oh, and BTW, anyone who can’t see anything wrong with the cop coming around and menacing the poor lady with antique tags, is likely to be a cop himself, or at least has a mancrush on the cops around him.
Ed, that’s the way I see it too. I can remember when it was a job for those with a bit more guts perhaps than the average person, not the complete opposite. Shoot first, ask questions later….maybe….the new coward’s way. I think about the laws when I was first aware of how many laws there were, and there were way too many then but that’s just a drop in the ocean of laws on the books now. What’s the difference? Follow the money.
This gives me a great deal of hope, too, though.
As disgusting as they are now–wait until the collapse.
When the normal false deference given them–due to the threat of greater consequences–will die.
And when it does, these same bullies will be cowering at home.
Remember how Dorner turned the entire southern Californian police force into quivering heaps of Vagisil? The Power Elite think they’re going to declare martial law a la Boston post-bombing, and lock down the country once and for all. It will be open season on these bullies, and I don’t think most of them will last a week.
@methylamine If it comes to that it will definitely thin the heard on both sides. But my guess is 10 days at $10.00 gasoline, and empty super markets, will send most of the big talkers to the camps for food and blankets within 30 days of their Mountain House running out.
“within 30 days of their Mountain House running out.”
What are you saying? They won’t eat grubs and mice before they go to the camps?
At the very least, the types that have Mountain House would shoot all the squirrels before they do that, and by then maybe things will be a bit different?
Also, is there a Mountain House Coffee? I just thought of that when you said, Mountain House.
@Downshift “is there a Mountain House Coffee?”
I’ll help you, but you owe me, OK? It’s called “instant-coffee”. Want to know where I get it?
I knew it! … Well, sorta.
As you can probably tell, I’m not coffee drinker.
Suddenly I remember my grandparents kept the stuff in the chest freezer. All the younger people (your age?) complained about it as they drank it during the 1970’s.
I surmised it was better than nothing, and, it lasted a Long time.
I wonder how come it didn’t come up on the first page of the search I did?
Probably not for the same reason article titles from EPA don’t come up after ten pages (!) on ixquick.
Mang, it’s times like these (with the exception of the links you posted) that I feel like that guy on the TV commercial from a few years back:
… I’ve Reached The End Of The Internet.
…It just needs a moment to catchup,… and a day to overwhelm me.
…Heh, I’m just kidding of course, there’s a ton I haven’t read… How-freaking-ever; I get the gist of the whole thing.
Is that what it means to understand The Matrix?
@Downshift – Naw. The internet, drugs, the governments, Disneyland and Goggle are contained inside the matrix. Kinda like a little planet inside the solar system.
Eric, I think that the reason a cop is willing to jump out on ordinary decent people over nothing is that he’s scared shitless to confront real criminals.
That’s it EXACTLY.
Just take a look at your overage badged, donut-eating doughboy: fifty-plus pounds overweight, armed with a small-caliber handgun that he probably couldn’t hit a ten-foot-high, mile-long brick wall with at five feet of range and, when you get down to it, all the street smarts of a dumpster. Add to the fact that he’ll get his ASS handed to him in any serious encounter with a determined criminal the additional fact that busting violent criminals just.doesn’t.pay. There’s no money in that game and the risks are too great measured against the possible rewards for doing so. Shaking down unarmed citizens or lightly armed drug dealers (most of whom cops would rather “do business with” than bust), OTOH, is both safe AND lucrative (for his department at least, if not always for him personally, although who is to say that he doesn’t get a cut of the loot he hauls in?).
Much better to err on the side of caution and survive long enough to draw a fat pension upon retirement (while the taxpayers can still be extorted to support it) and with some “extra savings” stashed away on the side from “side operations” than risk being a name on a memorial somewhere.
“he’ll get his ASS handed to him in any serious encounter with a determined criminal ”
Yep. You might recall a video Tor posted several months ago showing three Richmond cops harassing revelers at a street party. They kept pushing a small, skinny guy and he finally pushed back. Within seconds he was on top of the cop who had laid hands on him and had drawn back to punch him when another cop joined in. The cop losing the scrap was a young, fit looking skinhead who had no street smarts at all. He would have had his ass whipped if he’d been alone, but then he probably wouldn’t have bullied the smaller man if he hadn’t had his backup all around him.
Cops are not only usually cowards, they’re also mostly piss poor fighters and shooters. As the Mark Twain character said;
“A man is safe from a hundred of their kind as long as it’s daylight and they aren’t behind him.”
Either you didn’t read beyond the first third of the article, or perhaps you did read further, but lack the ability to analyze the larger principle behind the matter. This is an example, a manifest symptom of something much worse by any ethical, just, or moral standard.
I just went back and reread the article to see if I missed something the cop did. Considering the article contains a lot of unnecessary language I went straight for the base of the story and again found the cop did nothing. My post stands!
Do you know any intellectual jokes?
It’s impossible to explain puns to kleptomaniac cops like yourself, because your kind always takes things literally.
You’re so classless, you’re a Marxist utopia.
Is this post overly solipsistic, or is it just me?
Did you hear the one about the jurisprudence fetishist?
He got off on technicality.
So Jean-Paul Sartre was at the bar the other day, finishing up the sequel to Being and Nothingness. He said to the bartender, “I’d like a Corona, please, with no lemon.” The bartender replies, “I’m sorry, pal, but we’re out of lemons. How about with no lime?”
So I asked Benoit B. Mandelbrot what does the “B” stand for the other day.
Benoit B. Mandelbrot of course, he answered.
I saw Pavlov sitting at the end of the bar enjoying a double vodka, a while back, the bar phone rang and then he jumped up and shouted “oh shit, I forgot to feed the dog!”
A biologist, a chemist, and a statistician go out hunting. The biologist shoots at a deer and misses 2ft to the left, then the chemist takes a shot and misses 2ft to the right, then the statistician yells “Good shooting, we got ’em!”
Did you hear about the suicidal homeopathic doctor? He took 1/50th of the recommended dose.
If there’s two kittens on a sloped roof. Which one slides off first?
The one with the lowest mew.
How may Freudians does it take to screw in a lightbulb?
Two; One to screw in the lightbulb and one to hold the penis… I mean ladder.
Why do engineers confuse Halloween and Christmas?
Because Oct 31 = Dec 25
Three cops and three engineers are traveling by train to a conference. At the station, the three cops each buy tickets and watch as the three engineers buy only a single ticket.
“How are three people going to travel on only one ticket?” asks a cop.
“Watch and you’ll see,” answers an engineer.
They all board the train. The cops take their respective seats but all three engineers cram into a restroom and close the door behind them. Shortly after the train has departed, the conductor comes around collecting tickets. He knocks on the restroom door and says, “Ticket, please.” The door opens just a crack and a single arm emerges with a ticket in hand. The conductor takes it and moves on.
The cops see this and agree that it is quite a clever idea so, after the conference, they decide to copy the engineers on the return trip and save some money.
When they get to the station, they buy a single ticket for the return trip. To their astonishment, the engineers don’t buy a ticket at all.
“How are you going to travel without a ticket?” says one perplexed cop.
“Watch and you’ll see,” answers an engineer.
When they board the train the three cops cram into a restroom and the three engineers cram into another one nearby.
The train departs.
Shortly afterward, one of the engineers leaves his restroom and walks over to the restroom where the cops are hiding. He knocks on the door and says, “Ticket, please.”
Tor – I am dying here…just pee’d my pants annd fell into my ditch laughing so hard
Ha! Funny.
Ahaha, good ones, Tor. One more:
Does the name Pavlov ring a bell?
My contribution:
So, did you hear the one about the termite who walked into a saloon and asked, “Where’s the bartender?”
Iberns, that one might have been too intellectual. 😉
Punchlines only:
-Is the bar tender here, or is it hard to chew, the termite asked?
-No, I was jerking off and I shot the dog!
-The prisoners use cell phones.
-There is a silence, then several gunshots are heard. The guy’s voice comes back on the line. “Okay” he tells the 911 operator: “I’m sure he’s dead, now what?”
-Boobies make milk.
– – – – – –
A Couple More:
‘I was checking into this hotel and a Photon was there checking in as well. The bellhop asked him if he had any luggage, and the Photon said “No I’m traveling light.”
‘I was reading a journal of statistics the other day, did you know the average human has one mammary gland and one testicle?’
“The first rule of Tautology club, is the first rule of Tautology club.”
“A masochist walks up to a sadist in a bar, says to the sadist “hurt me.” “No,” says the Sadist.
“When I learned oxygen and magnesium had hooked up I was like OMg.”
“This farmer was having a problem with foxes eating his hens, so he asks my physicist friend to help find a solution. The physicist spent the rest of the day thinking, finally he replied ‘Well, I’ve found a solution, but it will only work for spherical chickens of a uniform density in a vacuum'”
“A classics professor went to the tailor to get his pants mended. The tailor asked: “Euripedes?” The professor replied “Yes. Eumenides?”
“This joke contains exactly threee erors.”
“A guy walks into a bar, but before he can order a beer, the bowl of pretzels in front of him says “Hey, you’re a handsome fellow.” The man tries to ignore the bowl of pretzels, and orders a fine Pilsner beer. The bowl of pretzels says “Ooooh, a pilsner, great choice. You’re a smart man.” Starting to freak out, the guy says to the bartender “Hey what the hell, this bowl of pretzels keeps saying nice things to me!” The bartender says “Don’t worry about it, the pretzels are complimentary.””
A German walked into the bar last week and asked for a martini. The bartender asked “dry?”, he replied, “nein, just one”
“Recently, a Roman walked into the bar, he held up two fingers in the shape of a Vee, and said, “Five beers, please”
“People often accuse me of ‘stealing others jokes’ and ‘being a plagiarist’, but that’s their words, not mine.”
“They used to laugh when I said I wanted to be a comedian. Well they’re not laughing now!”
“Two chemists walk into an organic bar. The first says, “Can I have a glass of H2O.”
The second chemist says “Can I have a glass of water too.”
Then the first chemist broke down in tears – his attempt at assassinating the second chemist had failed.”
“What do you get when you cross a joke with a rhetorical question?”
“An anecdote, a pun, a play on words, and a limerick just walked into a bar. No joke.”
“So I was at my trigonometric friend “1”‘s house today. His Mom “Sin^2x” and Dad “Tan^2x” got nervous when the mailman introduced himself as “Cos^2x”, but then they relaxed when they saw I wasn’t going trying to solve anything.”
“An ion meets his atom friend on the street and says he’s lost an electron. “Are you sure?” asks the atom. The ion replies, “I’m positive.”
“Did you hear about the Drosophila that liked to drink? He was a real bar fly.”
An infinite number of mathematicians walk into a bar.
The bartender: “What’ll it be, boys?”
The first mathematician: “I’ll have one half of a beer.”
The second mathematician: “I’ll have one quarter of a beer.”
The third mathematician: “I’ll have one eight of a beer.”
The fourth mathematician: “I’ll have one sixteenth of a …”
The bartender interrupts: “Know your limits, boys”, pours them all a single full beer, and moves on to the next customer.
“A mathematician and an engineer agreed to take part in an experiment. They’re both placed naked in a room and at the other end was a beautiful naked nymphomaniac woman at the end of a bed. The experimenter said every 30 seconds they would be allowed to travel half the distance between themselves and the woman. The mathematician said “this is pointless” and stormed off”, but the engineer continued with the experiment anyway. The mathematician exclaimed on his way out “you fool, don’t you see, you’ll never actually reach her?”. To which the engineer replied, “so what? Pretty soon I’ll be close enough for all practical purposes!”.
Three engineers are sitting around talking about God.
Engineer1: I think God is a chemical engineer!
E2, E3: What? What are you talking about?
E1: Look at the digestive system. The whole thing is a series of chemical reactions, breaking down food and converting it into energy and waste! The entire body survives on these reactions. The other engineers ponder this for a moment.
E2: I think you’re wrong. I think God is an electrical engineer. Look at the nervous system. The body is controlled by a series of electrical impulses that fire between tiny nerve cells. I’m telling you, God is an electrical engineer. The third engineer takes a long pause, while the others patiently wait for his response.
E3: I think you’re both wrong. God is a civil engineer.
E1, E2: What? You’re Crazy. That makes no sense!
E3: Think about it, guys. Who else would put a sewage line right in the middle of a recreational area?
“Four dons were walking down an Oxford street one evening. All were philologists and members of the English department. They were discussing group nouns: a covey of quail, a pride of lions, an exaltation of larks.
As they talked, they passed four ladies of the evening. The dons did not exactly ignore the hussies—in a literary way, that is. One of them asked: “How would you describe a group like that?”
Suggested the first: “A jam of tarts?” The second: “A flourish of strumpets?” The third: “An essay of Trollope’s?” Then the dean of the dons, the eldest and most scholarly of them all, closed the discussion: “I wish that you gentlemen would consider ‘An anthology of pros.’ “
“So a C, an E-flat and a G walk into a bar. The bartender says, “sorry, but we don’t serve minors.” So E-flat leaves, and C and G have an open fifth between them. After a few drinks, the fifth is diminished and G is out flat.
F comes in and tries to augment the situation, but is not sharp enough. A D comes in and heads for the bathroom saying, “Excuse me. I’ll just be a second.” Then A comes in, but the bartender is not convinced that this relative of C is not a minor. Then the bartender notices B-flat hiding at the end of the bar and says, “Get out! You’re the seventh minor I’ve found in this bar tonight.”
E-Flat comes back the next night in a three-piece suit with nicely shined shoes. The bartender says, “you’re looking sharp tonight. Come on in, this could be a major development.” Sure enough, E-flat soon takes off his suit and everything else, and is au natural. Eventually, C, who had passed out under the bar the night before, begins to sober up and realizes in horror that he’s under a rest. So, C goes to trial, is convicted of contributing to the diminution of a minor and sentenced to 10 years of DS without Coda at an up scale correctional facility.
The conviction is overturned on appeal, however, and C is found innocent of any wrongdoing, even accidental, and that all accusations to the contrary are bassless. The bartender decides, however, that since he’s only had tenor so patrons, the soprano out in the bathroom and everything has become alto much treble, he needs a rest and closes the bar.”
“If you’re not part of the solution, you’re part of the precipitate.”
Tor, more please. Wait, let me go get some beer first.
People used to accuse me of having delusions of grandeur. They’ll all be sorry when I’m king.
PRICELESS, Tor!
And of course all sailing right over Joe’s head.
Well, then, Joe, if you really think the cop did nothing wrong then you are no libertarian. You are just another statist who mindlessly obeys your masters.
Eric, I do believe he needs a clover avatar.
Until its your property or life then it’ll be a different story. I’ll die laughing the day all police are disbanded and someone says…..hey we should hire a sheriff cause someone just committed a crime against me. Then someone walks over to you and says sure but he is not allowed to do anything cause we’re free now. hahahahahahaha
Joe,
No one here – not me, at any rate – has a problem with going after predators. People who threaten (or actually harm) others – or damage/steal property, etc.
But that’s not what the article was criticizing. It was criticizing the all-too-common practice of hassling peaceful people who’ve harmed no one over manufactured “offenses” – such as driving a car to work that has antique tags on it.
It’s obnoxious – and it’s wrong.
Because it’s never right to threaten people with violence who’ve not committed some aggressive act first.
Dear Joe,
Most who comment here are free market anarchists.
We advocate free market, private sector alternatives to coerced government “services.” Private security instead of police. Arrbitration instead of courts. Militia and or Mercenaries instead of standing armies. There is considerable literature on this actually. You may enjoy reading it.
Your “hahahahahaha… ” comment is inadvisable.
It is not consistent with an “intellectual website looking to address issues of freedom.” It fails to convey an impression of maturity.
I’m a hard-ass here: If you can’t defend your property, or your life – you don’t deserve it.
Not the basis of a civilized society, of course – you shouldn’t HAVE TO walk around with an MP5 in hand – but it’s the antithesis of civilized society to ORDER people to NOT walk around armed.
If ANYONE can respond to your violence, there will be high risk, even for moderate reward. Idiots might try it; those who have no choice.
Sane people, civilized people, will not. Even if they are armed, someone will have a bigger or better gun, shoot from cover, or at the least, WITNESS the events and report them.
But, should you INSIST that ONLY THE ANNOINTED may respond to violence with violence, you have ensured the corruption of the society – the loyalty is to who signs the paychecks. the Laws can be arbitrary, beacuse the ENFORCERS answer to who signs the checks. Not to us.
You MUST be able to defend your property. Otherwise, it’s not YOUR property. You are just “minding the farm” for the overlord, like an ancient serf. The Enforcers then, are there to ensure you are working the land, FOR THE LORD – not yourself.
So you travel to a cube-farm and “tend the fields” there.
A difference without a distiction is … no difference.
deservin’s got nothin’ to do with it….
Actually, whether the cop did wrong or not comes down to information we don’t have. It’s what makes the difference between a threat (which the threatener can choose to make happen or not) and a warning (which is about a danger that the warner cannot influence much). If he came in and passed on a warning, passing on information about the risk that others might follow it up but with the knowledge that he himself would never follow it up, that is very different from threatening to follow it up himself. We can’t tell which it is, even from the car owner’s own testimony.
Of course, even a warning doesn’t eliminate responsibility, if the warner created the danger earlier. Although threatening to plant a bomb is different from telephoning a warning about a bomb planted earlier, and it’s still a genuine warning if the warner can’t undo that by then, there is still the responsibility for planting it and making it impossible to undo. But the cop in this story didn’t make that law.
The article speaks of what the cop did, but also the philosophy and motivations behind such an action – and that is the main point of contention. Of course, that’s not to say the cop is without blame either. The problem exists on both ends (creation of law and enforcement of law), and both ends rightly receive high levels of derision. In other words, it’s not just about what the cop did, although I disagree that he did the right thing.
To get a good idea of what a correct approach to this problem is, please read Eric’s previous article, contrasting how things are and how things should be.
But Joe – he did not do nothing. He went inside and – with all the implied violence of his uniform, his gun and his status as a law enforcer – browbeat the woman over the non-crime of driving her old car to work. What he did amounted to “making her an offer she couldn’t refuse.”
I just went back and reread the article to see if I missed something the cop did. Considering the article contains a lot of unnecessary language I went straight for the base of the story and again found the cop did nothing. My post stands!
So … if a mob thug walks into a business and says, “Nice place ya got here; it’d be a shame if anything happened to it,” and indicates that the owner had better make a contribution to his associate within seven days or face the consequences, but leaves without any money in his hand, he’s “done nothing”. Right?
Hi JDL,
You’ve hit on an important point here – one that Joe (and most cops) are oblivious to: The aura of implied violence that surrounds every cop, no matter how “nice” he may be as a person.
The plain fact is he has a gun, a badge – and the authority of “the law” behind him. Therefore, anything he says is inherently couched in the threat that authority may bring to bear. It is why Mere Mundanes know they must be careful about what they say to a cop, regardless of the circumstances. For exactly the same reasons one is forced to be polite and pull one’s punches (so to speak) when dealing with a mafiosi: They can hurt you – and with near-impunity.
Joe, et al, miss this. They apparently cannot understand why Mere Mundanes would be uneasy/uncomfortable in the presence of any cop, for any reason. I have just explained the reason – and hope Joe will read this post.
An entire article that says the cop did nothing? The cop does nothing and you call him names? Lets say he was cruising the parking lot looking for stolen vehicles or maybe he was looking for a car wanted in connection with a crime and found the historical plate and inquired as to its authenticity. Yes people do just slap plates on a car …sometimes a stolen car. This might sound harmless or victimless until you get into an accident and the other motorist gets out of his car laughs at you and runs away… or it was your car that was stolen. We used to call these accidents “mystery mobiles” because after running the plates, VINS and contacting previous owner its still a mystery. Much older cars are more susceptible because their value is less so owners don’t care where or when they abandon their cars. The cop in this story did good in my book. He saw something and investigated but since it was minor he issued a warning that hurt nobody……maybe some feelings.
“To Protect and Serve” – this cop did neither, but want out of his way to be an ASSHOLE even if he didn’t write a ticket –
You are a Fool and a Clover.
Be Gone…
I’m suspecting this is not an intellectual website looking to address issues of freedom but rather just another website that feeds on hate. I’m Libertarian and a realist in everything that I do. “You are a fool and a clover” I have more law enforcement, military and business ownership experience then apparently everyone on this website. If Eric does not want me posting I will be gone but know this ……standing in a room full of like minded people introduces no new thought. The proverb is mine. 🙂
Joe – I urge you to stay on the website and keep your mind open – you might learn something – we are not all Rednecks here (well some of us might be)
PS – nobody here is going to argue with a Know-It-All or Self Appointed Holier than Thou Pseudo-Intellectual.
Now, I gotta go back to digging ditches…
Hey, GW, I’m a mixed breed myself, half redneck on momma’s side and half SWP on daddy’s side. As far as I know, I’m the only such halfbreed here, though there may be a pedigreed redneck or SWP here or there.
It would be funny if he called you a redneck. 😉
Hey Ed – I like to describe myself as a Redneck with an IQ – scares the shit out of some people (the snob nosed pretenders mostly) – most pseudo intellectuals try to put on airs – I would rather drink with real people and made that choice a few years outta college when I realized how much BS there was out there in the real world.
To para-phrase Karl Deninger – “Make It, Grow it, Mine it” I would add “Just Stop Skimming It”!
For decades, this old self-educated Redneck has left the intellectual roads he’s traveled strewn with the bloody heads of formally educated assholes.
*****
It would be interesting to hear the creators of the law referred to by Eric, defend same.
The Parasitic Political Class and the Plundering Brotherhood of Juris Doctors derive enormous profit from laws that violate the Principles underpinning the Unanimous Declaration.
Tinsley Grey Sammons (1936 –)
BTW Since I will be cremated I will have no tombstone. Had I a tombstone, Well’s “God damn you all, I told you so.” would be engraved on it.
Dear Tinsley,
Hey, long time no hear!
I will be cremated too, when the time comes. I’m in no hurry, of course.
No reason not to have a tombstone — if you want one. After all, you could put your ashes beneath the tombstone, or just have the tombstone by itself.
I’m sure that as long as your check doesn’t bounce, the cemetery won’t care if you leave the space empty.
Might be nice to be able to make a final “statement,”just for the hell of it.
Hi Joe,
Most of the posts (Clover’s excepted) speak for themselves, I think. You may not agree with the views expressed, but hopefully you will agree they’re presented intelligently – that is, using logic, reason, facts.
Libertarians operate from the principles of non-aggression and self-ownership. Everything is judged right – or wrong – insofar as whether it’s ok to interfere with anyone – on that basis.
Ergo – to use a fancy term – there is no ethical justification for threatening a person with violence because she drover her car with (or without) whatever “tags” the gunvernment decrees she must have. The law itself is illegitimate.
And thus, its enforcement.
Am I an intellectual? whatever that truly means I do not know. My posts are based on experience that I have lived spanning decades. Could I be wrong? Sure and thats why I like it when people post replies to the contrary, you never stop learning. Anyone who lives believing they can live without “some” form of government is not in opinion a realist.
I like reading and donate to libertarian causes. LewRockwell.com has been a huge eye opener for me so yes I consider myself “Libertarian”. Like any ideology……there will be different opinions in the mix. Where am I in that mix? …..I believe the “state” should be reduced to a tiny fraction of its current size but not eliminated. With that said….now go ahead and beat me up.
Hi Joe,
I’m not trying to beat on you – at least, that’s not my intention. I hope it doesn’t come across that way!
We can certainly debate “no-government” vs. “some-government.” I personally can’t see – logically – how you can limit government, because once you concede authority to government for any reason that entails violating any person’s rights, you’ve already set in motion the certainty of future (and more widespread) violations of people’s rights.
That said, I’d certainly be ecstatic about a return to limited government – to a government that mostly left people alone. I believe such is inherently unstable and transient (see objection above) but infinitely preferable to what we suffer under now.
But, back to the question at hand:
Why hassle this woman? Surely, the cop could find better (as in, more justifiable) things to do. These petty harassments grate precisely because so much genuine criminality goes unpunished. It’s simply unconscionable that any time is spent on things like pestering people about driving their antique-tagged car to work when there are thieves, rapists, violent thugs of all stripes out there preying on people.
Right?
“Anyone who lives believing they can live without “some” form of government is not in opinion a realist.”
That;s like saying “Anyone who lives believing they can live without “some” form of enslavement is not in my opinion a realist.”
So what would you have done to me if I refused to participate in your “some” form of government?
Dear Joe,
“Anyone who lives believing they can live without “some” form of government is not in opinion a realist.”
Would it surprise you to learn that some here once felt the same way? I did.
Some of us here clung to “limited government” for years before finally, reluctantly admitting that “Limited government is like limited cancer.” We eventually concluded that it was a classic case of the camel’s nose in the tent, that if you gave government an inch, it would take a mile.
Anyone who knows American history knows that this is exactly what has happened between 1776 and 2013. I hardly think I need to prove that.
Minarchism Always Becomes Maxarchism
http://aisforanarchy.blogspot.tw/2013/01/minarchism-always-becomes-maxarchism.html
“Anyone who lives believing they can live without “some” form of government is not in opinion a realist.”
Nope. Hardly. The reverse is true.
Anyone who believes government can be “limited” has yet to learn the harsh truths of realpolitik.
Montesquieu.
There is no greater tyranny than that which is perpetrated under the shield of the law and in the name of justice.
UNAMERICAN POWER
It’s really quite simple and no law degree is necessary to understand it.
No Power that contravenes the Principles underpinning the Unanimous Declaration has Lawful Authority.
Lawful and Legal are not synonyms. There is an ethical element in lawful that can be dangerously absent in legal.
If a particular power offends a healthy Conscience it is surely unlawful.
Tinsley Grey Sammons (1936 –)
Dear Joe,
“I’m suspecting this is not an intellectual website looking to address issues of freedom but rather just another website that feeds on hate.”
There may be websites like that, but this is not one of them.
What you will find here is not “hate,” but anger, outrage, and indignation.
The latter are sometimes conflated with the first, but they are most assuredly not synonymous.
Most modern “nation states” are in serious trouble. They are essentially “failed states.” This includes states whose “leaders” accuse other states of being failed states. This includes the “unitedstate.”
If you are at the point where you consider yourself a libertarian, and read Lew Rockwell, you ought to know where most of the people commenting here are coming from.
Anger, outrage, and indignation, at ever more anger-provoking, outrageous, and indignation inspiring abuses of power by the Leviathan State against peaceful individuals.
Hate? No, not hate. Rather, eminently rational, psychologically healthy responses to gross injustices inflicted upon innocent human beings.
To begrudge the victims of state violence even the expression of these righteous emotions is insult added to injury.
I can only hope that was not your intention.
JoePA
Every morning I mine LewRockwell.com for the occasional nugget published there.
During the past twenty or so years I’ve offered the use of some of my best work free of charge.
I remain disappointed. And I wonder that a musician might wipe his ass on Bach.
Tinsley Grey Sammons (1936 –)
JoePa: I believe your statement ” I’m Libertarian and a realist in everything that I do” confuses your statement.
A libertarian typically believes that actions which don’t harm others shouldn’t be regulated. A “realist” would certainly understand that the police, looking out for our best interest, issue seat belt tickets, “advise” people that using their car for work is unlawful, etc. And, of course, a realist understands that seat belt violators are sometimes tased, beaten, and even run over by police.
So – to clear up the confusion, could it be stated that, as a capital “L” libertarian, and realist, you understand that people will be confronted for doing no harm on occasion by police, and, if no money is extorted at the time, is just uncouth to call a spade a spade, and belittle this paragon of the LEO community because he gave a warning?
I once received a “warning” from an LEO who asked me if I was carrying bombs, bomb making equipment, ordered me to walk over here and stand, then over there and stand, warned me not to “make a move” for the little folding knife in my pocket, lied about what had happened prior to the stop. However, as a realist, understanding that these things happen on occasion, and because no money was extorted, he was actually doing me a favor, and doesn’t deserve my contempt?
I remember a statement in the Declaration of Independence: “He has erected a multitude of New Offices and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance..”
I think that Mr. Adams had a statement for people who see no wrong in this type of behavior:
“If ye love wealth better than liberty,
the tranquility of servitude
better than the animating contest of freedom,
go home from us in peace.
We ask not your counsels or your arms.
Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you.
May your chains set lightly upon you,
and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”
In sum, I can safely state, most readers of this site believe it’s NOT OK to harass people when no victim is harmed, whether or not money is extorted. Making up a scenario to illustrate that the officer is truly a good guy is what most Clovers and Sheeple have been programmed to do. Looks like it’s working like clockwork.
In college I worked for campus police doing, among other things, enforcement of college car stickers for students’ cars.
In my zeal to “enforce the rules” I spent a few days in fraternity parking lots issuing tickets. They didn’t have the required stickers.
This set off quite a firestorm and the campus police chief basically told me to knock it off. It was a PRIVATE university and angering the paying customers was stupid.
I recognized later that I was just letting my petty tyrant out and screwing with people I resented in a way I had at my disposal. It was clear that I lacked the personality to be exposed to power safely. It made me an asshole.
Enforcing petty rule is the essence of “petty tyrant.” If you can’t see that, then I don’t understand why you bother to surf libertarian-leaning sites.
Too bad the campus chief did not work for the city instead.
d.c. sunsets–I didn’t understand your post, other than the part of you understanding the letting out of your “petty tyrant”, which, if so, is a fine realization. But, is there something wrong with a university requiring students to obtain parking stickers in order to park on school property? Is it your opinion that any and every body should be able to park there, instead (which, if it increased, would lead to the students having no place to park)?
Personally, I have a “thing” about parking stickers. In the gigantic (“secured”) apartment complex where I live (covers nearly a while city block), about twice times a week, I would come home from work to find some asshole parked in my reserved parking space. This meant that I could not park in my own space, but instead had to search for street parking blocks and blocks away (and in a neighborhood where auto break-ins, and even auto thefts, were very common). The complex issued parking stickers, but I was the ONLY resident there who actually put his sticker on the window. There was a security guard whose job was to notice cars without stickers parked in spaces (all of which belonged to the tenants), and have them towed away. MY “petty tyrant” DEFINITELY wanted those tow-aways to occur (especially when the car in question was in MY space), but they never, ever did. All I could do was complain to the management.
Fortunately, after so many of these, the apartment manager offered me another parking space that was actually more convenient to my own apartment, and also in a location that was not apt to be abused by these others who would park in my space (a space that was very convenient to the entrance to a major section of apartments, and therefore used by people’s “guests”). And, wonderfully, in my new spot, no one has ever parked in my space again. (But whatever new tenant now has my old space, is constantly suffering from the problem I had.)
Then we got new managers, “new sheriffs in town,” who claimed to be there to straighten out all the problems that have routinely occurred in that complex, INCLUDING the parking issue, which was, by the way enough of a problem for some tenants to move out. New stickers were issued and the new management presented a deadline when every car had to have one or if found parked there, would be towed. But guess what, again, I seem to be the only one who put the new sticker on his car. Another rule coming from “the new sheriff in town” was that if for some reason YOU had to park an unstickered car in your space, then you would need to inform the management to keep the car from being towed. Last week, my car was in the shop for some repairs, so I had a rental car. When I informed the manager about my parking a rental car in my space, she said, “Oh, that’s okay, just so long as you park it in YOUR space, it won’t get towed.” Well, that sounds nice, but as a practical matter proved to me that they were ignoring that rule, because how would the security guard know that it was ME parking in my own space, instead of someone from off the street? This becomes not an issue of “petty tyranny”, but of laziness, I believe. Behavior settles down to the lowest common denominator. Next year, we will come home from work and find strangers sitting there in our living room, because, well, no one wants to be a petty tyrant and enforce tenancy rights.
I’m Libertarian
Bullshit.
Dear JoePA,
Pop quiz, hotshot. Explain these lyrics to us non-intellectuals, I challenge you.
The traffic lights they turn blue tomorrow
And shine their emptiness down on my bed,
The tiny island sags downstream
‘Cos the life that they lived is dead.
And the wind screams Mary.
Will the wind ever remember
The names it has blown in the past,
And with this crutch, its old age and its wisdom
It whispers, “No, this will be the last.”
And The Wind Cries Mary.
After all the jacks are in their boxes,
and the clowns have all gone to bed,
you can hear happiness staggering on down the street,
footprints dress in red.
And the wind whispers Mary.
A broom is drearily sweeping
up the broken pieces of yesterday’s life.
Somewhere a Queen is weeping,
somewhere a King has no wife.
And the wind it cries Mary.
Tor….
You can’t win an argument with a fool or a clover – especially one that thinks he is a Libertarian.
Say Goodnight Gracie
Lambchops – Burns and Allen – 1929
How George met Gracie
You still have a lot of state in you. Here is some cleanser for your philosophical soul:
Minarchism: Great Start, Horrible Finish – Larken Rose
In one hand, our present government, offers power over others, or benefits derived from power over others, whether it’s a job as a cop, a government worker, a County Inspector, or stolen money from “redistribution”. In the other hand, it holds nothing. These two hands are what it offers people.
Many people see libertarian anarchists as nuts who are dumb enough to choose the hand with nothing.
What we have to do as show people that we are not offering an empty hand. We are not anti government. We are anti FORCED government.
Look, I belong to several clubs and business associations. They all have certain rules. Some are very stringent. One traditional hot rod group I belong to doesn’t allow any discussion of cars after model year 1964, and they are very strict about! But I participate in these governments VOLUNTARILY!
Bill Gates and many other billionaires and millionaires have people handing money over voluntarily. Some people are waiting in lines around the block to voluntarily fork over their hard earned cash for the latest gizmo or service. Only our present government provides such horrible products and services that it has to threaten people with guns or imprisonment to sell its goods.
Many people see libertarianism/anarchism as a governmentless society with gangs roving the streets robbing and killing because there are no cops to protect them. This is hardly the case! We still have volunteer fire departments and volunteer rescue squads in many parts of the country. If we trust these people with our very lives while having a heat attack certainly we could trust a volunteer cop.
There’s also the option of private security. Many people live in areas now that have private security policing, because they get better protection. Yes it would cost a little but think of the waste you’re paying for now! then add the extortion and corruption you are paying for now. Private security would be cheaper in the long run. Unless of course you’re on the dole and pay nothing now.
That’s another reason many people are against libertarianism. They’re freeloading and don’t want to give up the big government teat. Well, keep sucking suckers and see where you are when the cow dies.
@Clik – What if the cow quits his job? What if he only makes enough to barely tax him anything, or nothing? The parasites will have a big problem on that day.
The Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) reports that total federal, state and local spending in the United States was $6.134 trillion in 2010
I love these excuses for the police….
See that 1969 Mini wearing the antique plates parked in some business’s lot could have been a stolen car driven by a violent bank robber….
Could, maybe, just keeping us safe…. But then when asked why the cop didn’t stop the openly armed man with ski mask on who’s walking towards the bank, well….
It’s funny how our protective authorities just miss the boat on the obvious criminals and then use what those criminals end to doing as an excuse to create more petty things to harass ordinary people over.
“See that 1969 Mini wearing the antique plates parked in some business’s lot could have been a stolen car driven by a violent bank robber”
Hey, Jason Bourne drove an old Mini and outran the Paris Gendarmerie. Can’t be too careful, y’know…officer safety and all that.
A Morris Mini Minor is not a Mini. It is a smallish but fairly conventional car for its day, somewhat earlier than the Issigonis Mini – which could be up-engined for high performance, as in the Mini Cooper adaptation.
Not quite right, there’s a Morris Minor and a Morris Mini Minor.
A Morris Mini Minor is most definitely a Mini, the classic one.
Here’s a link to the Morris Minor, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morris_Minor
and here’s a link to the Morris Mini Minor http://images.thecarconnection.com/med/the-first-morris-mini-minor-august-26-1959_100227438_m.jpg
Dear Ed, PM,
Assuming it’s a “Morris Minor,” then it’s got to be this car:
http://www.autopictu.com/1585-morris-minor.html
For me, the Morris Minor was an important car, because it was the basis for the Sprite and MG Midget, one of my favorite traditional British roadsters.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2359208/Toddler-buys-rundown-Austin-Healey-Sprite-eBay-playing-fathers-smartphone—parents-decide-it.html
Thanks for posting that link, Bevin. I was wondering what the hell eric was talking about in his article. I’d never heard of that car before.
I like MG’s, had a blast in a few, but that car,… eh.
…Maybe, maybe the woody version would be useful?
Hi DS,
I’ve been trying to dig up the article I wrote (a year ago?) about the Morris. Cool little car. It looks kind of like an old Kaiser Frasier-had-sex-with-a-Mini. The engine is so little you could pluck it out between your thumb and forefinger. Right-hand drive (Oh, Behave!) Cute as an old Beetle, but even slower. Top speed is somewhere in the high 60s. It was meant for knocking around the English countryside, not for American highways.
Dear DS,
Sure thing!
The Morris Minor was a big seller in the UK and the former colonies, excepting the US. It was considered the Brit’s counterpart to the VW Beetle.
The parts for the Austin Healey Sprite and MG Midget came out of the Morris Minor.
In this respect, it was sort of like the Ford Falcon, which supplied the parts for the Ford Mustang and the Mercury Cougar.
Klavdy, sorry, I was being sloppy with typing. I don’t know how that “Mini” got in there with the rest of the name; the original article clearly specifies a Morris Minor. Anyhow, I was trying to distinguish the car in question from a Mini (and failing).
Dear Eric,
Is this the article?
http://www.lewrockwell.com/2012/07/eric-peters/35-5-mpg-is-no-big-deal/
I ran a search engine search from the outside.
Ach, yes!
Thank you, sir!
It’s funny how our protective authorities just miss the boat on the obvious criminals and then use what those criminals end to doing as an excuse to create more petty things to harass ordinary people over.
Yup. I’m actually beginning to sense, though, that more and more of the Clover majority is waking up to this reality. The problem is that their thoroughly washed (with publik skool propaganda) brainlets can’t grasp the idea of life in any society that doesn’t include an army of control-freak bullies to keep us from slaughtering each other (something the typical Clover inexplicably assumes would become the new reality).
THAT is going to be the hardest hurdle to overcome: convincing Clover that the typical human being is simply hell-bent on slaughtering his fellow man and is prevented from doing so only through the existence of armed thugs to prevent him from doing so.
Some more cleanser:
The Great Escalators – Larken Rose
Dear lberns,
I really like the way Rose lays out the arguments against “obedience to authority.”
He proceeds step by step, making sure that each step of the way, his argument is airtight. It helps that he uses concrete terms. It gives the authoritarians no place to hide.
By the time he gets to the end, the authoritarian has had to confront some Inconvenient Truths.
He or she can and will attempt to “blank out” or to go “But, but, but… ” That is to be expected. But his or her smug righteousness about coercing people to “do good” will be seriously undercut.
How They See You – Larken Rose
Explains how your congressman and your ruling class opponents view you. Insights into the mindsets of higher echelon heroes.
George Donnelly – The three V’s – non-Violent Voluntary Virtues
He certainly lays it out as plain and direct as can be. I’ve used many of his arguments to great affect as a means to shutting down statist claptrap.
Another guy I like is Ben Stone aka. the Bad Quaker. I had the great fortune to meet both Larken and Ben. They are very down to earth, humble men.
Dear lberns, Tor,
There is definitely an ecological niche for this type of plainspoken libertarian rhetoric.
Not everyone is going to be converted by Rothbard and Hoppe.
Joe,
This occurred in a very small, very rural county. One stoplight – literally. The car is a 44-year-old antique Morris-Minor. Right hand drive; top speed maybe 65 MPH, all out. Not a likely car for a ban robber. People around here know each other. People know this woman; know her car. What do you suppose the chances are it’s stolen? In any event, this is not the issue. Because his computer would have told him the car wasn’t stolen – definitively. He was making an issue of her driving it with the antique vehicle tags.
And that makes him a part of the problem, in my book.
I don’t give a hoot what “the law” is. What matters to me – and what ought to matter to everyone – is whether a person’s actions have caused harm to others or their property (or pretty obviously will do so).
How does a lady driving her old car three miles down the road to her job harm anyone? Why should it be cause for bothering her in any way?
Dunno for sure, but I can guess…
1. Denying insurance for the AUTO (guessing as an antique, it would be part of homeowners. But I’m guessing.)
2. Not paying the “correct” licensing fees for an automobile for public (ie, IN public) use.
In other words, it’d be about the MONEY again.
In Va, insurance remains mandatory regardless of plate type. And – ironically – most people who have antiques have more coverage (typically, “agreed value”) than is typical.
However, you do get to avoid the annual registration fee – almost $60 now, per car.
And that, they cannot abide.
Also, antique vehicles are exempt from both state “safety” and “emissions” testing.
So, yeah… money.
Eric….if you’re saying the police should not be allowed to check the registration of a car I do understand that. In that same note I would like to add that antique cars are in fact often stolen because Vins and titles prior to the early 70s did not exist. Thats why the antique road show that we host mandates a history of ownership. Antique, Dealer and even Diplomatic plates (around NYC) are considered under suspicion because of vast fraud. The question that a true Libertarian should ask……do we value our property more or less then our freedom? Am I correct in stating your opposition?
Joe,
The cop in this case knew the registration was valid. A quick computer check from inside his car. Yup. Not stolen. So, no reason – no legitimate reason – to get out of the car, go into the business and issue thinly veiled threats.
Right?
Joe, a friend recently related how he and another fellow took a trailer full of horses out of state to an auction. They parked the trailer at a hotel and disconnected so they could go out to eat and park more easily when they returned. Over night someone stole their new dually pickup right out of the parking lot. The security tapes showed a truck entering the parking lot and 46 seconds later the first truck and their truck departing. It was a fully registered, licensed and insured modern vehicle with all the bells and whistles. Gone in 46 seconds!
The police arrived on the scene, wrote down the details, reviewed the videos and said “Yep, your truck is gone. You’re never gonna’ see it again. I hope you have insurance.” That was it. No investigation, no follow up. Just a police report so they could file the claim with their insurance company. Fortunately they had full coverage. The police did zip, zilch, nada, for them. The private loss coverage gave them all the satisfaction they are going to get. So much for your irrelevant property vs. freedom blather.
Dear Boothe,
I had a less expensive, but similar experience just out of college.
I was working at a firm in NYC. 1970. My 10 speed got stolen out of my apartment. I called the cops.
To show you how naive I was back then, I told them “I made sure not to touch anything so you can dust for prints.”
Bottom line? They said the exact same thing. Say goodbye to your bike. It’s history.
They went through the motions of “investigating” for a few minutes, then went for donuts and coffee.
Bevin – I had a similiar thing happen back in the 80’s – Thief stole the outdrive off my boat and even left his tools in my driveway – which I still have to this day…
…anyway Barney Fife and Deputy Dawg show up and I ask them if they are going to at least dust for finger prints, which they do and then promptly leave sans their fingerprint dusting kit… what a couple of knuckleheads…
Dear GW,
I’m laughing pretty hard as I type this…
Hey, at least you gained some tools and a “Crime Scene Investigator” fingerprint set!
Go Gil Grissom!
Boothe, over on http://jalopnik.com/ they post stolen classic cars now and then. Today’s method of finding stolen cars is to get broadcast all over the internet.
The hobby may be doing better than the cops these days. A couple have been found.
But sometimes the cops do find a stolen car. Like someone I knew. He told me the cops wrote him a letter of where they found the car. He had to go it. It was stripped. Yeah. A letter. Your car is at this address….
Well I guess that’s better than the alternative. If they tow it, they charge the owner towing and impound and parking tickets. Government don’t care it was stolen.
Early 70s? Bull. I used to be able decode Ford VINs going back to the 1960s in my head. Prior to that I couldn’t decode because they used another system, but they still existed.
The unified government mandated VIN system didn’t hit until the 1980s, but VINs existed for a long time before then. They were on the door data plates BTW. They didn’t appear on the dash until ~1968.
I can “amen” that with regard to GM vehicles.
The VIN gave you body, engine/transmission, color and other data.
Well now it comes into focus. It was Andy’s Barney Fife with his 1 bullet who gave the warning.
Joe – I think Eric is pointing out the officers self initiated “intent” in this post. I would agree with you, if he was investigating a felony involving a stolen car/ historical license plate/ other crime then all is justified in doing good police work. Most of the time those chicken-shit violations are enforced as “probable cause” while investigating a bigger crime. But the story and the officer’s statements do not indicate that was the case. As described (unless something is left out) he went through a fair amount of effort to seek out and “warn” someone over a minor non-moving / non-safety related technical vehicle code infraction. His high priced training, pay, benefits and police car time could be put to much more productive use then cruising parking lots and enforcing non-moving infractions for the state revenue agency, or as Eric put it “Meanwhile, there is no lack of people who’ve done horriblle things to others – you know, actual criminals.”
His high priced training, pay, benefits and police car time could be put to much more productive use then cruising parking lots and enforcing non-moving infractions for the state revenue agency, or as Eric put it “Meanwhile, there is no lack of people who’ve done horriblle things to others – you know, actual criminals.”
I have to believe that where Eric lives the rate of violent crime against person and property is probably so low as to be almost non-existent. That’s why this porcine parasite decided to play Oinky Billy Bad-ass in this case. The worthless oxygen thief was trying to justify the wasted paycheck the municipality was spending on him. Typical of the porcine taxfeeder class, he wasn’t smart enough to realize that this sort of stupidity only proves the point we make here: that he and his kind are not only not needed, but are a positive hindrance and harm to the peace.
So if the cop saw something minor and irrelevant, then why did he feel the need to say ANYTHING…why not just drive on and continue to look for actual criminals?
It’s like if I’m walking down the street and I see someone in an alleyway coping a semi-discrete feel-up from their girlfriend. Is it illegal? Probably, but the decent thing to do would be to ignore it and walk away. The ASSHOLE thing to do would be to go up to them and remind them of the illegality and then walk away anyway leaving them to shake their head and wonder what my problem is.
This cop CHOSE to take the oppritunuty to be an asshole, albiet a restrained asshole, just for sheer ego purposes and intimidation, and we’re supposed to be happy it occured? And don’t give me any of the “just doing his job” crap because that won’t fly either, unless he’s hanging out at all streets looking for jaywalkers to warn about as well, or unlicenced lemonaid stands, or any of the thousands of other bylaws that exist for him to asert authoraty over you for.
You wreak of statism… You say you are a Libertarian, I wonder what you meant by that. You certainly advocate the initiation of force.
He didn’t ”do nothing”.
I read JoePA’s comments below. Perhaps he’s not a clover – but he very well could be a gov’t troll hired to make posts to attempt to sway public opinion. For more on that read http://www.infowars.com/governments-hire-web-trolls-to-sway-public-opinion/
Or perhaps he is a supporter of the State College, PA’s Penn State University’s former football coach and pedophile allower (Jerry Sandusky), Joe Paterno, as Paterno was called JoePA for decades.
kitty, a couple months ago I read an article, I think in World Net Security, warning everyone of the sheer size and scope of govt. paid trolls on various web sites.
Dear Kitty,
How to deal with shills and trolls.
This is an interesting issue.
Often their mission is to provoke an intemperate backlash, in order to discredit champions of individual liberty.
I really wonder however, how much success they can ever really have. I say this because the resolute champions of individual liberty I know, including the folks here, are usually fully capable of offering cogent arguments from the moral high ground.
The shills and trolls may be trying to discredit opponents of the Leviathan State, but the irony is they merely wind up being our straight men, letting us deliver the punchlines.
This is not due necessarily to superior debating skills, but rather to the fact that the truth has more power than lies.
Bevin I think the aim is, as Cass Sunstein said, “cognitive infiltration”.
They’re not there to WIN arguments; they’re there to provide a “mass effect” and sway the weak-minded, the easily-led.
People who fall for Jedi mind tricks. Not the strong among us.
But that said, they better have millions on their payrolls, because the overwhelming majority of comments I’m seeing on “mainstream” sites are pro-gun, anti-government, and absolutely seething with rage at this regime.
They’ve lost the infowar–from here on out, it’s a mop-up operation for us.
It’s going to get very, very ugly. But the philosophical battle is ours. Now, the physical battle begins; the battle for dominance. They have that. But they no longer have the consent, or the agreement, or the moral high ground.
They do very desperate things in this situation–looking back on history, it’s the equivalent of a two-year-old kicking and screaming. Except THIS two-year-old has nukes under his control.
methylamine wrote, “They do very desperate things in this situation–looking back on history,”
Do you suppose they would use trolls to draw people out and target them?
What I mean is, looking back on history, poisoning the opposition was/is very common.
Why wouldn’t they do that?
They can already drone us, but that’s messy, expensive and may leave a trail.
That’s just a horrible thought I had when thinking about how the Romans rolled.
…And how others in positions of power have tried to achieve their aims throughout the centuries.
I wonder if you asked the Ron Paul people how they felt about the looks the Republicans gave them during the Primaries, if that look they got could do that, could support that, and then look the other way?
Thing is, that wouldn’t even have to happen .
Yeah, that’s probably just crazy brainstorming talk. Mankind has advanced, people aren’t the same as they have been for the last 10,000 years. It’s different this time. ? Who knows?
Perhaps he’s not a clover – but he very well could be a gov’t troll hired to make posts to attempt to sway public opinion.
If that’s true and the people who sign his paycheck really believe that they can “sway public opinion” by having people like JoePA post nonsense like his on sites like this one, then they’re even more clueless and delusional than I thought. Maybe they’re not such a threat after all…
Having been a deputy in two states, let me say this. What he was doing was keeping himself “busy”, by not doing what he is paid to do. You do not patrol through a business parking lot looking for stolen cars, etc. Any patrol office worth his salt, can write a multitude of tickets for much worse things than this without much effort. I knew many officers that did this sort of thing, just so they would not get caught up in anything that involved any sort of danger to them. He was in a word just being lazy and keeping himself safe.
Thanks for your perspective, Keltic!
You’re new here, but if you scan through the threads, you’ll find that what most of us here object to is not going after the scumbags out there who hurt people, who damage property – we’re all for that. What we’re sick of is being hassled over things that are properly no one else’s business – everything from “buckle up” laws criminalizing various acts of free exchange between consenting adults.
Yep.
Keltic, we’re all for peace officers, the ones who do exactly as Eric describes in the first part of his response above (i.e., protecting the citizenry against people who do actual harm to persons and their property).
It’s “law enforcement officers” that we object to, the guys (and “gals”) who live to enforce petty fiat statutes, often with as much attitude and raw brutality as they can muster, statutes that serve only to extort money from the citizenry and give the State more unlawful power over them while doing nothing to protect them and their property.
The noteworthy statement of your reply is in your third sentence “Lets say he was cruising the parking lot looking for…”
REALLY?
He was cruising on PRIVATE PROPERTY (the aforementioned workplace business). The article didn’t say he had a warrant. So, he was going on a “fishing expedition,” you think?
Better go back and read your Constitution, and particularly the Bill of Rights, because the last I heard, all LEOs still take an Oath to the Constitution, and allegiance to it supersedes any to anyone or anything else, and “fishing expeditions” are not constitutional.
You’re a hero and real american Joe. Now please resume saving us from imaginary threats to our way of life.
JoePA,
I feel your pain. This site is a world where all forms authority are bad and everyone is guided by some mysterious internal moral compass which points toward non-aggression and “self ownership” (a morality without any religious foundation of course, because religion is simply a another form of bondage). All police and government are bad and criminals and thugs simply need tutorials in libertarian philosophy.
In this universe, aggression and violence, forces which have shaped (and cursed) human societies (and all life on earth) since the dawn of time, do not exist. This libertarian utopia is the new spin on the “peace and love” hippie culture of the sixties. Fun for a while, but ultimately chaotic. For those of us out in the
real world, some government is necessary, some cops aren’t assholes and concealed carry is the definition of “self ownership”.
TheShocker
“some cops aren’t assholes and concealed carry is the definition of “self ownership”. Joe, I’d agree with that but it doesn’t excuse WHAT they do for a living. I know several old farts like myself who carry concealed without a license. Why? They don’t want to ask permission they shouldn’t need to ask for or have that stigma, and stigma is definitely what it is if you get stopped simply on a traffic stop, of having to go through the song and dance and be treated like a criminal by those better than the rest of us. Keep licking that hand and maybe it will never swat you but there’s no guarantee.
Shocker,
“This site is a world where all forms authority are bad” –
If it is your position that some people have a right to exert violent control over others then yes, I’d say that such “authority” is very bad indeed.
I reject the idea any person or group has any right to exert violent control over anyone, unless it is in defense against aggression. Please give us examples of ethically-acceptable assertions of violent control over people who’ve done nothing to harm anyone, who are just trying to live their lives. . .
“guided by some mysterious internal moral compass which points toward non-aggression and “self ownership””
Mysterious? Really? These are difficult concepts for you to understand?
You trot out the tired old canard of “utopia” – when none such has ever been asserted.
No Libertarian I know of expects a perfect world, free of problems – including aggressive violence. However, none I know believes the current system of institutionalized, legalized aggressive violence is preferable – let alone perfect.
She should have told the cop she was going to have the car serviced or was going to a car show/cruise after work. Lots of people do this. They take their antique tagged car to work the day of the car show or whatever. I’ve never heard of any enforcement of it before. Furthermore her workplace could just have an ’employee only car show’ every time she drives it 🙂 Or she wanted to have a co-worker investigate some little problem it has…. the ways to out bureaucrat the cop here are endless. (assuming the VA law reads like the Illinois one)
Ages ago in the neighborhood I lived in there was a guy with a bug with antique plates and he daily drove it. He lived in the next high rise over given where it was normally parked. This placed him less than two blocks from the police station and along the primary path the cops to and from said station. He was still daily driving it when I moved away and it still had antique tags as I recall. But that’s the big city where cops actually do have better things to do. The city has the department of revenue for things like that and antique plates wasn’t on their radar I guess.